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can't resell kids items? - Page 5

post #81 of 132
Originally Posted by stickywicket67 View Post
i run a small family owned shop. i had a customer ask me if a Christmas ornament had lead in it. a fragile glass Christmas ornament. not intended for children. shouldn't she have been worried about a child cutting themselves on the thing before she worried about a child eating it?
so frustratingly stupid.

the lead paint/toy brouhaha is so minor compared to what our children are supposed to have injected into their bodies at every well baby visit. (eyes rolling to the very back of my head.) sorry i had to go there.
The problem is though, that there are plenty of things not INTENDED for children that can still leave lead in their environment (holidays just passed- fake trees and Christmas lights anyone?). A child hanging a glass ornament can end up with lead dust on their hands, and yes, a child can be old enough to help hang a fragile ornament, and young enough to do a half assed job of hand washing after they are done helping, but before putting their hands in their mouth, thus the parent's concern. And some parents don't even KNOW the kids are at risk from Christmas ornaments or lights, or whatever. Thus the problem.

And I am right with you on the other issue, but that's for another thread.

I honestly don't know what the solution is. Because the individual components of items kids come in contact with can be too highly contaminated, thus making the end product contaminated. The only good way is to test the end product.

My family is affected by this too, because we buy almost exclusively second hand, and my son is a crafter.
post #82 of 132
Originally Posted by newmainer View Post
I deeply, hope that this does not go through. But if it does, i think it is imperative that we think creatively and out of the box. For example, every year my friend does a clothing swap with her girlfriends- we a (i'm talking about adults here, but easily applied to children). Our Waldorf school sets up a tent every spring and fall for the same purposes for children's clothing and shoes.

I would hope that everyone will not just throw up their hands and think that just because the government is cracking down, we all need to bow our heads and comply. There are ways around the system, and perhaps we will all be better off and pass things around rather than selling them!

i don't know, just a few tip of the iceberg thoughts.


We have to get creative. There is no possible way we (my family) could survive without second hand clothing. Literally 100% of our clothing are second hand or handmade. I just can't even fathom the thought of buying new clothes. We would literally go hungry
post #83 of 132
yet it's almost like no matter what the specific wording is or whether it might be amended slightly and some things exempted or whatever, the damage is done because the perception is already out there and beginning to grow. people are seeing and hearing evidence of resale stores closing. some good usable stuff is going to dumpsters already. it's an environmental crime as well, all this waste in america.

the big losers are as usual the public, especially economically challenged people, but all of us who shop resale. as quick as kids outgrow stuff, what is the point of buying new? and i do totally hold these companies responsible for producing contaminated products to begin with. what but greed would lead any company to put compromising materials in *children's* products anyway?

this law is rewarding the companies who poisoned people in the first place, by sending more business their way.

yes, an underground network will survive for some people and i would always encourage freecycling or giving away hand me downs, as i do and will continue to do. but i'm thinking twice about donating anything to charities now, after reading about this, for fear that it will just be tossed away instead of passed along.

so the chilling effect has already begun. if they make changes at this late hour, will it even be very effective, or is the damage already done?
post #84 of 132
This is just ridiculous. I can't believe it. I'm outraged.
post #85 of 132
Originally Posted by ElliesMomma View Post

this law is rewarding the companies who poisoned people in the first place, by sending more business their way.

post #86 of 132
Is that for REAL??!!
post #87 of 132
Originally Posted by sharon.gmc View Post
Is that for REAL??!!
post #88 of 132
Another letter to my senator and US rep, this time about books:

Dear Congressman xxx,

I am writing again with additional concerns regarding the Consumer Product Safety Improvement Act.

At this time it appears that the lead testing regulations will apply retroactively to used books. PLEASE work to have this changed !!!!!!!

Our five year old son has many wonderful books he purchased for fifty cents from the used book sale shelf at our local library. He looks forward to our weekly library visits because he gets to search for books of his own to buy. Our budget would not allow us to purchase him this many new books at retail prices. He has many wonderful books he has picked out himself specifically because we can purchase them for such a low cost. Losing this opportunity would be very upsetting to him and a great loss in the variety of books he would be able to enjoy.

