Laundry: Natural Detergent or Tide?

[Fuamami]

I have used Trader Joe's natural detergent for the last 4-5 years. Recently it has come to my attention that my whites are dingy! Especially when we buy something new, I notice how grayish everything we own is. We do have very hard water, but there's a filter on it that we change regularly. I've been using Oxyclean and colorsafe bleach lately, but haven't really noticed any improvement. My normal method is to just use the detergent and some Borax with diapers or stinky dishcloths, and maybe some vinegar in the rinse. But now that I've noticed this issue, I'm becoming obsessed!!!

Anyone else had this issue with natural detergent? Is it just my water?

[californiajenn]

Like conventional detergents, all natural detergents are not equal. I have not heard good things about Trader Joe's brand. I have used Seventh Generation, Planet, BioKleen, and soapnuts. BioKleen is far and away the best I have used.
Just like you, my whites would look dingy with the others, some better some worse.

I would any of the natural detergents before I'd buy Tide though. To many harsh chemicals, synthetic fragrances, and some types of Tide contains phosphates.

[alison_in_oh]

I have a "thing" about petroleum-based cleaning products and extraneous additives, so I wouldn't go to Tide at this point no matter how nice their harsh detergents and optical brighteners can make things look.

It might be hypocritical but I do bleach my whites -- DH insists on it.

If it were up to me though I'd rely on water softeners and an occasional RLR treatment, because I do think it's probably hard water buildup that's to blame for dinginess, especially with Trader Joe's which I think has citrus oils? Or something similar that has a reputation for building up over time.

[Krabs]

I like Tide. : I do have some all natural detergent I got for Christmas but I haven't tried it yet. It's borax-based so I imagine it will clean nicely. My mom got some as well and she's been enjoying it.

[Drummer's Wife]

Originally Posted by californiajenn

I would any of the natural detergents before I'd buy Tide though. To many harsh chemicals, synthetic fragrances, and some types of Tide contains phosphates.

same here. we use Charlie's and have been happy. I haven't noticed dingy whites, and we have hard water. Honestly, I don't even separate darks from white. I never have Bleach scares me!

[SimpleBean]

wanted to add: what kind of dryer do you have? i've noticed that gas dryers leave a dingy-ness to clothes after a while.

as for detergents, i've tried a couple of "natural" brands, but went back to tide b/c the clothes always smelled dirty...not sure why.

[rabbithorns]

White is not the natural color of cotton. Cotton is heavily bleached before making into clothing. It is actually natural for "whites", such as t-shirts, to revert to a more yellow color. Cotton is either slightly yellow, slightly green, or slightly tan, right out of the boll. You can bleach but eventually it won't do any good because the fabric will be breaking down by the time you can't get them white anymore.

If you want white things, buy new when they go back to their natural color. The detergent doesn't make much difference, although I suspect the more harsh it is, the shorter the honeymoon-white will last.

[JTA Mom]

Originally Posted by rabbithorns

White is not the natural color of cotton. Cotton is heavily bleached before making into clothing. It is actually natural for "whites", such as t-shirts, to revert to a more yellow color. Cotton is either slightly yellow, slightly green, or slightly tan, right out of the boll. You can bleach but eventually it won't do any good because the fabric will be breaking down by the time you can't get them white anymore.

If you want white things, buy new when they go back to their natural color. The detergent doesn't make much difference, although I suspect the more harsh it is, the shorter the honeymoon-white will last.

It can't 'revert' back because it is no longer alive. It's like bleaching hair. Once bleached, there's no reverting back to anything. Bleaching makes cotton (& hair) porous, so it's much more likely to pick up colors from the environment, like minerals in water, soap buildup, etc.

Dingyness is caused by build up of minerals and/or soap residue. This is much more likely to occur if you have hard water, even if it's just slightly hard. Hard water makes is difficult for soap to fully wash out & has minerals that build up on stuff. So if any of your faucets have a light grey/yellow buildup, it's due to the minerals in the water.

How to get them undingy? Bleach or Oxiclean. You need something to strip out the build up. You can also try RLR. It's a laundry additive in the laundry aisle. It helps to dissolve away the build up of soap & minerals.

As far as natural vs. Tide, there's no difference. If you have hard water, add in a cup of baking soda in the drum and a cup of vinegar in the rinse cycle. Both soften the water, and the vinegar helps the soap to wash out. Make sure not to use too much soap, esp if you have a front loader. In fact, a tbs of detergent in a front loader is more than enough to clean dirty clothes.

A once a month treatment for the whites will keep them undingy. Just fill up your machine with super hot water, throw in a cup or two of oxiclean (or a 1/2 c of bleach for a toploader), throw in your clothes and let it agitate a bit. Then turn of the machine and let it soak for 6 hours for oxiclean (it's hydrogen peroxide and it's only active for 6 hours), or overnight for the bleach. Then run a regular wash with some detergent and another empty wash to get rid of the majority of the bleach/oxiclean. Your whites should sparkle!

hth!

