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Feeling so sorry for men today -- Vent

9K views 169 replies 56 participants last post by  holyhelianthus 
#1 ·
We took our girls to our local waterpark this afternoon, and dh went to use the restroom. He had to use the one and only stall in the men's room, and a little boy came in who apparently needed to use the stall, too, so he just stood outside the stall waiting for dh to come out (the stall door was closed, of course).

And of course the boy's mom was waiting outside, periodically calling in to ask her son if he was okay -- which dh understood perfectly. He and our older dd have gone on a couple of outings together where she needed to use a public restroom, but he felt she was too old for him to take her with him into the men's room so, like this mom, he'd waited outside the door --

And he'd also told her before she went in that if anyone tried to bother her, to yell for him really loud, and I'm sure if she'd taken a long time, he would've been calling in to ask if she was okay, just like this little boy's mom was doing ...

And the child was answering back that he was fine, so what the mother did when dh came out of the restroom is just inexcusable. Dh comes out (he was the only other person in the restroom, okay?), and this mom yells in there loudly, "Are you OKAY? Did somebody TOUCH you?!"

And the little boy called back "No" (as in no, nobody touched me), which of course was a good thing. But her loudly shouting this was so humiliating to my dh. There were all these people sitting in the picnic area outside the restroom, who looked up and stared at him when the mom said this.

It made him so uncomfortable he wanted to leave the park right away. Which was okay as it had started raining and we would've gone soon anyway.

Anyhow, I'm not trying to make a huge deal over what happened -- but this incident has really driven home to me how weird some people are about suspecting "all" men of being child molesters.

I mean, seriously, if you feel you can't trust your child to know whether or not he's okay in a public restroom -- I mean, if you actually think your child is mixed up enough that he'd be saying, "Yeah, mom, I'm okay," while some strange man was molesting him -- then, seriously, you need to still be taking him into the ladies' room with you. Right?

That's what I'd do if I couldn't trust my child. I mean, dh said the boy looked to be about 8, so I can imagine a boy that age would be embarrassed to have to go to the ladies room -- and of course I think most 8yo's are capable of "knowing" whether they're okay or not.

But since this mother apparently felt a need to get more specific and loudly ask if her son had been "touched" -- maybe he just can't be trusted in the restroom alone, right? Or if SHE'S the one with the prob, maybe she just needs to go with him into the men's room and humiliate herself, rather than humiliating her son by dragging him to the ladies room.

Whether she decides to humiliate herself or her son or both of them -- either of these scenarios would be better than sending him on his own to the men's room, and then humiliating some innocent man who just happened to need to use the restroom a few minutes before her son needed to.

I know, I need to let it go -- but I just thought I'd get the word out to any moms out there who may be paranoid like this mom: This is seriously NOT COOL. Men are going to have to use the restroom, they are people too. You need to find some way to protect your child, that both you and he are comfortable with. And not treat men like criminals for needing to use the restroom.

Okay, vent over. Thanks for listening!
 
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#27 ·
As a mother of a son and wife of a man, I am HORRIFIED that people not only look at my husband as a potential molest, but at my minor SON as a potential rapist/molester. I think this is a result of too much media reporting of incidents and a way out of control paranoia culture.

Bad things happen. There is very, very little we can do about that except to teach our children to know and feel ownership over their body and all it's parts. To teach them to trust their instincts and not to be afraid to say no to anyone, grown ups or not. That should be our focus, not demonizing men and boys. Viewing all men and boys as abusers is just...wrong and sexist. Thousands of children are molested by women, and do we worry about all the females in our children's lives?

That woman, whether consciously or not, was perpetuating the hysteria. If she needs therapy, she should get it, not just randomly accuse men walking out of the men's washroom of abusing her son (which she did by implication, IMO).
 
#28 ·
As far as my husband "deciding" to get embarrassed -- what if the child had impishly-decided to say "Yeah, that man was touching me," just to see how his obviously worked-up mom (and the men in their group) would react?

