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Dreaming of Leaving the States... Am I Alone Here? - Page 4

post #61 of 94
I am planning on moving to New Zealand in a few months and am excited. I have traveled a lot, but never lived elsewhere. I am not doing it to protest anything, and I actually quite excited to see Obama in office. But the economy here sucks. We obviously have a great standard of living, but if we move to another country but keep our US incomes then we won't have to worry about debt. For that, I am relieved to be moving right now.

Otherwise, I just don't want o be the average suburban amercian family. I might get flamed for that, but it is my honest fear. If we live abroad a few years every 10 years or so we will never get stuck in the box. I want to be outside my comfort zone and not get stuck. Ever. I could live a great life here, I know, but living elsewhere will help me

I saw a new moving is coming out about this. Revoltionary road? I want to see it.

But really, I know it is a great opportunity for our children and for us. I will let you all know how it goes once I have been there for awhile!
post #62 of 94
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arduinna View Post
Ok I must have been confused I didn't realize that this thread was about leaving in protest, I'm not interested in leaving in protest. I am interested in leaving though.
No, it wasn't about leaving in protest originally. The conversation just went onto that tangent.

I am really enjoying this discussion, and I'm learning a lot.

Those of you who have left the States for similar reasons to mine, where are you living and why?

Any suggestions for countries I should research?
post #63 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoliMum View Post
Anumaria, where do you live? Can you describe your daily life? What is different about your country vs. the States? I am interested in the view from abroad!
Sure.... I am in Finland.

First, here is why I questioned you:

When a person moves, they first see the beautiful buildings, scenery, interesting people, etc. Everything is fascinating and even the negative things seem exotic and can be overlooked. This lasts for some months and then it becomes everyday life: Work, cooking, cleaning, sleep, etc. Oftentimes after the "honeymoon" of the first couple of monts one notices that the everyday life is actually much worse in the new place because the things that one had taken for granted (knowing what to buy in a grocery store, how to pay for a bus, etc.) take tons of time and even more energy. Also, one may realize he has no idea how the people around really think... things just seem... well... FOREIGN.

If one speaks the local language well, that helps, even though it may make it even clearer that people can share a language and yet, really, speak different languages. Then, on top of everything else, there is no family around and it often takes a long time to make real friends. Thus I never ever recommend to anyone to think that living somewhere else is better. I think a happy person is happy just about anywhere and a restless one will remain restless...


But to answer your question. I have read it here before: I live in paradise... Maternity leave is long, (many stay at home for close to a year or even much longer) the mother gets some money for staying at home with the child until the child turns 2 and a smaller amount until 3. The state pays a large part of the child care, so the poorest families pay nothing, etc. No health insurance is needed and it costs next to nothing to see a doctor (although there is also a private system for those who want it). The school system is supposed to be excellent. So... a very safe place to live in in many ways. I have read here how people think that all this equals a child friendly country and some have even discussed immigrating just because of that. (To Sweden, our neighbor, at least.)

So.. while all that is true, here is the other side: Some things cannot be seen or considered by reading laws... People here are very much "This is how it has always been and anyone thinking differently is crazy and strange." Strangers seldom talk to each other and smiling seems to be forbidden. Children seem to be considered great burdens. While there is a lot of cloth diapering and quite a bit of baby wearing, the idea of being nice to one's child has not reach this country, yet. (I am exaggerating, of course.)

The foreigners I know here are often times not doing well. Partly it is the country and its difficult language, partly I think false expectations. It simply is not easy or simple to move away from what you know to something different, leaving behind friends and family. (And you don't even need to like your extended family to feel this loss of the people who share your history.)

My dh is doing ok here, partly because he is really talented with languages and has lived in many countries. However, he would be the first one to tell North Americans to get a reality check before moving to Europe. There are some for whom it is a great thing but we have met many sad cases. My whole point is to have realistic expectations... I don't think the US is the greatest country on earth. To be honest, I just don't think any country can claim to be such. There are good and bad things everywhere but, in the end, people everywhere live their boring, little everyday lives.

This is the problem...Just an example:

country x (being where the person lives) gets 0 points

country z (imaginary country where the person wants to move) gets:
+ 2 for health care
+ 1 for employment opportunities
+ 2 for culture that seems to value families and children
+1 kids become bilinqual
- 1 for being so far from where the relatives are
- 4 for the foreign language and culture (This may get better or worse for the person as time goes on)
-2 kids may end up not knowing where they want to live in the future and always feel a bit in between two cultures
Etc.

