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We don't accept children - Page 6

post #101 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by mammal_mama View Post
So maybe this is why Americans seem to feel such a need for child-free "oases" ... I'd be interested to hear more thoughts on this subject from people of the various European cultures.

>snip>
So, maybe this is less of an issue in many European cultures? I'm American, so maybe it's a little odd that I don't fret about the possibility of one of our children waking up and "catching" us, or of them seeing dogs or cats mating or giving birth (dd1 has seen me giving birth), or hearing something in a conversation, or a radio or tv-show, that raises questions in their minds. I feel totally comfortable about discussing anything my children are wondering about ...

And of course I'm not saying that we watch explicit shows or expose our children to porn ... we would never do anything like that. I'm just saying that I'm not alarmed at our children knowing about sex as a normal part of life.
A lot of cultures are less child-centric/intensive. When I lived in Spain, four and five year olds were out playing with their friends with no parental/adult supervision. For, literally, hours at a time. And that was fine. Everyone was happy and safe. My 4 year old "brother" there (I was an exchange student 3 times) would hang out with us (teens of 13-16), at night, in the plaza (small town). My 9 year old "brother" would walk a mile home from school, or hang out with his friends in the center of town in a suburb of Madrid. And, that was accepted and normal. A PP wrote about how babies are outside in their strollers for a bit in some countries, not hovered over every moment of their lives. Perhaps the ability to step back a bit in every day life reduces a need to step back to the extreme of "child-free"
post #102 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jessy1019 View Post
That's ridiculous. I agree, I would not frequent a place that wouldn't allow my kids.

Businesses should set standards for behavior, not age restrictions. I can certainly see throwing a guest out who was disturbing the other patrons, no matter what the guest's age . . . but saying "no kids," assumes that all kids are the same (and awful).
No it isn't. Some businesses aren't kid friendly. Take for example, the bank. What five year old enjoys going to the bank? And like it or not, there are customers who specifically seek out kid-free places. And some businesses make a living catering to that. That's not child-hating. I would not want to take my child to a smokey bar where I am drinking, throwing darts, and gambling. And hitting on that guy who won't look so good in the morning. I wouldn't want to have other kids around either.
post #103 of 288
No kids at the bank? Wha?? It's not about whether the child gets a huge kick out of the bank, but about the fact that people with children have to live our lives. I take my kids to the bank all the time, I'm not about to get childcare so I can go to the bank!
post #104 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheal View Post
You think? That was an extremely crude thing to post.
no cruder than hearing that children are not accepted, IMO.

to the one who originally said it...i was thinking the same thing. in fact, a friend of mine (white female) was planning her wedding at a local b&b. everything was set, all she had left to do was bring her fiance (AA male) to see the place. soon as he walked in, they were "magically" overbooked for that weekend. it was freaking february!!! who is overbooked for weddings in the winter? it was so obviously bc he was black. :
post #105 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by mammal_mama View Post
More likely would be someone calling the police because a baby was left on the sidewalk in a stroller.

And her parenting getting judged, and people looking at/assessing her baby, for real.
That exact scenario happened in NYC a bunch of years back. A Danish couple left their child in a stroller outside a cafe, and it became an international incident. On the one hand, they were doing what was customary in their homeland. On the other hand, how dumb do you have to be not to have figured out (by the lack of ANY other strollers with kids sitting outside ANY store or restaurant ANYWHERE in NYC!) that it was not a cultural norm here, and thus a bad idea?

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpag...56C0A961958260
post #106 of 288
This thread is crazy long and I don't have time to read through it all.

Have you thought about booking through AFVC? The Armed Forces Vacation Club? You can find great deals and wonderful places to stay. We got a really nice place in San Diego last year that had a full kitchen for $50/night.
post #107 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by mammal_mama View Post
I haven't studied up on this -- but do you think there are differences in American and European cultures, that cause Americans to feel that phrases like "romantic getaway" and "child-friendly establishment" can't be uttered in the same sentence -- that you can't have one without excluding the other?