I'm not saying most children would do such a ghastly thing, and I definitely believe in taking a child seriously if they say they've been molested -- but to be in my dh's shoes, and realize how precariously-balanced your safety is, as well as your reputation and your ability to stay with and raise your own family --

I mean, supposing the kid WAS the sort to see what reaction he could get -- my dh could "decide" all he wanted that he wasn't going to be embarrassed since HE KNEW he hadn't done anything wrong, my husband could "decide" he was just going to go home with us and have a nice life with his wife and his two young daughters -- but would the legal authorities honor dh's "decision" that he wasn't going to let his life get turned upside down by some false accusation --

Or would they proceed with their investigation and go ahead and turn our lives upside down irregardless of our "decision" not to be affected by it?
 
#29 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by sunnymw View Post
I think it's sad that as a whole society we've gotten to this point. BIL won't even bathe his daughters because he's afraid of the stigma that would come along with it.

Are you sure it's not just an excuse not to bathe or change them? My DH used that excuse for years... then we had a son and he still tries to use it. We have been married long enough now that I tell him to suck it up and give them a bath/change diaper once in awhile.

It is sad however that we live in a world where that excuse to not help parent can be seen as legitimate.

To the OP, what that woman did was completely uncalled for. My son is only 2 but I would like to think that I wont have to fear him being molested in the bathroom while I am standing outside door yelling, "Are you OK?" and he answers yes.
 
#30 ·
I'm sorry for the OP's DH, and also for the little boy. Surely he was embarrassed by his mom's loud insinuations too -- possibly more so than the grownup man in question!

I'm also a little sorry for the mom who was so fearful that she was behaving in this wildly inappropriate way, although if her fears are that extreme I think maybe she should be seeing a counselor, if she isn't already doing that.
 
#31 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by aniT View Post
Are you sure it's not just an excuse not to bathe or change them? My DH used that excuse for years... then we had a son and he still tries to use it. We have been married long enough now that I tell him to suck it up and give them a bath/change diaper once in awhile.

It is sad however that we live in a world where that excuse to not help parent can be seen as legitimate.

This exact reason for not bathing young children by the father has been posted by more than a few members here on numerous threads so I highly doubt that they all are using it as an excuse to not help at home.
 
#32 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by TCMoulton View Post
This exact reason for not bathing young children by the father has been posted by more than a few members here on numerous threads so I highly doubt that they all are using it as an excuse to not help at home.
I am sorry, but in my opinion it is an excuse.
 
#33 ·
Quote:
Your husband decided to feel embarrassed, we own our feelings, and as Eleanor Roosevelt said, "no one can make you feel inferior without your consent".
Well with this mindset I suppose those hit with racism or sexism or ageism decided to feel beat down.

I get that we decide how to feel the way we feel but this is to an extent. I surely didn't decide to feel traumatized over my latest birth no matter how badly some try and use the above mindset to say that I did. The only thing this sort of stance does is excuse other's often times bigoted actions. No thanks.
 
#34 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by aniT View Post
I am sorry, but in my opinion it is an excuse.
Sure in some cases but can we ever really afford to be so general? I know my DH still bathes and changes all of our girls but we are both nervous as to how others will view it because we have known people who have questioned why we think that is appropriate.
 
#35 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chamomile Girl View Post
This thread really freaks me out. I don't want to raise my kids in a world with this level of fear and paranoia! Seriously...maybe I'm just horomonal because I'm way too pregnant, but I cannot see how this lady's actions were acceptable on any level.

1. Not all men are perverts and to see them as such is an illness.
2. Eight year olds should be able to take care of business on their own!

Yes this lady made a parenting choice, but rudeness based on paranoia should not become mainstream and accepted. Nor should seeing a molestor around every corner. There comes a point where "better safe than sorry" is simply not true.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mammal_mama View Post
I am very sorry to hear about all the children who've been assaulted in public restrooms. And of course I wasn't saying that I wouldn't be concerned if my child had been in there a long time. I'm sure that I'd be calling in to see if he was okay, just as this mom was.

But I guess in my case, by the time a child is old enough to use a public restroom on her own, she's old enough to know if she's okay or not. By this age a child should know about private body parts, and know it's not okay for someone to molest them.

So I guess I'd trust my child's "I'm okay" more than this mom trusted her son's.


