Scared to let go - question for quiverfull mamas. - Page 2

[Quindin]

Anyway, I was talking to DH last night about this thread.
The peaceful smile on his face as we discussed praying about letting go ... he was trying to hide it, but it was there When we have discussed permanent contraception, the look on his face is so worried and heavy. And I feel the same: the weight of knowing we would be meddlingwith God's plans is so huge!

Oh, and we saw our baby in the ultrasound for the first time today!
What an incredible miracle to see that little person jumping in there! I tear up every time

[AngelBee]

I will be back

[rhiandmoi]

I suggest reading the Art of Natural Family Planning. I think from a not quite quiverful perspective, it does a good job of answering questions about child spacing and how to make the decision to attempt to space or not. The book is written from a Catholic point of view so using any contraceptive method including withdrawl, non-vaginal intercourse, or barrier methods is dealt with from the perspective that it is harmful to the marriage relationship. It also shows how the marriage relationship is strengthened when the desire to attempt spacing or not is made together each cycle.

[DahliaRW]

Hi from your DDC!

I've struggled a lot with the same issue, as to whether God intends us to be QF or not. It was easy to get dh to agree to no bc after #2, but here I am pregnant and will have two barely 2 years apart. I don't think he'll be so receptive after this time. However, I am feeling pulled towards not using bc. It's something I pray about constantly and I pray that if it is God's intention to put the idea into my dh's heart. I do feel relieved, because I do have some time before a decision has to be made (probably until Late August).

Thanks for posting this thread. I've enjoyed reading the responses.

[LionTigerBear]

Wow, I didn't know there were other people on MDC struggling with this, too. I don't want to barge in on this thread but can I spill my guts too? I also don't feel comfortable with any form of birth control. I've been researching it a lot the last several months.

We had always wanted as many kids as God wanted for us-- we got married at 20, so full of faith, even though we were flat broke, and our first child was conceived on our honeymoon. But after a scary PPD experience, plus it was a tough pregnancy and traumatic birth, we decided to try "one more time" and just see how it went and go from there.

Second time, I had a better pregnancy, a bit easier, and then an easy birth-- and I was so excited, I was dreaming of number three already! But at about three months postpartum from number two, I realized I had developed PPD again. I had a couple bad moments where I had snapped and hit my older son, who was two, and yelled at him . . . it was awful. I just wasn't myself. Plus the pregnancies had triggered other health issues. I had to go on a very strict detox/healing diet, and slowly, I got my health back.

But we decided that we were DONE. I cried about it, but I knew that I couldn't risk sacrificing my mental instability-- I had to think of my precious little boys.

But then, my period came back, and I had regained my health by then, and felt great, just radiantly healthy-- and financially things were finally looking up for us-- and having just one more just felt so right . . . so we went for it without hardly any thought at all-- and of course we're as fertile as we could possibly be, so here I am pregnant again. And we are super excited about it.

But I immediately got SO SICK right away. I mean, it's been really hard. This is by far my hardest pregnancy so far. I was throwing up at least once a day for about five months. It was so depressing and totally brought my whole social and home life crashing to a halt. I've had almost no energy, which makes me feel depressed because the state of the apartment kind of falls apart, and our diet suffers when I'm too tired to cook, and so on. And my previous health issues are popping up again. I have two little ones (2 and 4 now) to care for, and the eldest has Asperger's and is higher needs, and DH works long hours to support us. And he's still in school too. And we're so young, and our life has been so hard our whole marriage, that we've just been excited to finally get a BREAK!

Needless to say, I have a whole lot LESS faith than I did as a newlywed. Life comes at you fast, I guess. I wish I had that kind of rosy-eyed faith again . . . but now I'm more scared.

The biggest thing is the mental issue. You see, it wasn't just the pregnancy difficulties and PPD-- I also have cut off my relationship with my mom. She has a lot of kids and after each kid she got more and more mentally unstable-- personality disorders. It still hurts. I don't want that to be me and my kids!!! And I'm so scared of being like that.

So . . . on one hand, I feel like the responsible and unselfish thing to do is to stop having babies-- and it feels right when I frame it that way. But then I wonder-- is that a false dichotomy? I have this nagging feeling that I need to have faith and let God in on this decision-making process-- which I've been too scared to do . . .

Then there's the thing that if I changed my mind now and even tried to bring it up, DH would laugh at me. And, I've been so vocal to EVERYONE about how this is my LAST baby. Almost like I'm trying to convince myself . . . I will look pretty stupid to have more children (on purpose) now.