I mean, I know that lots of my fellow-Americans would find it weird that dh and I could make love in the same bed where our little ones are sleeping -- and I sometimes read/hear moms talking about how they need to "get out of mother-mode" before they can "move into wife/lover-mode." That's never made sense to me, because I feel like it's all part of one seamless whole.

So maybe this is why Americans seem to feel such a need for child-free "oases" ... I'd be interested to hear more thoughts on this subject from people of the various European cultures.

When one previous poster mentioned the rooms in a B&B not being sound-proof, and then someone else added that the sounds of children wouldn't likely be any more disturbing than the sounds of couples making love -- it occurred to me that lots of American parents would be upset at their children hearing and asking about such sounds, and also that lots of American couples would feel somewhat restrained in their lovemaking if they knew there were children in the next room.

So, maybe this is less of an issue in many European cultures? I'm American, so maybe it's a little odd that I don't fret about the possibility of one of our children waking up and "catching" us, or of them seeing dogs or cats mating or giving birth (dd1 has seen me giving birth), or hearing something in a conversation, or a radio or tv-show, that raises questions in their minds. I feel totally comfortable about discussing anything my children are wondering about ...

And of course I'm not saying that we watch explicit shows or expose our children to porn ... we would never do anything like that. I'm just saying that I'm not alarmed at our children knowing about sex as a normal part of life.
I have no trouble with being a parent and a lover. But, and I don't think I'm the only one... There are times when I would like to be able to do the dee when ever the urge strikes without having to worry that I'll have to be called away for parent duty in the middle, as often happens when you are playing both roles.

We go on vacation with DD and it's ment to be a family thing. We do things as a family. Even though theres 'adult' time too. But when I go away with just DH, we can choose to stay in bed all day. DD wouldn't be happy having to entertain herself the whole day just because DH and I want to spend time alone. And it's just more relaxing when someone elses kids aren't running aroud.
post #108 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by kmeyrick View Post
No it isn't. Some businesses aren't kid friendly. Take for example, the bank. What five year old enjoys going to the bank?
My three year old enjoys going to the bank. She asks me to go all the time. They have fresh baked cookies every day and all the employees dote on her.
post #109 of 288
[QUOTE=TinkerBelle;12831978]No one said that the mere sight of a child would wreck everything. Come on.
QUOTE]

Maybe not in those words but yes, I think that is what some of the posts are saying.

But that is not what I was saying in my post. I was not quoting anybody, just summing up my perception of an attitude that seems to be prevailing in this thread.

I feel like perhaps I have offended and that has not been my intention.
post #110 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by kmeyrick View Post
No it isn't. Some businesses aren't kid friendly. Take for example, the bank. What five year old enjoys going to the bank?
What adult LIKES going to the bank? You go because you have business you need to take care of . . . and I certainly am not teaching my kids that they only have to leave the house when they are doing something that sounds fun to them. Doing errands is a part of life, we can't frolic around and have a blast all day, and I want my kids to know how to behave wherever we go -- something they can't learn if they don't ever go anywhere.

A vacation does not at all compare to a boring errand, anyway. There are plenty of kids who would be just fine at -- and even enjoy -- a B&B.

People are welcome to give their money to places that don't accept kids, if that's what they want to do. It's not something *I* will do -- the only exception being if the business has a legal obligation not to allow kids (I disagree with anyone but parents deciding where their own children are allowed to be, but I don't expect businesses to break the law in those cases).
post #111 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by stickywicket67 View Post
op-i've always thought it would be nice to have a real B&B where i live. one where there is a big main room with books and puzzles and musical instruments and a fireplace and bikes to take to the beach and kids are welcome and it's a reasonably priced family friendly alternative to a boring hotel. hmmmm. maybe in my next career...
I know of such a place on Orcas Island, in WA. It is an awesome B&B, and totally ACCEPTS kids! We heard them turning a couple away who had come to check the place out because they weren't okay with the fact that we were there with our two-year-old. The proprietors WANT kids there. They are one of only two places on the island that I know of that accept children, and our favorite!