I think family bathrooms are a great idea.
:

And we do need family bathrooms I totally agree.
 
#36 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by magstphil View Post
:

And we do need family bathrooms I totally agree.

Absolutely. After reading some of the more controversial threads here in the past I can completely understand why a dad would want to avoid going to the bathroom/bathing/changing a diaper on a young daughter. I feel for my husband getting strange looks while waiting for our daughters in the women's restroom - damned if he takes them with him into the men's room and damned if he stands near the door of the women's room waiting for them to finish.
 
#37 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by magstphil View Post
Sure in some cases but can we ever really afford to be so general? I know my DH still bathes and changes all of our girls but we are both nervous as to how others will view it because we have known people who have questioned why we think that is appropriate.
Yes we can. It's an excuse plain and simple. And becuase mom's let dad's use it as an excuse it has become more "legitimate." I mean really, who in their right mind is going to think a dad who is changing his infant or toddler child's diaper is only doing it to get some perverted thrill? Yet if this same dad let the child sit in their dirty diaper til mom got home, it would be seen as abuse.

I do think a line needs to be drawn at bathing. For both mom's and dad's. I am not sure what that age is. Six, seven? But I really think it is rediculous that people will use this as an excuse to keep dads/let let dads get out of helping with the basic care of their children. Especially those younger than 5.

ETA: Wait, aren't your children REALLY young? There is no excuse for anyone to question your husband helping care for his children. Sure if your daughters were 10 I could see if.. but if you are who I am thinking you are.. they are all 5 or younger.
 
#38 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by aniT View Post
I mean really, who in their right mind is going to think a dad who is changing his infant or toddler child's diaper is only doing it to get some perverted thrill?
Then obvoiusly you have missed a few volatile threads here because sadly there are most certainly people who believe exactly what you stated above.
 
#39 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by aniT View Post
Yes we can. It's an excuse plain and simple. And becuase mom's let dad's use it as an excuse it has become more "legitimate." I mean really, who in their right mind is going to think a dad who is changing his infant or toddler child's diaper is only doing it to get some perverted thrill? Yet if this same dad let the child sit in their dirty diaper til mom got home, it would be seen as abuse.

I do think a line needs to be drawn at bathing. For both mom's and dad's. I am not sure what that age is. Six, seven? But I really think it is rediculous that people will use this as an excuse to keep dads/let let dads get out of helping with the basic care of their children. Especially those younger than 5.

ETA: Wait, aren't your children REALLY young? There is no excuse for anyone to question your husband helping care for his children. Sure if your daughters were 10 I could see if.. but if you are who I am thinking you are.. they are all 5 or younger.
So you are saying it's always an excuse no exception? Like I said I think we can't generalize things that easily. And yes people have and do view the changing of a diaper as a sex thrill for men. Have you ever seen those diaper fetish sites? :puke These days there are more than a few people who see crap like that and then think men=diaper fetishist or some such thing.

As I said in my PP people have questioned whether or not it was appropriate for my DH to bathe with, bathe, or change our daughters. It's not really all that uncommon nowadays.

ETA- I just saw your ETA
Tell me about it! But yeah they have. Not in a freak out "he is molesting your kids!" way but in a "do you really think that is appropriate?" way.
 
#40 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by TCMoulton View Post
Then obvoiusly you have missed a few volatile threads here because sadly there are most certainly people who believe exactly what you stated above.
I guess I have missed them. And you know what? That is their problem not mine or my husbands. It is my husbands job to help care for his children's needs. If that includes bathing a child covered in mud or changing a poopy diaper so be it. I am not going to live my life being scared of other peoples rediculous and perverted opinions. Furthermore I am not going to make more work for myself by trying to do everything at once because someone else might unrealistically feel it is inappropriate for Dad to do his part.

If we don't let Dad's use this as an excuse not to care for their children, then people would see how normal it is and shut their mouths. But because it is allowed to be used as an excuse, it justifies the tongue waggers to talk. I mean he wouldn't be "afraid" if he wasn't doing anything wrong. Ya know?
 