Ami

[Fuamami]

Originally Posted by californiajenn

Like conventional detergents, all natural detergents are not equal. I have not heard good things about Trader Joe's brand.

Hmm. Maybe I should shop around. I always assumed they were all pretty much the same.

Originally Posted by SimpleBean

wanted to add: what kind of dryer do you have? i've noticed that gas dryers leave a dingy-ness to clothes after a while.

Nope, it's electric, and I line-dry in the summer.

Originally Posted by JTA Mom

It can't 'revert' back because it is no longer alive. It's like bleaching hair. Once bleached, there's no reverting back to anything. Bleaching makes cotton (& hair) porous, so it's much more likely to pick up colors from the environment, like minerals in water, soap buildup, etc.

Dingyness is caused by build up of minerals and/or soap residue. This is much more likely to occur if you have hard water, even if it's just slightly hard. Hard water makes is difficult for soap to fully wash out & has minerals that build up on stuff. So if any of your faucets have a light grey/yellow buildup, it's due to the minerals in the water.

How to get them undingy? Bleach or Oxiclean. You need something to strip out the build up. You can also try RLR. It's a laundry additive in the laundry aisle. It helps to dissolve away the build up of soap & minerals.

As far as natural vs. Tide, there's no difference. If you have hard water, add in a cup of baking soda in the drum and a cup of vinegar in the rinse cycle. Both soften the water, and the vinegar helps the soap to wash out. Make sure not to use too much soap, esp if you have a front loader. In fact, a tbs of detergent in a front loader is more than enough to clean dirty clothes.

A once a month treatment for the whites will keep them undingy. Just fill up your machine with super hot water, throw in a cup or two of oxiclean (or a 1/2 c of bleach for a toploader), throw in your clothes and let it agitate a bit. Then turn of the machine and let it soak for 6 hours for oxiclean (it's hydrogen peroxide and it's only active for 6 hours), or overnight for the bleach. Then run a regular wash with some detergent and another empty wash to get rid of the majority of the bleach/oxiclean. Your whites should sparkle!

hth!

Ami

Thanks for this post! Very helpful! I'll have to try all these remedies, though I have a front-loader so it seems like it's a little bit harder to get things to "soak", since the water level doesn't stay up in there. But, WCS, I could just do it in a Rubbermaid tub or something.

I have never soaked my clothes in Oxi-clean, just put it in the wash. Will it bleach colors? Because I would also like to soak things that have whites, but are patterened.

[rabbithorns]

JTAmom is right. It doesn't actually revert but that's what it is often described as doing. It is just open and taking on the stuff of life as it's more porous now. Nice description JTAmom - much better than mine!

[JTA Mom]

Originally Posted by Fuamami

Thanks for this post! Very helpful! I'll have to try all these remedies, though I have a front-loader so it seems like it's a little bit harder to get things to "soak", since the water level doesn't stay up in there. But, WCS, I could just do it in a Rubbermaid tub or something.

I have never soaked my clothes in Oxi-clean, just put it in the wash. Will it bleach colors? Because I would also like to soak things that have whites, but are patterened.

It's easy to soak in a front loader. I have one and hated it until I learned a few tricks.

To soak in your fl, set it for the highest, hottest water level. Throw in your clothes. Mix up about a cup or so of oxiclean with hot water to pre-dissolve it. I've found pre-dissolving stuff really helps my fl out. Pour it into the soap dispenser. Let the washer fill with water. Meanwhile, fill up a big jug with hot water. I use an old pitcher and my bathroom tub faucet for this. You can add about 3 gallons of water into the washer with no issues. I do this when doing diaper laundry, since super dirty loads just need more water than a fl allows. Pour this into the machine. You can do this by pouring it into the soap dispenser if it pours directly into the machine (mine does this), or turn off the machine by pushing in the wash button, open the door & pour it in. This amount of water will still be way below the door, but it will be higher than before, allowing better soaking. Then just leave the machine off. Every couple hours, turn it on, let it agitate a bit, then turn it off. The agitation really helps the oxiclean work, and it rotates the clothes so that all spend an equal amount of time on top & on the bottom. Remember, the oxiclean is only active for 6 hours, so there's no need to soak longer. For the bleach, just one agitation is enough. I just let the load soak overnight, then just turn on the machine in the morning.

Ok, on the issue of color fastness. I've soaked countless garments, including 20+ yr baby clothes. In all but a couple of cases, the color garments were unaffected, even when I soaked them in oxiclean several times (some of those took 3+ soakings to get all the stains out). The only caveat is don't mix colored clothes with the whites/lights. I had a transfer occur once, when a dark blue jumper was lying on top of a white pant set. There's now a permanent blue streak on the white pants where the blue jumper was resting. It's only happened once, and I had a bunch of other colored items in the same load not do anything to the whites, but since then, I segregate them.


Ami

[PGTlatte]

I don't use a natural detergent - I use the Costco detergent. I also don't use bleach. I still get dingy whites unless I let them soak in the oxyclean for several hours or overnight. So I don't think just using something like Tide would resolve the dingy whites. It might help to change how you use the oxyclean though.