Furthermore, we are homeschooling. I am financially counting on being able to purchase a great many books and curriculum materials at used prices. If it becomes illegal to sell used books and materials because they were manufactured before the law was in effect, this will dramatically increase our family's cost to educate our children.

Also, there are many wonderful books that are real treasures that now are out of print. Used is the only way to get these books, ever. If it becomes illegal to sell them, and most of them end up being disposed of because they can't be sold, they will become next to impossible to get, and a great many children will miss out on them. This would be a true tragedy, especially considering that the risk of a child getting lead poisoning from these books is *next to nothing*. If our government goes through with prohibiting the resale of these books, frankly I will consider it a crime of the United States government against our nation's children. There is simply no excuse for banning the sale of out of print children's books just because they do not meet some new standard for safety testing that didn't exist when they were printed, effectively extinguishing those books for our country's children. I do not want to live under a government that would do so.
The implications are truly frightening. This is a matter about which I truly feel that a fundamental personal liberty is at stake.

Thank you again for your consideration. I do hope that you will stand up for our freedom to choose what our children will read.


post #89 of 132
I was just coming on here to see if anyone had mentioned this yet. I just found out about it tonight when my dad sent me this link:


It also contains the link to the .pdf for the 62-page law:


This was introduced in January 2008, passed in August 2008, and will go into effect February 10, 2009.

It even throws in ATV's and pools/spas at the end of the document. I believe I also saw something about more regulations on items small enough to be deemed choking hazards.

I can't find everything my dad and I were discussing earlier, but it seemed (and someone can tell me if we read this wrong) that not only are used children's items not going to be allowed for resale because of the lack of lead-free labels, but the manufacturers and stores were not allowed to stockpile any of these items for something like 6 months prior to the law taking effect. (That's a good explanation for why many stores weren't getting any restock around here.) ---- I just read an article that says the ban on stockpiling and selling the stockpile after Feb. 10 has been revoked?

If it weren't for used items, I wouldn't have been able to bring DS home from the hospital because I couldn't and still can't afford a brand new car seat. This is also going to affect collectors like my dad who collects old GI Joes and my sister who likes older train sets.

I have seen consignment and thrift stores mentioned. We could add antique stores to the list of those affected, too.

Here's an excerpt from the article in relation to cribs:

(c) CRIBS.—
(1) IN GENERAL.—It shall be a violation of section 19(a)(1)
of the Consumer Product Safety Act (15 U.S.C. 2068(a)(1))
for any person to which this subsection applies to manufacture,
sell, contract to sell or resell, lease, sublet, offer, provide for
use, or otherwise place in the stream of commerce a crib that
is not in compliance with a standard promulgated under subsection
applies to any person that—
(A) manufactures, distributes in commerce, or contracts
to sell cribs;
(B) based on the person’s occupation, holds itself out
as having knowledge or skill peculiar to cribs, including
child care facilities and family child care homes;
(C) is in the business of contracting to sell or resell,
lease, sublet, or otherwise place cribs in the stream of
commerce; or
(D) owns or operates a place of public accommodation
affecting commerce (as defined in section 4 of the Federal
Fire Prevention and Control Act of 1974 (15 U.S.C. 2203)
applied without regard to the phrase ‘‘not owned by the
Federal Government’’).
(3) CRIB DEFINED.—In this subsection, the term ‘‘crib’’
(A) new and used cribs;
(B) full-sized or nonfull-sized cribs; and
(C) portable cribs and crib-pens.