Of course this is just an example but here the person would be trading 0 for -1. The person would gain a lot of things he values but would have losses he possibly never saw coming. In the end, he would be in a new place, loving some things while hating some, and wondering what to do and why he had put himself in this position to begin with. By the time he might decide to move back, he would be stuck because his retirement money would be coming from the new place and he could not afford to move. (We know a case like this... really sad!)

And so on, and so on... Gain some and lose some.

But... maybe there are people here who disagree with me.

It is one thing to move when young and quite another when there are children involved. It is not all that fun to have a parent (even worse if it is both) who are more or less outsiders in the new culture, somewhat so even after years and years in the new place.

I could go on and on. Just saying that a heavy dose of realism is needed if one ponders such a move. The feelings only last a couple of months. After that, real reasons are needed.

Our family is here in Finland... for now. We are loving having escaped the US medical system (hated our health insurance) and some of the things in the culture (like how everything on tv has to be over the top). BUT... there are also things we miss. Likewise, there are things we really value here and some that make us talk about moving... somewhere...

So, if you find that perfect place, in reality, not just on paper, please let us know.
post #64 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoliMum View Post
I would like to get out before our DD gets too settled in American life. Already I feel she knows too much. She's not even three yet and already she gets excited about drive-thrus and shopping malls.
BTW, the US has long agogiven this to the rest of the world. So, either you would be moving to a place where this is equally the case or to a place where people don't have enough money to buy as much but they spend every cent they can...
post #65 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoliMum View Post
I also want to stress that I'm not looking for an easier life.
I am, I think we all are! Maybe not lazier, but simpler, happier, easier.

I have romantisized moving to Canada. Every time I visit I fall in love over and over again. DH and I talk about birthing this baby in Canada to give him citizenship. I doubt we will be able to do that. My BIL is trying to go to school in Canada and we may follow him up there some day. Maybe when we retire. I kinda like having the imaginary dream life of me living in Canada.
post #66 of 94
Just wondering... Do people really realize how much more your dollar buys and how many more of them you most likely make each month...

I think that might be one of the biggest shocks for someone moving to Europe. Unless you were able to take with a great salary, you would all of a sudden be living in a much smaller place and having much less to spend. So, instead of doing all the fun stuff you always dreamed of, you might be at home counting your pennies.

This is one of the trade offs for us. We will never be able to afford a house of our own here. Right now we live in a rowhouse, which we rent from my parents. If we had stayed in the US, we would already be living in our own house (well, with a mortgage)... And that starter house would be nicer than what we will ever be able to afford here.

And if you think you don't need fancy things, just that simple life style. Well, that we actually cannot afford, either. I would love a VERY SMALL house in the middle of nowhere. Something very modest. However, that is just not how it works. Such places are taken down and sold to companies which turn the property into apartments... Or, if they are remote enough (and we need it close enough that dh could get to the city for work) they are actually hudely expensive because this sort of simplicity seems to be in now...

We could afford all that in the countryside, where there are no jobs and no social contacts.

To us, the place to fulfil that particular dream would def. be North America.... it is just that some of the other stuff keeps us from moving there. (One huge one being that dh's parents are more distant mentally, mine are great.)
post #67 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anumaria View Post
Sure.... I am in Finland.

First, here is why I questioned you:

When a person moves, they first see the beautiful buildings, scenery, interesting people, etc. Everything is fascinating and even the negative things seem exotic and can be overlooked. This lasts for some months and then it becomes everyday life: Work, cooking, cleaning, sleep, etc. Oftentimes after the "honeymoon" of the first couple of monts one notices that the everyday life is actually much worse in the new place because the things that one had taken for granted (knowing what to buy in a grocery store, how to pay for a bus, etc.) take tons of time and even more energy. Also, one may realize he has no idea how the people around really think... things just seem... well... FOREIGN.

If one speaks the local language well, that helps, even though it may make it even clearer that people can share a language and yet, really, speak different languages. Then, on top of everything else, there is no family around and it often takes a long time to make real friends. Thus I never ever recommend to anyone to think that living somewhere else is better. I think a happy person is happy just about anywhere and a restless one will remain restless...


But to answer your question. I have read it here before: I live in paradise... Maternity leave is long, (many stay at home for close to a year or even much longer) the mother gets some money for staying at home with the child until the child turns 2 and a smaller amount until 3. The state pays a large part of the child care, so the poorest families pay nothing, etc. No health insurance is needed and it costs next to nothing to see a doctor (although there is also a private system for those who want it). The school system is supposed to be excellent. So... a very safe place to live in in many ways. I have read here how people think that all this equals a child friendly country and some have even discussed immigrating just because of that. (To Sweden, our neighbor, at least.)