They also run a lavender farm.
post #112 of 288
The bank example may not be the best, kmeyrick.

What it boils down to is that a business owner has a right to dictate their business as they see fit when it comes to this type of business. A guest house/B&B is an extension of their home. If they do not want children in their home, then so be it. You may not like it, and that is fine, as you do not need to give them your business. Others do like it, and will. End of story.

The great thing is that there are choices and therefore...everyone can have what they want.
post #113 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by karina5 View Post
The bank example may not be the best, kmeyrick.

What it boils down to is that a business owner has a right to dictate their business as they see fit when it comes to this type of business. A guest house/B&B is an extension of their home. If they do not want children in their home, then so be it. You may not like it, and that is fine, as you do not need to give them your business. Others do like it, and will. End of story.

The great thing is that there are choices and therefore...everyone can have what they want.
I wonder about this, like where is the human rights line drawn? I personally don't object to childfree b&b's, but say a childfree bank? Grocery store? Apartment building?

I would hope there are only a few exceptions where age discrimination is allowed, and that something like a store would not be one of them.
post #114 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by thismama View Post
I wonder about this, like where is the human rights line drawn? I personally don't object to childfree b&b's, but say a childfree bank? Grocery store? Apartment building?

I would hope there are only a few exceptions where age discrimination is allowed, and that something like a store would not be one of them.
This is not a human rights issue. It's a business issue. If someone doesn't like the business policies then they can take their business someplace else. It's no different than a women-only gym or a barber shop.
post #115 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShwarmaQueen View Post
This is not a human rights issue. It's a business issue. If someone doesn't like the business policies then they can take their business someplace else. It's no different than a women-only gym or a barber shop.
Well as I have just found out re: breastfeeding, businesses do NOT have rights to make rules about who may enter their premises on the basis of gender, race, etc. (women only gyms etc seems an exception to this, I don't know the details but you can't turn a woman away from say a bank because of her gender). I see age discrimination as very similar to these issues, and although it is not covered directly I don't think, 'family status' is, at least where I live. I would certainly hope it is illegal for banks etc to refuse entry to children. What if they started refusing entry to seniors? Seniors are slow moving, they like to chat etc. I could see similar justification for old people as young.
post #116 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by thismama View Post
I wonder about this, like where is the human rights line drawn? I personally don't object to childfree b&b's, but say a childfree bank? Grocery store? Apartment building?

I would hope there are only a few exceptions where age discrimination is allowed, and that something like a store would not be one of them.
As far as the apartment building goes, unless it's senior housing, then children cannot be excluded, at least in the US anyway, as per the fair housing act.
post #117 of 288
If it is a policy matter, they should be cognizant of the fact that the website is going to be viewed by a general client base and word their terms a tad more sensitively. People have differing expectations from their vacation and I don't see a problem with businesses catering to those specific requirements.
post #118 of 288
Do you think that anyone should be allowed to play in the tunnels and other equipment at Chuck E. Cheese? A 200-lb., 20yo guy should be allowed to play in the structure with the LO's?

Just curious.
post #119 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2xy View Post
Do you think that anyone should be allowed to play in the tunnels and other equipment at Chuck E. Cheese? A 200-lb., 20yo guy should be allowed to play in the structure with the LO's?

Just curious.
Going back to my original point, as long as they are behaving appropriately, why not? I think it's far more rational to set standards for people's behavior than it is to exclude people based on age.
post #120 of 288
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jessy1019 View Post
I think it's far more rational to set standards for people's behavior than it is to exclude people based on age.
So if the rules said "Absolutely no yelling, whining, screaming, tantrums, or misbehavior will be tolerated or the guests will be forced to leave the premesis due to the tranquil nature of our business" Would that be better than just saying "No kids allowed"?
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