getting past the regret...

[sagemomma]

if there is one day in the lives of my children i could take back and do over it would be the day i let them be circumsized. with my first son i was young and uninformed, i knew everything else about babies, but had never really stopped to think about what his circumsision really meant. with my second it was really my husband pushing to have it done , i figured well he has a penis i guess he'd know better than i do what to do with it....(minds out of the gutter ladies). anywho i have thought about restoration but i don't think it's appropriate for a 5 and 2 year old. i really wish i had found you wise ladies sooner, perhaps it could have saved my babies the pain and mutilation i put them through.
i know i will never do it again, but i don't know hwo to move past the guilt of my first 2 boys being circ'd.
any advice from anyone who's been there?

[Night_Nurse]

I couldn't read and not respond. I can't relate to your experience but the best advice I can give is just love your boys and go on from there. Guilt won't change anything you did in the past and it might very well prevent you from growing and having happy experiences with your boys. You can explain to the boys when they are older how you thought circ was in their best interest but how you later learned it wasn't necessary and that you regret it. If they have questions, you can elaborate. If they don't have questions, you've at least planted a seed and hopefully they'll keep their sons intact.
You can help educate other mamas by telling your story, not only online but also in real life. The more we talk about it, the less taboo it becomes and the more people will realize they don't have to circumcise their boys (and that leaving them intact is beneficial).

We all make parenting decisions we later regret. The best thing to do, IMO, is learn from them and move on. When we know better we do better. And you've already said you won't circ a future son. It would certainly be appropriate, IMO, to talk to your boys about restoration when they are older. Maybe if nothing else then to just let them know it's an option. But I think 2 & 5 is a bit young.

[amandaleigh37]

I know exactly how you feel... My son is 2yo and it's my biggest regret. I found MDC briefly during my pregnancy, but often wonder what might have been different if I had stumbled on this forum then. I don't know if the guilt will ever go away, but I am pregnant now with #2 and if it's a boy, he will be left intact. I hope that maybe I can at least reach the people in my family & do something positive to break this cycle...

to you mama, I know how hard it is. There are a lot of us here who have regrets...

[bscal]

to you Sagemomma.

I too made the unwise decision to circ my son. He'll be 2 in March and I deeply regret that I let this happen. My DH was quite adamant that it be done and quite frankly I just didn't research it like I should have. Any future sons will be left intact. Really, there is nothing you can do about it now, it's done. Try your best to move on and educate others with your story... I know I have told my story to expectant moms.

I just wanted to post to give you support.

Beth

[2lilsweetfoxes]

Originally Posted by bscal

: My DH was quite adamant that it be done and quite frankly I just didn't research it like I should have.
Beth

Not to threadjack too much, but that statement has captured something I'd been wondering about: do a lot of women or men not research circ because their partner is so adamant that it be done, so they really don't want to know? When my husband was insisting that our son get circed, I stopped researching because the more I found out, the more I was against the whole idea. I'd rather have remained ignorant and believed it was a useful, good thing. I still had not made up my mind when it came time to discharge him from the hospital and DH was deployed. (it was never done and I suppose had it been *that* important to DH, he could have had it done while I was deployed a year ago).

[perspective]

Originally Posted by sagemomma

if there is one day in the lives of my children i could take back and do over it would be the day i let them be circumsized. with my first son i was young and uninformed, i knew everything else about babies, but had never really stopped to think about what his circumsision really meant. with my second it was really my husband pushing to have it done , i figured well he has a penis i guess he'd know better than i do what to do with it....(minds out of the gutter ladies). anywho i have thought about restoration but i don't think it's appropriate for a 5 and 2 year old. i really wish i had found you wise ladies sooner, perhaps it could have saved my babies the pain and mutilation i put them through.
i know i will never do it again, but i don't know hwo to move past the guilt of my first 2 boys being circ'd.
any advice from anyone who's been there?

I dont know if its something you ever fully get over the feelings of guilt you have. But thats common in life, stuff that happens that cannot be taken back is especially hard to move on from.

The key here is to take those feelings and do something with them. First, make sure you teach your sons a good sense of body image. Make sure they grow up confident in themselves, and that only THEY have control over their own body.

Ultimately, if they ever come back to you with their own frustrations for being circumcised, if they grew up seeing how you dealt with similar kinds of feelings, you can set them up with a guide to improving themselves emotionally.

Also go out there and be as active on this issue as you can, silence is the ultimate enemy for baby boys. If parents do not hear differently from other parents, they are bound to commit the same mistakes. Personally I see this as a responsibility for every parent who regrets circing their children.

Things can never be fully undone, but they can get better.

[Ron_Low]

Hi,
As an adult who was cut in infancy, I can tell you how I think about my mom letting this happen (don't get me started about my dad, intact to this day).