So.. while all that is true, here is the other side: Some things cannot be seen or considered by reading laws... People here are very much "This is how it has always been and anyone thinking differently is crazy and strange." Strangers seldom talk to each other and smiling seems to be forbidden.

The foreigners I know here are often times not doing well. Partly it is the country and its difficult language, partly I think false expectations. It simply is not easy or simple to move away from what you know to something different, leaving behind friends and family. (And you don't even need to like your extended family to feel this loss of the people who share your history.)



I could go on and on. Just saying that a heavy dose of realism is needed if one ponders such a move. The feelings only last a couple of months. After that, real reasons are needed.

Our family is here in Finland... for now. We are loving having escaped the US medical system (hated our health insurance) and some of the things in the culture (like how everything on tv has to be over the top). BUT... there are also things we miss. Likewise, there are things we really value here and some that make us talk about moving... somewhere...

So, if you find that perfect place, in reality, not just on paper, please let us know.
snipped some of the comment that didn't pertain to my life in Holland, but, basically, it's the same in Holland as Anumaria describes Finland.

There are some wonderful social benefits (not as good as Finland's though!) and a lot of fantastic things about living in Holland.

My family is there now and I've built up a fabulous network of friends. but it took me *9* years before it began to feel like home -- and I was a backbacker (met my DH in siberia!), spoke other languages (though not Dutch) and had lived abroad twice before coming to Holland.

It can be a great adventure, but, at a certain point, you're going to be so annoyed that you can't find whatever ingredient you want/need for something, it's no longer fun to find substitutes, a bus driver will yell at you for not understanding exactly what you're supposed to do in a given situation, and you'll wear the wrong thing to a wedding -- and you won't be able to laugh it off and you'll feel very homesick and miserable indeed. Now, of course, you can overcome these things (i have!), but it can be a very lonely experience, even with family in tow.
post #68 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arduinna View Post
Ok I must have been confused I didn't realize that this thread was about leaving in protest, I'm not interested in leaving in protest. I am interested in leaving though.
No, there were just some that wanted to leave in protest, others, like me, just prefer other parts of the world. I am partial to the northern near-east and Asia-Europe thresholds (Istanbul, St. Petersburg, etc...) I just love it.

Quote:
When a person moves, they first see the beautiful buildings, scenery, interesting people, etc. Everything is fascinating and even the negative things seem exotic and can be overlooked. This lasts for some months and then it becomes everyday life: Work, cooking, cleaning, sleep, etc. Oftentimes after the "honeymoon" of the first couple of monts one notices that the everyday life is actually much worse in the new place because the things that one had taken for granted (knowing what to buy in a grocery store, how to pay for a bus, etc.) take tons of time and even more energy. Also, one may realize he has no idea how the people around really think... things just seem... well... FOREIGN.
YES. And I would add, one thing we Americans can never understand until we try our darndest, for decades, is that unlike here or in Canada, or even Mexico, and possibly some L. American countries of which I am not aware (because I've only been to Mexico), you can never become a real Norwegian as an immigrant. Or a Russian. Or Chinese, or Japanese, or Dutch, or French. Here, even when we hear someone speak English with a heavy accent, if they are a citizen and they are generally optimistic about America and want to change their life and work together to improve the country, the majority of native-born citizens agree: *they are real Americans*. They are ours.

This DOES NOT happen in most other countries. You will NEVER become a real Turk, or Russian, or Japanese, or Frenchman to most of the people in those countries. Yes, you can convert to Islam or Orthodoxy or Shintuism or speak French without an accent, but you weren't born there and you will be an immigrant. You will be the American or the Canadian who became a Muslim / got a Russian passport. You will be "almost like one of ours". And your children don't have nearly as much hope, either.

I think for me, learning that was a big surprise. Because I wanted to make a home elsewhere, and then I realized it was not going to happen, not like I expected. It is hard to understand the pain of feeling that you will never be fully accepted except as a foreigner when you want to make some place your new home, but if you are serious about moving abroad, you need to take that into consideration. And that goes even if you marry a native, as well.