[deditus]

Biokleen F & C powder (regular gave me a severe rash) or Kirkland (Costco) F & C liquid are the two detergents that work great for us. I use Biokleen oxygen bleach powder for whites.

[hillymum]

I love Charlie's soap. I have really hard water and had no issues with whites. I couldn't use it for cloth diapers though as for some reason it would cause PUL to wick.

I used to pour extra hot water in through the soap dispenser when washing a load of diapers. Fun memories!

[talia rose]

i do not mean to offend, but i just can't see how getting things bright and white comes before using a product that will not harm the planet or cause cancer and other health related issues. It seems very short sighted.

http://www.shareguide.com/hazard.html

[Fuamami]

Originally Posted by JTA Mom

It's easy to soak in a front loader. I have one and hated it until I learned a few tricks.

To soak in your fl, set it for the highest, hottest water level. Throw in your clothes. Mix up about a cup or so of oxiclean with hot water to pre-dissolve it. I've found pre-dissolving stuff really helps my fl out. Pour it into the soap dispenser. Let the washer fill with water. Meanwhile, fill up a big jug with hot water. I use an old pitcher and my bathroom tub faucet for this. You can add about 3 gallons of water into the washer with no issues. I do this when doing diaper laundry, since super dirty loads just need more water than a fl allows. Pour this into the machine. You can do this by pouring it into the soap dispenser if it pours directly into the machine (mine does this), or turn off the machine by pushing in the wash button, open the door & pour it in. This amount of water will still be way below the door, but it will be higher than before, allowing better soaking. Then just leave the machine off. Every couple hours, turn it on, let it agitate a bit, then turn it off. The agitation really helps the oxiclean work, and it rotates the clothes so that all spend an equal amount of time on top & on the bottom. Remember, the oxiclean is only active for 6 hours, so there's no need to soak longer. For the bleach, just one agitation is enough. I just let the load soak overnight, then just turn on the machine in the morning.

Ok, on the issue of color fastness. I've soaked countless garments, including 20+ yr baby clothes. In all but a couple of cases, the color garments were unaffected, even when I soaked them in oxiclean several times (some of those took 3+ soakings to get all the stains out). The only caveat is don't mix colored clothes with the whites/lights. I had a transfer occur once, when a dark blue jumper was lying on top of a white pant set. There's now a permanent blue streak on the white pants where the blue jumper was resting. It's only happened once, and I had a bunch of other colored items in the same load not do anything to the whites, but since then, I segregate them.


Ami

Great tip! Thank you so much! I'm going to try this today!

Originally Posted by llp34

I don't use a natural detergent - I use the Costco detergent. I also don't use bleach. I still get dingy whites unless I let them soak in the oxyclean for several hours or overnight. So I don't think just using something like Tide would resolve the dingy whites. It might help to change how you use the oxyclean though.

Good to know!

Originally Posted by emgremore

Biokleen F & C powder (regular gave me a severe rash) or Kirkland (Costco) F & C liquid are the two detergents that work great for us. I use Biokleen oxygen bleach powder for whites.

What's F & C?

Originally Posted by hillymum

I love Charlie's soap. I have really hard water and had no issues with whites. I couldn't use it for cloth diapers though as for some reason it would cause PUL to wick.

I used to pour extra hot water in through the soap dispenser when washing a load of diapers. Fun memories!

I've seen this, but it's so spendy! Does it stretch and last quite a while?

Originally Posted by talia rose

i do not mean to offend, but i just can't see how getting things bright and white comes before using a product that will not harm the planet or cause cancer and other health related issues. It seems very short sighted.

http://www.shareguide.com/hazard.html

Well, my sister uses a kind of Tide with no phosphates or fragrance or coloring. I know it's probably not the best option, but I just wonder how much of a difference it would make. And since I have had clothes become literally ruined (like a white cotton work blouse that is just greyish now), it seems like making my clothes last longer would off-set the damage. But, if as the pp said, it wouldn't make a difference, I am going to try to the Oxiclean soaking method. Wish me luck!

[deditus]

Originally Posted by Fuamami

What's F & C?

I've seen this, but it's so spendy! Does it stretch and last quite a while?

Free and clear, meaning no fragrances. Some are not truly free and clear, they just add scents to make it smell "nonscented" and still use optical brighteners. With both the Biokleen and Kirkland stuff, I am able to use much less than it calls for in our slightly hard water. We just opened a new container of Kirkland liquid when the previous container was opened in June. $26 a year for 5+ loads of laundry a week is pretty good.

Charlie's soap is very concentrated. You only use like 1 tablespoon per load. I used it for quite a long time, but it didn't work well in our water and I had to switch.

[babycarrier]

Last I checked, Trader Joes has optical brighteners.

I have really hard water and have the same issue. I find rotating my soaps helpful. Charlies works great and lasts a long time, you really only need a small amount. Biokleen is probably my favorite, but I do notice a build up after a while.

Will have to look into RLR, but I find Calgon water softener makes a great difference. I don't use it often but did when I used cloth or had stink.