#41 ·
Don't you think that a situation where people questioned the appropriateness of male care would be an opportunity to educate those people? I would want to let them know that its their view of the situation that is inappropriate and sick...not the situation itself. Why would you change family behavior because of someone else's fear or disapproval?
 
#42 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by magstphil View Post
So you are saying it's always an excuse no exception? Like I said I think we can't generalize things that easily. And yes people have and do view the changing of a diaper as a sex thrill for men. Have you ever seen those diaper fetish sites? :puke These days there are more than a few people who see crap like that and then think men=diaper fetishist or some such thing.

As I said in my PP people have questioned whether or not it was appropriate for my DH to bathe with, bathe, or change our daughters. It's not really all that uncommon nowadays.

ETA- I just saw your ETA
Tell me about it! But yeah they have. Not in a freak out "he is molesting your kids!" way but in a "do you really think that is appropriate?" way.
Seriously, I have never run into other people questioning DH helping with the kids. Just DH saying that if he does help he will get accused of molesting them. Nope..sorry, try again.

Seriously, I am sick of everyone in society treating everyone else like they are up to no good. The only way to stop it is to stand up and not allow them to do so. Just becuase other people question the appropriateness of a dad bathing his young girls doesn't mean it is not appropriate. It doesn't mean he will get arrested or for changing his child's diaper either. It is just people with nothing better to do going on at the mouth. The only way to stop it is to stand up and NOT LET THEM dictate how you care for your children. Just ignore them, they aren't anything to you.

Now my DH's mom used to barge in the bathroom to "wash his hair" until he was 14. This I believe was abuse and inappropriate. DH didn't want her in there. But you know.. no one questioned this. Why do we question a Dad caring for a very young daughter? This society is insane.
 
#43 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by chamomile girl View Post
don't you think that a situation where people questioned the appropriateness of male care would be an opportunity to educate those people? I would want to let them know that its their view of the situation that is inappropriate and sick...not the situation itself. Why would you change family behavior because of someone else's fear or disapproval?
exactly!
 
#44 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by aniT View Post
I guess I have missed them. And you know what? That is their problem not mine or my husbands. It is my husbands job to help care for his children's needs. If that includes bathing a child covered in mud or changing a poopy diaper so be it. I am not going to live my life being scared of other peoples rediculous and perverted opinions. Furthermore I am not going to make more work for myself by trying to do everything at once because someone else might unrealistically feel it is inappropriate for Dad to do his part.

If we don't let Dad's use this as an excuse not to care for their children, then people would see how normal it is and shut their mouths. But because it is allowed to be used as an excuse, it justifies the tongue waggers to talk. I mean he wouldn't be "afraid" if he wasn't doing anything wrong. Ya know?
I do agree with this. My husband and I are actually talking about this right now and yeah he feels skiddish and worries what others will think if say our 5 year old goes up to them and says "my daddy gave me a bath today" but he still does it because, well, they're his kids. Still, I can fully understand that fear and deciding not to even go there. It's one thing to say we should all stand up but in actual practice it can mean some really bad things like our husbands being accused of things that are going to follow them for the rest of their lives.

Beyond that another fear is that our kids will grow up and one day be told "it was wrong of your father to bathe you/change you/etc" and our own children might feel they need to question their relationship w/their father as the idea was put into their head. I have seen this happen once with a friend when we were kids and she was just so confused by the whole thing. Looking back I can't imagine what she was feeling (I have no father in my life. Never have).

OT- But does this thread scream "Happy Father's Day!" or what
 
#45 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chamomile Girl View Post
Don't you think that a situation where people questioned the appropriateness of male care would be an opportunity to educate those people? I would want to let them know that its their view of the situation that is inappropriate and sick...not the situation itself. Why would you change family behavior because of someone else's fear or disapproval?
I kind of answered this in the above without realizing it was asked but yes I do agree. Still I see where there is a real fear there and I can understand people just not wanting to risk it. I guess this is just another "As for me and my house..." thing. We don't let it change how we treat our girlies.
 