It is not something bad about other countries- it is just that we here in the Americas have a totally different attitude towards immigrants.
post #69 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by EdnaMarie View Post
Did you wash your husband's and a baby's laundry, too? Because I did that and it was fine until I had to do it for three. And then another on the way. Hah!
Heh, I just washed mine and my partner's laundry. I suppose it would be different with kids! The charm would fade quickly, I imagine.

Quote:
If you are earning American dollars and using your American passport, then
what you are really talking about is living the expat life, not necessarily leaving America. Because as long as you are using those dollars and working for that job, paying taxes or not, you are still supporting the political system here.

I am not saying you won't enjoy living on a boat. But frankly, the salaried expatriate life is not much of a protest, in my opinion. If you are leaving for political reasons, consider leaving the system entirely and forsaking those American dollars and getting and saving your salary in rubles or yuan or pesos or at LEAST Euros (frankly, not that much more ethical, if you look into it...).
I'm not really leaving as protest, though. I'm leaving because I, personally, don't want to watch "the decline" as I call it.

I'm an anarchist (well, an anarcho-capitalist). So, in order for me to really live in line with my values/ideals, I'd have to give up ALL my passports, and renounce citizenship of ALL the countries to which I belong.

Obviously, I can't do that as governments exist everywhere and will probably continue to exist for several more centuries, if not forever. And, I must be a citizen of some country in order to live somewhere in the world.

So, my move is to mainly remove as much of my monetary governmental support (taxes) as possible. Hence picking a country in which to establish residency that is the lowest in terms of paying taxes.

I'm not greedy, and I DO believe in giving back to the community, to charities, etc. I do give money to organizations, and always plan on continuing that, I'm just trying to minimize the amount going to organizations I don't support personally.

Beyond that, I'm a total nomad. For me, there's nothing better than a permanent home that has the capacity to move around the world - like a sailboat. Plus, I love sailing ... hence the username. I want to see as much of the world as I can while I'm here on earth. Before I'm beamed back to my Home Planet, of course.

I'm actually saddened that I won't be around for the time period of space colonization. I think it will happen in the future - humans will leave this galaxy eventually.

If I had the opportunity now - I'd totally go off in search of unknown planets.

Would anyone else here move that far? To another planet/galaxy? I think it would be the best of adventures. But, that could be my over active imagination.
post #70 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by EVC View Post
Hey there from another RPCV Where were you?
Hi! Nice to meetcha DH and I were in the Philippines.
post #71 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailor View Post
I'm actually saddened that I won't be around for the time period of space colonization. I think it will happen in the future - humans will leave this galaxy eventually.

If I had the opportunity now - I'd totally go off in search of unknown planets.

Would anyone else here move that far? To another planet/galaxy? I think it would be the best of adventures. But, that could be my over active imagination.
Me too!
post #72 of 94
I think something else people don't really consider is how closed the job market really is to immigrants in a lot of countries. Here in the US being an immigrant doesn't disqualify you on the face. US employers are generally willing to accept foreign credentials if they have been validated by a third part accreditation service. In some countries like Germany, that simply is not enough and is a real problem. Many people just give up and go back to wherever they came from or move to a third country.
post #73 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by EVC View Post
LOL, I was just going to say, when I lived abroad (in Eastern Europe) we didn't even have a washer. I had to HANDWASH everything! Now THAT is really doing laundry all day. Sometimes more than one day

In general, I don't think moving abroad gives you an easier life. It just gives you a different life. One that some people--such as myself--prefer for whatever reason ....
Yup And I too remember the multi-day laundry But I felt that, at least I was outside, in a beautiful place and I got a lot of satisfaction in doing something so basic for myself, ykwim?

I actually miss a lot of the "doing without." Of course, I did miss things and treats were nice too when we traveled to a city or something. And there was one French expat there who made the most AMAZING pizzas (I wasn't vegan then...lol). I find I just needed a little indulgence to hold onto every once in a while, and it made the "doing without" not only bearable but enjoyable, because we appreciated things so much more...I think everybody is different in this area....
post #74 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by MamaEli View Post
We dream of going back to Kenya at least weekly. We would need good jobs there and we're gone.......
Kenya was my absolute favorite place that I've ever been to. It completely felt like "home" to me while I was there, and I can relate!
post #75 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by UmmZaynab View Post
I have lived out of the country and it was a very eye-opening experience. I think that, regardless of how you feel about the direction popular culture and politics is taking, you will be surprised how hard it is to live outside your own country. I am talking about everything from daily living (yes, those washing machines DO take forever and try doing your laundry that way when you only have 4 hours of water each day), economically, politically, socially, etc.