Then there's the fact that the only parent that I get along with, my dad (who is not with my mom) is against anyone having more than like two kids. Not that he'd be rude enough to say anything to me about it-- but I know how he feels because he told me in no uncertain terms when I was a kid and I know he hasn't changed that much. None of our families would really approve of it, though I'm sure they'd be polite and still ove me. But I've always longed to really WOW them with my accomplishments in life-- like a doctorate, they would really admire that-- just to disprove my mom who always thought I was a loser and couldn't accomplish anything-- which I shouldn't care about-- but yeah, I do.

But when I see Michelle Duggar with all of those kids, and she's SO patient, it doesn't scare me-- I want that. I cried when she had another baby. I just cried. Why is it so (apparently) easy for her, and yet each of my pregnancies just seems to nearly destroy my health? I'm not scared of being like the Duggars-- I should be so lucky, so many kids and they all have their health-- kids and the mom-- but I'm scared of being even half as bad a mom as my mom. And scared of my family thinking I'm going to be like my mom (who remember, had a large family).

It's easier when you come from a good family, I think. A lot easier. I have had to fight to try to learn better mental health habits, to break the patterns of family life I was raised with, to try to learn to parent gently and respectfully, to learn to be patient, etc etc etc. It's so much harder to be a good mom with no adequate role model and little, if any, support.

Okay, I'll shut up now. I just had to get that off my chest. Thanks if anyone read all of that.

[Quindin]

{{LionTigerBear}}} Huge hugs to you!!!

About the Duggars: she has several pre teen and teenage kids and she delegates, delegates, degates. Imagine having so many live-in babysitters helping you with the small ones? She was talking about how each kid is "the buddy" of the younger one. She takes care primarily of the baby (ies). So she gets TONS of help.

With 5 kids and pregnant with the 6th, I can't believe how blessed I am that I get to take a long shower because my two oldest offer to play with the baby! When I had only 2 under 3, it was soooo hard! I walked around like a zombie. Even the help my daughter offers as "mommy helper" ( she loves to dress the baby, chnage diapers, play with her ) and my older son playing with his brothers, is tremendous!

I don't agree exactly with just how much the Duggars delegate (but that's another thread altogether...). but nobody can deny that older siblings make things so much easier, even if just by entertaining the little ones.

So don't beat yourself up!

[neveryoumindthere]

LionTigerBear, I'm being totally truthful when I say I got about halfway through your post and scrolled back up to see if *I* posted it and had forgotten :
Your situation sounds so similar and I totally get looking to someone like michelle duggar and thinking, here I am struggling to keep my head above water, physically and mentally and my health just gets worse and worse. I was just saying to dh lastnight, isn't it 'funny' how I am sooo into health and nutrition and eat healthier than anyone i know yet I struggle more than any of them with my health and they live off of junk food and antibiotics...sigh...

I so need a boost in my faith. I always carry the weight of the family on my shoulders, and don't turn to God nearly enough. It is as He wills so why do i worry

[Soul-O]

So nice to see some support and commiseration here . I, too, struggle with feeling that God has called us to be QF, and yet, we are unable to follow His will because my DH and I made the hasty decision to get the big V while I was pregnant with my youngest child. DH and I are planning to have his V reversed and leave the rest up to God starting next year. Our families are definitely not supportive of us having any more children, mostly because DH is Army and thus is away from home more than we'd like, and also because I have some health problems I'm working through (migraine disorder with seizures, a rare autoimmune disease that causes airway swellings). However, our hearts are big and full of the Lord and His love, and we feel that He has called us to bring more of His children into the world. I have energy, patience, and good humor, and I truly love parenting... I become very sad when I think of never having anymore children. As many of you have mentioned, it is best to trust and have faith in God... He doesn't lead us down the wrong path when we pray to be in the center of his will.

[DahliaRW]

As for the Duggars, I'm sure when Michelle had her first 3 or 4 and they were all under 5 she had doubts and wondered how on earth she could do it as well. After all, she is only human and I imagine any human being has issues under that type of stress.

And thank you Quindin and others for speaking on siblings. That is so true. Even my 4 year old can be really helpful at times with his younger brother (of course he's not so helpful other times too!). My 4 year old also is VERY excited about this baby and keeps telling me how he wants me to have lots and lots of babies. I often wonder if God is speaking through him sometimes...

[TzippityDoulah]

Originally Posted by Quindin

And I hear that the Duggar lady weans at 6 months so she can become fertile again asap. Is that true?

this seems really weird to me honestly.... that's kinda private information and it just doesn't seem like something she would tell a whole nation of people you know? so I suspect it isn't true. and if it is, it wasn't meant for us all to know.

some people are fetile even weeks after having a baby.