I know she loves me and would never have done anything deliberately to harm me or make me sad. She has expressed her regret and offered to help me in my work helping other cut men. I can't ask much more than that. She was part of a culture that trusted elders and medical authorities. What do I expect of her? Omniscience? She's human.

My first child was born in '92 and WHO KNOWS what might have happened if it had been a boy? I was a naturalist and had been exposed to intactivism through magazines and radio, but I still thought the foreskin was just extra and that the main harm from circumcision was the immediate risk from the procedure itself. I might have gotten talked into it. I might have even dug in my heels and had another child cut out of denial of the possibility that I could do something harmful. We're just human.

There's a lot to love about any kind of penis. Most cut guys seriously don't care that they were cut (until they find out what they're missing).

If your loved one has a severe dysfunction like hideous scarring, unworkable tightness, or whatever, you DO owe him some follow-up to make sure you protect his rights to sue and stuff. Get your records together including copies of anything you signed. Chances are it falls far short of the duty for informed consent. Find out the time limits for mal-practice suits in your jurisdiction. Record the names and ID #s of practitioners and payors.

Just the fact that a healthy normal body part was amputated with no diagnosis of defect or pathology seems to me to make a slam-dunk case, but what do I know.

[Ron_Low]

Originally Posted by Night_Nurse

It would certainly be appropriate, IMO, to talk to your boys about restoration when they are older. Maybe if nothing else then to just let them know it's an option. But I think 2 & 5 is a bit young.

My youngest restoring clients are 8. If anyone with younger boys want to try a retaining cone or something, I'd be happy to comp them some gear.

[Night_Nurse]

Originally Posted by Ron_Low

My youngest restoring clients are 8.

Oh wow! I had no idea.

[barefootpoetry]

When you know better, you do better, mama. If it ever comes up when your DSs are older, you can tell them that at the time you thought it was the best thing to do, but you learned later on that it wasn't, and that you're sorry. And, restoration is of course an option (although it can never completely put back what was taken).

[anony]

Originally Posted by Night_Nurse

Oh wow! I had no idea.

While I don't really see how you can turn someone's request down if they are 8, I am not sure someone who is 8 is actually making that decision. If they are it seems a little mature. I know personally that the psychological side of things didn't really become all too important until puberty. That would be an age where I imagine being cut could be really depressing if you know what was done and it hurts your sexuality. But before you become fully sexually aware, it just seems kind of odd to restore.

[Fi.]

Originally Posted by anony

While I don't really see how you can turn someone's request down if they are 8, I am not sure someone who is 8 is actually making that decision. If they are it seems a little mature. I know personally that the psychological side of things didn't really become all too important until puberty. That would be an age where I imagine being cut could be really depressing if you know what was done and it hurts your sexuality. But before you become fully sexually aware, it just seems kind of odd to restore.

Not to be *TOO* TMI here but I knew the mechanics of sex and had sexual urges at 8. I was not abused or molested either. And to be fair, I was a B cup at 9 I think I started masturbating shortly before I turned 10. Got my period around 12. And this was back when breasts at 9 and period at 12 were "extremely early".

i figured well he has a penis i guess he'd know better than i do what to do with it....(minds out of the gutter ladies).

Hi, think a little more of us please. Thanks.

[Yulia_R]

Originally Posted by anony

While I don't really see how you can turn someone's request down if they are 8, I am not sure someone who is 8 is actually making that decision. If they are it seems a little mature. I know personally that the psychological side of things didn't really become all too important until puberty. That would be an age where I imagine being cut could be really depressing if you know what was done and it hurts your sexuality. But before you become fully sexually aware, it just seems kind of odd to restore.

Did you start masturbating after puberty???! I personally has been doing it for as long as I remember myself (which is 2+ yo). Therefore, if a boy has painful erections due to circ, I can totally see him wanting to change that.

[anony]

Originally Posted by Yulia_R

Did you start masturbating after puberty???! I personally has been doing it for as long as I remember myself (which is 2+ yo). Therefore, if a boy has painful erections due to circ, I can totally see him wanting to change that.

Well all I'm wondering is does an 8 yr old have the maturity to understand the commitment it takes to restore? It seems very mature and dedicated if one does. I could see how an 8 yr old might feel circ is harmful based on what you described. As for masturbation, boys discover it at differing ages.

As far as just fiddling around, they all do it from birth of course. It's different than it is for girls because a boy would have to be erect first in order to make it happen. Plus, retraction has to happen first, if they're intact (I recall that I could fully retract my foreskin when I was 6). And obviously, until puberty, masturbation would not result in a true ejaculation (though orgasms aren't impossible). And I only finally figured out what real masturbation was when I was 12. So I tried it then.