I have met many people who idealize European countries for their egalitarian social policies, but many people don't realize that many of those countries are also very racist and bigoted against people who are not like their "approved" people.

Last year a new mom moved into town and joined our mom's group. She immediately latched on to me because, it seemed, I'm Muslim and I wear hijab so she figured I was also probably really anti-American. Well, I'm not and she proceeded to spend an hour ranting on about how bad she thinks our country is and how she wants to leave-- but she has never been outside the country before herself. With all due respect to those of you who might sympathize with somebody like that, I wanted to smack this woman! I was extremely offended both by her rhetoric as well as the fact that she stereotyped me as a person who would be receptive to her "America sucks and can never be redeemed and Europe is utopia" nonsense.

I managed to stay civil and I told her this: People are people no matter where you go. The powerful and rich always will try (and succeed in times and places) to take over the means of powerful to use it for their own ends. But if we care about the place where we are from, it is our duty not to abandon it but to stay there and try to change it as long as our life and basic well-being are not threatened. Yes, there are people who immigrate from country to country, and that's okay on a small scale. (My dh is an immigrant and will not likely return to his native country, although like all immigrants he does sometimes dream it might be possible.) But if people in large groups get the idea that "this country is going to hell so I'll just leave", well then what will become of the country when all the people (especially in democracy... hello, do you vote?) who are concerned about its direction just leave it to the people who don't care? Especially with the US being so powerful, it is our responsibility to stay here and make as much noise as we can, and try to gain as much influence as possible to change things. If we are upset at the way our foreign policy treats other people, then we need to do something about it. Leaving the country to the people who think the direction of our politics and society is just fine will only result in more of it. And look how many people around the world suffer when that is the case!

This is exactly what happens in countries under totalitarian rule, like Iraq, and what causes the people there to lose their ability to function as a coherent society. Why is Iraq such a mess? Because people lost their sense of responsibility to their country and greater society. I see this in other countries in the region too. When the government is corrupt and rules by dividing and frightening people, people no longer have a sense of civic duty, honesty, decency, anymore. It becomes every man for himself. Lying and cheating and stealing in order to get by become normal and ingrained into peoples' psyches. They're not bad people at all, but they have been socialized to behave that way and I think it takes generations to re-inculcate a sense of civic duty in people. Are we going to allow ourselves to lose that (we already have started losing it to a degree) simply because some shady dudes have taken over the government?

I see bumper stickers that say "proud to be an American". I would change that to be "humbled to be a American". We live a lot better than most of the world does, and that has come by the exploitation and harming of a lot of other people in the world. We need to fix that. I believe that with sustainable environmental practices, we can allow the rest of the world to live as comfortably as we do (and I'm talking about basics here, because I also disapprove of consumerism) without the high cost and the exploitation. It is only by God's will that we happened to be born (or allowed to immigrate) here and enjoy this kind of life. With the way the environment is going (i.e., global warming) we may also not be able to live this way forever. So I am humbled-- humbled by the great gift it has been to be an American, humbled by the fact that our forefathers did some not-so-nice things to get us to where we are, and moreso humbled by the responsibility it all carries. You can only be proud of something you have accomplished, not by something you are by virtue of birth or, for that matter, something that is simply handed to you by another country. You can go abroad and brag "I now live in a neutral country that doesn't bomb anyone" but what did YOU do to accomplish that?

We are such a large country with many different cultures all mashed together. I know pop culture wants us to believe we are all the same, but we are not. I learned that first-hand when I moved from the NE to the SW of the country. Everything is different! So as others said, the whole of our country is not the vacuous suburbia consumerism pit that the media and pop culture might try to tell you it is.

So go abroad to visit. It will make you appreciate what you have here. Then come back.

Stepping off my
Wonderfull post! Although I would still love to live abroad, I agree with you in principle and believe we need to work for change here as well...
post #76 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by EdnaMarie View Post


YES. And I would add, one thing we Americans can never understand until we try our darndest, for decades, is that unlike here or in Canada, or even Mexico, and possibly some L. American countries of which I am not aware (because I've only been to Mexico), you can never become a real Norwegian as an immigrant. Or a Russian. Or Chinese, or Japanese, or Dutch, or French. Here, even when we hear someone speak English with a heavy accent, if they are a citizen and they are generally optimistic about America and want to change their life and work together to improve the country, the majority of native-born citizens agree: *they are real Americans*. They are ours.