#46 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chamomile Girl View Post
Don't you think that a situation where people questioned the appropriateness of male care would be an opportunity to educate those people? I would want to let them know that its their view of the situation that is inappropriate and sick...not the situation itself. Why would you change family behavior because of someone else's fear or disapproval?
I agree. My husband personally has not changed his behavior with our girls because of the attitudes of others but, having read some unbelievable threads here, it is apparent to me that there are people who do not want to be educated beyond what they believe.
 
#47 ·
Somehow I missed this post...

Quote:

Originally Posted by aniT View Post
Seriously, I am sick of everyone in society treating everyone else like they are up to no good. The only way to stop it is to stand up and not allow them to do so. Just becuase other people question the appropriateness of a dad bathing his young girls doesn't mean it is not appropriate. It doesn't mean he will get arrested or for changing his child's diaper either. It is just people with nothing better to do going on at the mouth. The only way to stop it is to stand up and NOT LET THEM dictate how you care for your children. Just ignore them, they aren't anything to you.


Quote:
Now my DH's mom used to barge in the bathroom to "wash his hair" until he was 14. This I believe was abuse and inappropriate. DH didn't want her in there. But you know.. no one questioned this.
Two thoughts on this- it's another thing I can't stand about our society (and it was illustrated in the OP) the coddling of our older kids and teens. It does such a disservice to them, IMO, and also that when a mom does it it's just fine but when a dad does it he's overbearing and abusive- maybe even sexually so.

Quote:
Why do we question a Dad caring for a very young daughter? This society is insane.
Pretty much!

We have all girls so without DH's help I'd be pretty SOL.
 
#49 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by magstphil View Post
We have all girls so without DH's help I'd be pretty SOL.
We had three girls before we had a boy so I know how you feel. Now my oldest is not DH's and she was four when we got married, so he never participated in any intimate care with her. Our first daughter together he tried to pull the "I'll get accused of molesting her" card and I let him get away with it for awhile. But you know what? Their relationship suffered and when she was two I had to step in and help him build one. So I didn't let him use that excuse with the next one and they have had a much closer relationship from the start, as he has with my son. Not to say dh and my 10 year old don't have a good relationship now.. but it was harder to build at 2 than it would have been from the start.
 
#50 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by aniT View Post
We had three girls before we had a boy so I know how you feel. Now my oldest is not DH's and she was four when we got married, so he never participated in any intimate care with her. Our first daughter together he tried to pull the "I'll get accused of molesting her" card and I let him get away with it for awhile. But you know what? Their relationship suffered and when she was two I had to step in and help him build one. So I didn't let him use that excuse with the next one and they have had a much closer relationship from the start, as he has with my son. Not to say dh and my 10 year old don't have a good relationship now.. but it was harder to build at 2 than it would have been from the start.
That's interesting about their relationship. I don't doubt it!

Our deal has been from day 1 of DD1's life that when he is home he changes every diaper and he also gives the baths (this has become more of a team effort with 3 girls but he still bathes them and I dress them as he passes them to me). We figured it'd be his time with them and it has been ever since. It's such a help to me especially when I am preggers and/or breastfeeding.
 
#51 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by aniT View Post
I am sorry, but in my opinion it is an excuse.
I have read much of this thread and I think this is very over generalized. My DH works 60 hrs a week. He also does car and yard maintenance. He will come home and clean with the house when there is a lot to be done, cook dinner/brunches more than once a week, take the kids to appt with him, he will grocery shop, and put younger kids to bed if possible. He will also watch the kids all day when I have multiple appts. He does change diapers at MY insistance. But, he will NOT bathe or shower with a son, when I thought it would be convenient.

One time he changed our oldest who was 2yo and diarhea, and walked out the mall bathroom to come get the wipes, and I FLIPPED. He doesn't change diapers in the restroom anymore, but that is my fault. He won't bathe little girls (and we have many). There are other things he won't do for self protection. I know my Dh is safe with my kids, and safe with any kids, but this is society that we live in, and he doesn't want anyone to think that he is doing anything questionable.

I consider myself the luckiest wife in the world to have a DH that is a workaholic, but yet it works in my favor now, unlike before. He works that long out of necessity, but is much more involved with the children now that we have so many. But, I do see things that he won't do because he doesn't want anyone to be suspicious of him. Kymberli
 
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