This is the only time I could find mention of the word "resell," but there could be numerous synonyms for this for all I know. Now that I've calmed down from having discovered this, I'm trying to logically go through it, and I'm hoping it's not as bad as it may appear. Still, I'm not a lawyer, so there's plenty I could miss.
post #90 of 132
I am f****** speechless!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!! :
post #91 of 132

Some links

Petition to the CPSC


To find your local represtatives


To ask a question of the CPSC on Legislation

post #92 of 132
This is crazy!! I love to consign, love to shop at consignment shops, etc., It saves our family a ton of money!! Hell, I was even thinking about opening my OWN store in a couple of years. This has certainly put a damper on a lot of things now.
post #93 of 132
Some updates - they are listening...

Regulators rethink rules on testing children's clothing and toys for lead

The Consumer Product Safety Commission gives a preliminary OK to exempt some items from testing after complaints of hardship to thrift stores and sellers of handmade toys.


not far enough, but a start.

You can find more details on http://www.cpsc.gov/about/cpsia/cpsia.html

It seems that the CPSC has its hands tied because Congress specifically used the terms "banned hazardous substance" which invokes another law in how such materials are to be treated.
post #94 of 132
"No final rules will be approved until after Feb. 10, when the testing rules go into effect.

That means retailers and manufacturers who sell untested children's merchandise would technically be in violation of the new law starting Feb. 10. Whether federal regulators will enforce the rules -- which might entail inspections at thousands of secondhand stores and toy shops across the country -- is another question.

"The CPSC is an agency with limited resources and tremendous responsibility to protect the safety of families," said Scott Wolfson, a CPSC spokesman. "Our focus will be on those areas we can have the biggest impact and address the most dangerous products."

So does anyone else read this as "We cannot police every little resale shop or toy manufacturer, so we will go after the big guys in order to make the biggest splash." ????

That's kinda what I read.
post #95 of 132
Out to curiosity, do you think it would affect ALL crafts? My mom was making homemade soaps. Kids need to be clean, too. Would she have to have testing done to prove that the lye didn't contain lead?
post #96 of 132
Just wondering-- If new items after Feb. 10 have to be labeled, then items purchased after that date can go to thrift stores and be resold, correct? I think thrift stores may be ok since they have other items, but stores that specialize in children's items will not have any stock for months or years if they have to dump old items then wait for new labeled items to be donated. That would put them out of business. If someone wanted to open a consignment shop for children's items in a year, they'd be ok, right?

Someone mentioned that they've been seeing a lot of children's items on sale, but I haven't at all. Shouldn't every store be trying to get rid of all unlabeled children items before Feb. 10?
post #97 of 132
Another thing - I'm not going to trust that tag, depending on where I see it, anyway. Is anyone really going to trust that a tag saying something has been tested means it actually has and that it absolutely couldn't have lead in it? If I buy something from a WAHM, particularly associated with a place like MDC, I'm going to have a higher level of trust that there is no lead than I would have in a tagged item from Walmart. Wouldn't most people?
post #98 of 132
Im still dumbfounded.

One plus side that I could see from this, it may give us (general public) all a reason to form more of a community around us. I myself, sew, knit, upcycle children goods & sell on etsy & the like. This could be a great opportunity for me to start a barter system with my neighbors. I could sew/knit or give hand me downs to their children in exchange for one of their handicrafts. Heck, Id be willing to sew up an outfit for a babe if someone would be willing to clean my oven
post #99 of 132
Originally Posted by mamazee View Post
Another thing - I'm not going to trust that tag, depending on where I see it, anyway. Is anyone really going to trust that a tag saying something has been tested means it actually has and that it absolutely couldn't have lead in it? If I buy something from a WAHM, particularly associated with a place like MDC, I'm going to have a higher level of trust that there is no lead than I would have in a tagged item from Walmart. Wouldn't most people?
My mom brought up that point earlier. After all, when the health inspector takes a look at a fast food place, all you have to do is slip the inspector a free meal and maybe some money, and the store will get a good score. (This actually happened at a place that my dad worked years ago.) This kind of stuff happens all the time in a variety of businesses. How long before the big businesses start buying off the inspectors in relation to this new law so that they can put no-lead labels on lead-containing products?
post #100 of 132
Wow. I just became aware of this.
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