This DOES NOT happen in most other countries. You will NEVER become a real Turk, or Russian, or Japanese, or Frenchman to most of the people in those countries. Yes, you can convert to Islam or Orthodoxy or Shintuism or speak French without an accent, but you weren't born there and you will be an immigrant. You will be the American or the Canadian who became a Muslim / got a Russian passport. You will be "almost like one of ours". And your children don't have nearly as much hope, either.

I think for me, learning that was a big surprise. Because I wanted to make a home elsewhere, and then I realized it was not going to happen, not like I expected. It is hard to understand the pain of feeling that you will never be fully accepted except as a foreigner when you want to make some place your new home, but if you are serious about moving abroad, you need to take that into consideration. And that goes even if you marry a native, as well.

It is not something bad about other countries- it is just that we here in the Americas have a totally different attitude towards immigrants.
Absolutely. Such a good point!

I speak good Dutch, have lived there nine years, and, this summer, will have earned my PhD at a Dutch University. i have a Dutch husband and a 1/2 Dutch kid who speaks better Dutch than English and whose always gone to Dutch public schools. But I'm "the American mom." I'm accepted when i volunteer at the school, I have friends, everyone is fine with me and mostly keeps the anti-Americanism toned down when I'm around, but in their minds, I'll never, ever be Dutch. That's ok, but it is a big difference.

Furthermore, my son is officially classified as "of foreign origin" for Dutch population statistics, even though he was born in Amsterdam and has a Dutch father!
post #77 of 94
Quote:
Furthermore, my son is officially classified as "of foreign origin" for Dutch population statistics, even though he was born in Amsterdam and has a Dutch father!
I'm so sorry. That really sucks! Does he find it difficult or has he found his niche?

Quote:
at least I was outside, in a beautiful place and I got a lot of satisfaction in doing something so basic for myself, ykwim?
I know, although you were in a warm climate, weren't you? I was in Russia and when the electricity went out we had just enough boiled water to wash our underwear. Also having an infant in cloth diapers (EC or not) changes one's perspective on that. I'm always torn. I love the mountains but being in the cold without electricity really sucks.
post #78 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by DariusMom View Post
But I'm "the American mom." I'm accepted when i volunteer at the school, I have friends, everyone is fine with me and mostly keeps the anti-Americanism toned down when I'm around, but in their minds, I'll never, ever be Dutch. That's ok, but it is a big difference.

Furthermore, my son is officially classified as "of foreign origin" for Dutch population statistics, even though he was born in Amsterdam and has a Dutch father!
Yes.. and it is completely different, yet, if both parents are foreigners and neither speaks the local language like a native. That can be veru tough for the kids.
post #79 of 94
I have been thinking about you...

Maybe what you are really looking for is more simplicity and meaning in your life. Maybe, instead of dreaming of moving abroad, a change in lifestyle is what you really need. Maybe a move to a smaller city nearby, into a small cottage, an intentional community, something...

THAT would be a more realistic way to find the lifestyle that you seem to crave. Maybe you could go to the library (or even just online) and see if you might be inspired by books about "small house living", voluntary simplicity, living off the grid or some such.

Some of these ideologies are what gives me joy and energy. And the thing is, while I am in Europe, the place where many of these life styles can be more realistic, space and money wise, is right there in the US.
post #80 of 94
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anumaria View Post
I have been thinking about you...

Maybe what you are really looking for is more simplicity and meaning in your life. Maybe, instead of dreaming of moving abroad, a change in lifestyle is what you really need. Maybe a move to a smaller city nearby, into a small cottage, an intentional community, something...

THAT would be a more realistic way to find the lifestyle that you seem to crave. Maybe you could go to the library (or even just online) and see if you might be inspired by books about "small house living", voluntary simplicity, living off the grid or some such.

Some of these ideologies are what gives me joy and energy. And the thing is, while I am in Europe, the place where many of these life styles can be more realistic, space and money wise, is right there in the US.
You know, you have a point there. Thank you for your thoughtful insight.

It's not like I'm looking to pack up and move right away. I just dream about it all the time, and I wanted to know if I was the only one. Apparently not!

I think my realistic goal is to move somewhere more liberal and natural, like Oregon. It would also be more geographically feasible to spend time in Canada without actually living there. Or perhaps after many visits we'd find that we want to move there. (Hello healthcare! ) I'm open to any possibility.

I do want to travel each continent no matter where my home ends up. I want my daughter to grow up not only aware of other cultures, but experiencing them too.
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