Anyway, it's hard to say what an 8 yr old who was cut feels like, since I'm an intact guy who's just interested in medical stuff and abhors circumcision 100% even if I have never experienced it or been told in person the horror stories of its effects. Believe me, reading it up on the internet gives one reason enough to hate it. It just offends and disturbs me that some cultures can torture newborn boys like that as i the foreskin is useless, but restoration is certainly a nice option to have out there.

[Ron_Low]

Originally Posted by anony

While I don't really see how you can turn someone's request down if they are 8, I am not sure someone who is 8 is actually making that decision.

Of course the MOMS contacted me to help their 8 year-olds start restoring.

People can pretend to be anybody onlilne, but if someone identifies as under 18 I always urge them to discuss the situation with an adult they trust, and if they are intent on pursuing it with me I will offer them a retaining cone, which is something that doesn't actively grow new skin. It's just a means to keep the existing skin rolled forward over the glans 24/7. Most restorers want to keep it private, and the cone is inconspicuous even in a student lifestyle - worn comfortably and discreetly in the briefs, it removes instantly for urination.

The other thing is that when dealing directly with minors I insist that they NEVER reveal their real contact info or address to anyone online. I instruct them to have anything mailed care of a relative or friend if they don't feel they can involve their parents.

It may seem creepy to help kids without their parents' knowledge, but these are kids whose parents had a healthy normal body part amputated from their bodies. I have no qualms about intervening on their behalf.

[GoodMomma]

I feel your pain. My son is circ'ed because I was extremely ignorant about the topic. We never gave it a second thought, never looked into it, nothing. So when I was pregnant with #2, I was praying for a boy so I can "fix" my mistake. I have deep regret about circ'ing and not breastfeeding my son. So I fixed the whole not breastfeeding thing by nursing my daughter, so I feel better about that regret. So one day I'm hoping we have another boy so I can leave him intact. It's sad to say but I was very upset when we found out she was a girl. I truly didn't believe it until she was born, lol. But oh well....anyway, I do think the feelings of regret get easier when you make better choices. Other then that I have nothing to offer other then go have another baby and pray for a boy, lol.

[Yulia_R]

Originally Posted by GoodMomma

I feel your pain. My son is circ'ed because I was extremely ignorant about the topic. We never gave it a second thought, never looked into it, nothing. So when I was pregnant with #2, I was praying for a boy so I can "fix" my mistake. I have deep regret about circ'ing and not breastfeeding my son. So I fixed the whole not breastfeeding thing by nursing my daughter, so I feel better about that regret. So one day I'm hoping we have another boy so I can leave him intact. It's sad to say but I was very upset when we found out she was a girl. I truly didn't believe it until she was born, lol. But oh well....anyway, I do think the feelings of regret get easier when you make better choices. Other then that I have nothing to offer other then go have another baby and pray for a boy, lol.

I'm sorry, I wholeheartly don't want to make anyone feel bad, but I just SO don't get the whole "getting it right with the next child "fixing" the mistake with the existing one" and“go make another baby just to do it right” logic. Really, how can anyone feel this way or advise something like that?? I personally deeply regret vaccinating my son before I knew better; my daughter is completely unvaccinated. And while I'm very happy for her and for the fact that I did know better with her, this by no mean "fixing" the fact that I let my son to be injected with poison nine times...

[nummies]

I have found that some of the pain of regret is lessened when sharing your story with others. Make your voice heard. Talk to anyone that you can.

It never goes away. I don't think there is a day that goes by that I don't think of it.

[bscal]

Originally Posted by 2lilsweetfoxes

Not to threadjack too much, but that statement has captured something I'd been wondering about: do a lot of women or men not research circ because their partner is so adamant that it be done, so they really don't want to know? When my husband was insisting that our son get circed, I stopped researching because the more I found out, the more I was against the whole idea. I'd rather have remained ignorant and believed it was a useful, good thing. I still had not made up my mind when it came time to discharge him from the hospital and DH was deployed. (it was never done and I suppose had it been *that* important to DH, he could have had it done while I was deployed a year ago).

2lilsweetfoxes - Not to go too much in detail... but my DH is Italian and Catholic. For him this decision was a cultural and religious one that his extended family has always done. I didn't really want to argue with DH...

Beth

[anony]

Originally Posted by bscal

2lilsweetfoxes - Not to go too much in detail... but my DH is Italian and Catholic. For him this decision was a cultural and religious one that his extended family has always done. I didn't really want to argue with DH...

Beth

That definitely must have been hard but being Italian and Catholic are actually not cultural or religious pre-requisites for circ'ing at all. It was simply an American custom he wanted to pass on, when in fact Italians (at least the ones in Italy) don't practice it while the Catholic church frowns upon circumcision. If only some of the devout Catholics in America knew how their religion viewed circumcision!