[Kidzaplenty]

Yeah, fertile six weeks pp, even if they are EBF! Strange how life works. Some people get really long BF breaks PP and others, like me, get no break at all.

But really, I don't complain. I figure it is payback for "easy" AF and labors.

[TzippityDoulah]

I think the Michelle duggar we see... is TV michelle. NOT to say she isn't great and wonderful and a sweet tempered person who loves her children. BUT she is HUMAN. I'm sure she snaps at her kids, and has bad days, and days where she thinks "am I nuts?" just like the rest of us. Perhaps though her patience has grown with her children. sometimes God doesn't give us the tools we need UNTIL we're in that job humbly.

I totally understand the PPD issues so manys speak of. so many of us have those. or other illnesses, and fears about our body's ability to handle more pregnancies, births, and children. But like everything else in life- there comes a point where we have to choose - do we make decisions based on fear? or do we make decisions based on obedience to our Lord? I'm not downplaying PPD at all! (btdt!! i was awful!!) but I am saying that instead of hiding from god b/c of our fears, why not consider HE not only knows our fears, but plans and allows for our fears and failures. He knows all of this better than we do.
I was terrified of getting pregnant again. I would nto give that area of my heart to the Lord for so very long. I wanted to... but what if I got sick and hospitalized again? what if I got PPD again? what if my baby was sick like last time? what if I couldn't handle it emotionally b/c of how stressed I was from the last time? what if what if what if... too many what if's and i decided it wasn't worth it. But I suffered. and my husband suffered, b/c our hearts were closed to god on the issue. we stuffed logic infront o obedience (ie: wouldn't it be better to be a healthy mom of two than a sick mom of 4?") But the thing is about being a committed Christian is that god calls us to submission and obedience, not to take things into our own hands and figure them out. That's, frankly, a veyr tough pill to swallow. we're ignorant, stubborn and many of us have subconciously swallowed this lie that to be responsible means to have only a couple of children.

But i urge you ladies who want to be QF but have fears... to be responsible is to SUBMIT yourself to the Lord. in honesty, humility, and reverence. For He has never called us to be in charge of who he created, He is the great creator. (try finding a verse that talks positively about limited family line etc - then try finding some that talk about the blessings God gives us through our children) Handing over our fears, anxieties, and failures ot Him and letting Him decide our paths is the safest and most responsible thignwe can do. easy? nope! but best.

and please nobody thinkI have it together and so that is whyI speak. I do not have it together. I was raising in a very rough home, as was my husband. we didn't have christian examples, I was left iwhtout a home at 17, my husband married me at 18 so I would have someone to take care of me (now that's love!). I had NO idea how to raise a kid when he was born at 19... I got hyperemesis with every dang pregnancy, PPD twice now, toxemia/pre-e, gestational diabetes and my last child had SERIOUS health and developmental problems. Not to mention I am the world's most selfish, and impatient person by nature! so yeah, I have a heck of a lot of doubts floating around in mind mind! But now I know God holds those worries too. and God is working on me very slowly but steadily. and I still deal with all those very real and deep feelings of fear and short comings and the health issues and PPD... but I am NOT alone this time. I am not alone. and that is worth it.

[neveryoumindthere]

^Thank you for this.

[maxwill129]

Thanks for this thread, ladies. DH and I have a hard time just trusting God to give us as many babies as he sees fit. However, we do seem to get pregnant anytime we DTD during our fertile period, on birth control or not, so maybe God has already taken the lead!

[LionTigerBear]

Originally Posted by Quindin

{{LionTigerBear}}} Huge hugs to you!!!

....

About the Duggars: she has several pre teen and teenage kids .... she gets TONS of help.
.....

So don't beat yourself up!

Thank you!

Originally Posted by neveryoumindthere

LionTigerBear, I'm being totally truthful when I say I got about halfway through your post and scrolled back up to see if *I* posted it and had forgotten :

Originally Posted by neveryoumindthere

I was just saying to dh lastnight, isn't it 'funny' how I am sooo into health and nutrition and eat healthier than anyone i know yet I struggle more than any of them with my health and they live off of junk food and antibiotics...sigh...

I know exactly what you mean-- eating and living so carefully and still so physically "fragile"-- and I've decided it's my mental attitude-- seriously, I don't know if this is true for you or not, but I think I make myself sick and physically weak because of my negative thought habits-- like worrying too much-- I'm so fearful all the time. I'm working on that, but it's not like something you can just snap out of, you know? Especially after a whole childhood of living in survival mode. But I am changing and slowly becoming more positive and I think the more I ask God for help with this-- being more positive-- the healthier my body will be too. Stress will do a number on one's health.

