Could we move the Israeli War threads into Politics? - Page 6

[Ruthla]

What's the rule about linking to spinoff forums when it's a topic MDC isn't willing to host?

If somebody created a spinoff forum to discuss news and politics, and chose to keep it completely unmoderated, would they be allowed to post the link on this thread, or only share it via PM?

[athansor]

What about moving it off board? I've seen something like this done too, a board with a specific focus moved off topic discussion to a new separate board. A lot of members liked to get together and discuss things that didn't directly relate to the purpose of the original board, so this new board was formed. There was a link in the original forum to the new one, but once you clicked the link, the new forum required it's own registration. Hosting the link on the original board was just a courtesy so that people could find it.

..oops, looks like Ruthla and I crossposted

[ShwarmaQueen]

I think the only problem with the ignore button would be that *someone, somewhere* would read something neg. in that forum and forever associate it with MDC. Obviously this might ultimately hurt Mothering, the business.

I'm also very sad it closed, mainly because there are so many news stories that get ignored, which I believe deserve more attention, and it was a place for me to "bring them to light".

[Mama Mko]

I'm sad about this too, though I don't think I ever posted in that forum. I did enjoy reading the discussion. If there is a place people are moving to, please PM me the link.

[JessicaS]

Originally Posted by CathMac

Abimommy,
This a classic chicken or egg question. When you have a strong majority then there are few UAVs. Or at least it seems that way because there is little disagreement among the members and/or because the few UAVs against non members are under-reported. Under those circumstances, enforcing the MDC UA would require a more proactive Mod presence, one which isn't dependent upon member reporting. And let's face it, it really doesn't seem like an efficient allocation of resources to put more Mods on a board where eveyone generally agrees with each other.

Until, of course, the few voices of dissent materialize. Since in the absence of strong Moderating to that point, the "group think" is more firmly entrenched and dissent is less and less acceptable. So it becomes a vicious circle.

On the Politics board in particular there is (was ) a very obvious majority with a well developed set of unofficial guidelines. At best this type of dynamic creates something akin to an echo chamber or a mutual admiration / agreement society. Which isn't conducive to a meaningful exchange of ideas.

So while I am sad, I realize that closing N&CE and Politics merely acknowledges the reality that --for better or for worse-- people feel passionately enough that they are only going to restrain themselves to a certain point. The only other option is more proactive Moderating that doesn't rely so heavily on member reporting. Because, after all, it's the squeaky wheel that gets the grease.

~Cath

Even in the beginning days of Politics forums here on MDC there were conservatives who were regular posters.

It has never been an all-liberal board all the time. I think earlier it helped that the board was here BEFORE there was Political forums...so for many of us it was like talking to our friends and we saw one another as friends. I still see the boards as talking to my friends.


Now, we have had a lot of people join who do not have the same...investment in the forum I guess is the best phrase I can come up with. We didn't really have much baiting then but now it seems people derive pleasure from making subjects as inflammatory as possible. That is on both sides on the issues.

I guess my point is...it isn't that conservatives are here that is the problem.

It is the manner in which people are treating each other and the discussions.

People want to make debates rather than conversations. That isn't helping.

[JessicaS]

Oh I just want to say I am sorry I didn't respond for a bit my ds had a cardiology appt this morning.

It went really well his heart is doing much better.

[KatWrangler]

Originally Posted by abimommy

Oh I just want to say I am sorry I didn't respond for a bit my ds had a cardiology appt this morning.

It went really well his heart is doing much better.

:

Great news!

[Ruthla]

Originally Posted by abimommy

Oh I just want to say I am sorry I didn't respond for a bit my ds had a cardiology appt this morning.

It went really well his heart is doing much better.

I'm glad he's doing well!

[nonconformnmom]

Originally Posted by abimommy

People want to make debates rather than conversations. That isn't helping.

I don't think it's possible to discuss politics without it becoming a debate. My question is, why is debate considered a bad thing?

[JessicaS]

Originally Posted by nonconformnmom

I don't think it's possible to discuss politics without it becoming a debate. My question is, why is debate considered a bad thing?

I mean a *heated* debate.

We host discourse and peaceful discussion, once people start flaming others then it isn't something we can host.

Not everyone likes that but that is just how we roll.


We want people to talk like they are in the same room, or are even in one another's home. If I have 500 people in my house for a Pampered Chef party or something I am not generally going to pick a fight with them, regardless of their political affiliation.

The only difference is, we can ask each other for a citation and I am not going to ask someone in my home to put down their tea and give me a link.

[eclipse]

I'm another who is sad. If another forum pops up, I'd love a PM about it.

[studentmama]

Originally Posted by nonconformnmom

Here's a crazy idea. How about having the politics and news forum be completely unmoderated? Everyone who enters would have to agree that they will behave as adults and that if their feelings get hurt or they get offended, they have to deal with it on their own. No whining!

We could still have the membership requirements so that only people who have shown themselves to be decent MDC citizens would be allowed to post there ...

This is what I was going to suggest. Political engagement requires a thick skin. I know I have been in converstations that I was hurt by something I read or a response, but I came back and continued to engage. What happened to me? I grew as a person. I learned how to try and see anothers viewpoint, to consider that not everyone has the perspective I do. Yes, politics can be tough, discussing things with viewpoints different than you own can be tough, but you grow as a person and you work things out. Maybe what's needed is not more moderation but less.

[vbactivist]

Originally Posted by abimommy

Oh I just want to say I am sorry I didn't respond for a bit my ds had a cardiology appt this morning.

It went really well his heart is doing much better.