Originally Posted by neveryoumindthere

I so need a boost in my faith. I always carry the weight of the family on my shoulders, and don't turn to God nearly enough. It is as He wills so why do i worry

Yep, me too.

Originally Posted by DahliaRW

As for the Duggars, I'm sure when Michelle had her first 3 or 4 and they were all under 5 she had doubts and wondered how on earth she could do it as well. After all, she is only human and I imagine any human being has issues under that type of stress.

That'sa good point. Also, she did create an artificial space after her first child which made it easier for her. He was probably already old enough to help a little by the time she had her second.

Originally Posted by HennyPenny

I think the Michelle duggar we see... is TV michelle. NOT to say she isn't great and wonderful and a sweet tempered person who loves her children. BUT she is HUMAN. I'm sure she snaps at her kids, and has bad days, and days where she thinks "am I nuts?" just like the rest of us. Perhaps though her patience has grown with her children. sometimes God doesn't give us the tools we need UNTIL we're in that job humbly.

Thanks for this. Actually, I'd probably look like a fantastic mom on TV, too, I guess. It's only the occasional moments when I snap. Isn't it funny how we compare our worst parts to someone else's best parts? And even if she is always like that-- I still shouldn't be comparing myself liek that. It's not constructive.

Originally Posted by HennyPenny

But like everything else in life- there comes a point where we have to choose - do we make decisions based on fear? or do we make decisions based on obedience to our Lord? I'm not downplaying PPD at all! (btdt!! i was awful!!) but I am saying that instead of hiding from god b/c of our fears, why not consider HE not only knows our fears, but plans and allows for our fears and failures. He knows all of this better than we do.

I was thinking about this yesterday. About how many decisison I still make out of fear.

Like my fear of being like my mom. I am so afraid to be like her, that I make life decisions as if I already was like that. Maybe it's a self-fulfilling prophecy. Why do I DO that to myself-- focus on what I DON'T want and ACT like it's real? Why not turn my fear around and focus on what I DO want, which is to be a GOOD mom? If I was focusing on being a good mom, rather than on my fear, I'd be just as likely (if not more) to actually achieve that goal, and I'd probably make healthier life decisions. Why do we like to believe that being fearful is responsible? These are the things I was thinking about.

And it's still scary. But you know, they say that courage doesn't mean not being scared, it means doing the right thing even when you are scared. And I'm not sure what the right thing is yet-- but I'm going to turn to God with it, and not base my life on fear. I feel REALLY good about this. I'm really grateful for this thread and that I made the leap to put this out there.

[TzippityDoulah]

Originally Posted by LionTigerBear

Thanks for this. Actually, I'd probably look like a fantastic mom on TV, too, I guess. It's only the occasional moments when I snap. Isn't it funny how we compare our worst parts to someone else's best parts? And even if she is always like that-- I still shouldn't be comparing myself liek that. It's not constructive.

haha then you're better than I... I snap way too often! so there, you're already further along in mastering good motherhood than I!

but yes you are so right. we always take our worsts and compare it to other's bests. or even worse we take our bests and compare them to other's worsts and think "wow look how great I am! I don't need to work on myself at all anymore! I have arrived!" or sometimes even worse we think "well if they can get away with being horrible then nobody will notice me just being mediocre". heh.

I'm trying VERY hard to remember my measuring stick is the Lord. and thankfully it's a measurement full of grace!!

[esmicosaquehago]

This thread is very sweet and thoughtful. Gives me a lot to think about.

[alaskagirl]

I've thoroughly enjoyed reading this post. My husband and I are christians. He definitly is not to the point of being a QF family. Just the way he was raised, and I am the spontanious one in the marriage. Anyway, here's what I've been thinking about. I'm due April 7th with our 3rd little girl. The last two are going to be a little over 5 yrs apart. I can see where God had his hand in that, we were only practicing withdrawl. But I had suger issues, which I believe kept me from ovulating. Well, I've been feeling pretty strongly about adopting after this one. I would LOVE to adopt before I've weaned so I can nurse the babe too, if God gives us a babe small enough to learn. My thoughts are do we have faith that God will bless us with a child through adoption, stop us from conceiving and everything? It's just such a scary thought. I guess that's it in a nutshell. I know I can have faith about conceiving again, and if he wants us to adopt, the money and child will come. But when I put them together it's scarier! Any thoughts?

And hugs to the first poster, I have GD and don't feel like I can really handle another preg very easily. It's very tough. Just pray and pray about it!