[studentmama]

Originally Posted by abimommy

Oh I just want to say I am sorry I didn't respond for a bit my ds had a cardiology appt this morning.

It went really well his heart is doing much better.

:

[Missy]

Originally Posted by abimommy

I mean a *heated* debate.

We host discourse and peaceful discussion, once people start flaming others then it isn't something we can host.

Not everyone likes that but that is just how we roll.


We want people to talk like they are in the same room, or are even in one another's home. If I have 500 people in my house for a Pampered Chef party or something I am not generally going to pick a fight with them, regardless of their political affiliation.

The only difference is, we can ask each other for a citation and I am not going to ask someone in my home to put down their tea and give me a link.

But really there's a huge difference. If I'm at a Pampered Chef party, I'm not there for the purpose of discussing politics. OTOH, if I go into the political forum on a discussion board, I'm going there with the intention to discuss politics. That's the purpose of a political forum whereas the purpose of a Pamper Chef party is to shop and eat and chat.

Over the years, my focus here has evolved and shifted, along with the needs of my children. Given the current national and global climate, I have a hard time participating in fluff threads. I tend to stay in the forums that most greatly impact my family; most recently that has been politics in addition to threads about racism and bigotry, but it also includes allergies and homeschooling.

I know that I have pissed off some people and I can live with that because I also know I have been able to affect change in others and I think that is huge. The discussions have also challenged me to look at global perspectives instead of local. And they've helped me to explain that global perspective to my children so that they grow up looking at the world with a wider lens.

I am saddened and frustrated with the change because I think MDC will lose a depth that is necessary to parenting and community.

[studentmama]

Originally Posted by abimommy

I mean a *heated* debate.

We host discourse and peaceful discussion, once people start flaming others then it isn't something we can host.

Not everyone likes that but that is just how we roll.


We want people to talk like they are in the same room, or are even in one another's home. If I have 500 people in my house for a Pampered Chef party or something I am not generally going to pick a fight with them, regardless of their political affiliation.

The only difference is, we can ask each other for a citation and I am not going to ask someone in my home to put down their tea and give me a link.

I do not think heated debate is a bad thing. Let's take race and racism for an example. Any discussion that involves race and racism is more than likely going to be heated, people are going to say things that are going to offend others, but when you think about a discussion like that, more times than not, the heated discussion is where the most work is going to get done.

These things are personal for people and maybe folks don't think they learn from it initiallly, but I can tell you from my own experience, some of the most significant learning experiences I have had in my life came from a heated debate.

[journeymom]

Ah ha! Here's where the rest of the heated discussion is! I'll just repeat what I said on the other thread,

I'm another member here whose political and social beliefs have been deeply influenced and supported by the rousing discussions in the Politics forum. I'm very sad and disappointed that it has been closed.

I only learned about the planned nation-wide protest against the anti gay marriage laws here at MDC, specifically the Politics forum. I then got my daughter involved in making protest signs, and I took my kids down to the capitol and we participated in the march that day. My kids' consciousness was 'raised', they learned about social responsibility and political activism and how it's important to stand up for people whose rights are diminished, even if their own have not. All because I learned in the MDC politics forum that a nation-wide protest was coming up at the end of the week.

This one way the Politics forum was directly related to raising children.

==========

We are not going to have an unmoderated forum.

-Abimommy

Why not?

[AdinaL]

There is a lot of stuff you guys don't see. If you think it isn't that bad, well, it has been.

This isn't a decision that anyone took lightly. It isn't something that was done to punish anyone.

I am the only mod in N&CE right now. I had admins in there helping me. Which of course, means they can't do their actual job. And even when there were three mods in there, we were often overwhelmed.

I volunteer, I have a two year old. I love those forums, always have, but they need a serious rethinking. They take a lot of time and energy. More than some of the core forums.

As abimommy has said, things are still being discussed, the forums are being reviewed.

[Liquesce]

Originally Posted by AdinaL

I am the only mod in N&CE right now. I had admins in there helping me. Which of course, means they can't do their actual job. And even when there were three mods in there, we were often overwhelmed.

I just do wonder why help wasn't more publicly requested, that's all. There are any number of people who frequent the forum and who, as myself, would have been perfectly happy to bow out of discussing the hot topics in the interest of keeping the ability to have them. When I inquired before I was told there were enough moderators, and it was a burnout issue ... but one is clearly not enough, and it seems like by the volume of work involved "enough" can't be defined as anything less than "enough to put on a rotation schedule to prevent individual mods getting overwhelmed."

At any rate, I don't mean to harp on the issue. I know the decision wasn't a simple one, and I do appreciate the work you all have done to leave it as long as you did. It's just that a lot of mamas here do feel like MDC is one of the communities to which they belong ... and I think members of any real community would like at least to feel as though they had the opportunity to contribute to maintaining the health of its elements.

[AdinaL]

There are enough moderators right now...it is burnout that is an issue. We can't keep throwing people in there only to have them cycle out in a few weeks because they are burnt out. So, volunteers aren't the problem. The fact that the forum is very hard to mod for long periods of time is the issue.

The forum needs reworking. And maybe rotating mods through it would be one way to deal with the high volume. But the forum needs some attention before we just continue to throw people at it and hope for the best, you know?

So, it wasn't about not asking for help, but more about the fact that the forum itself was the problem, not the lack of mods. Putting more mods in there would have just meant the forum continued to be a problem, and more people would get burnt out.

I do understand what you are saying, but I have been in the forum since it opened - with abimommy until recently, and we had a lot of folks cycle through. It is an issue of content and presentation that needs to be addressed prior to us hosting this kind of topic again.

And I feel like I have repeated myself 12 times. Sorry.