If you're not finding out the gender...

[AfricanQueen99]

Do you and your partner have the same ideas on RIC?

I would love the idea of a surprise, but my old man is very much for having a circ'd son. I sort of keep telling myself that if we find out the bean is a boy at 20 weeks then I'll have that many weeks to make my case. Other then talking about a potential boy and working my case for the entire pregnancy I don't know what to do. Thoughts? We both have valid reasons for our sides. I'm not trying to throw my husband under the bus here. It's just, like everything else, I feel that *my* side is the most important one.

FTR, my husband is technically Jewish, but considers himself Agnostic. I only mention this because, as a Jewish infant, he had a routine/cultural circ.

[Picturesque]

We are not finding out the gender but we would never circ. Didn't circ DS, either. Good luck with your DH. The CAC forum has lots and lots of resources for discussing with stubborn partners.

[Dmitrizmom]

Not planning on finding out the sex. We didn't circ ds. Dh is in agreement.

[MichelleAnnette]

We would never do RIC and don't find out the gender. If this were an issue in my house, I would start convincing him now because I simply would not allow it to happen. If dh and I disagree on something, I say here, read what I have read and then read up on your position and THEN we'll talk about it. Every time, he defers to me because he trusts my judgment and knows I did my homework. In my house, those who don't want to learn, do not make decisions. It goes the other way on other issues that I don't want to learn about, so it works for us.

[Lula's Mom]

By force of habit (I used to moderate the Case Against Circumcision forum!) I must say, we can't discuss Jewish circumcision. But since he is not asking for it to be done for religious reasons and you're calling it RIC...

Like Picturesque said, spend a bunch of time in the CAC forum. The regulars there can help you with the proper way to present the facts to your husband. And we can talk about it here. I don't want to sound harsh against him, but there really are not any valid (read: medically indicated) reasons for RIC. He may have emotional reasons, but the feelings of an adult man don't trump the right of a newborn boy to his full genital integrity, you know?

Both my ex-DH and now-DH are circumcised but did not want to circumcise our children. It would not have happened if they did want to, though.

[AfricanQueen99]

Originally Posted by Lula's Mom

He may have emotional reasons, but the feelings of an adult man don't trump the right of a newborn boy to his full genital integrity, you know?

I know, but in our home feelings are valid - all feelings. So I am trying to take into account his feelings and rework them. Like I said, I am not throwing him under the bus. As a Jew he had no say (nor did his family) in his circ. And cultural feelings take a long time to move from, but, you're right, this would be under the constraints of RIC.

I've been peeking in CAC, but I didn't want to post in there. As I've read there are very strong opinions and my goal isn't to make my husband look like an ass. I'll go back and poke around.

Times like this make MDC a difficult board for me. So many women with exactly the same parenting philosophies, but I found myself at a crossroads with a mainstream spouse.

[AfricanQueen99]

Originally Posted by MichelleAnnette

We would never do RIC and don't find out the gender. If this were an issue in my house, I would start convincing him now because I simply would not allow it to happen. If dh and I disagree on something, I say here, read what I have read and then read up on your position and THEN we'll talk about it. Every time, he defers to me because he trusts my judgment and knows I did my homework. In my house, those who don't want to learn, do not make decisions. It goes the other way on other issues that I don't want to learn about, so it works for us.

That's pretty much the approach I've taken with every other parenting aspect. I think I'll put information together for his next OOT trip. I figure five hours on a plane should be enough time to read about this and agree I'm not insane.

[joeys_mom]

I won't find out the sex and did not circ my ds. DH agreed. This would be one issue I would go to mat for however.

[Lula's Mom]

I'm not saying your husband didn't come by his feelings honestly. There are lots of men who feel the same. You'll find that many, many mamas here go to the CAC forum and post about exactly your situation. They want their husbands on the same page, and they do get help there to accomplish that. The emotions do run high in there, because when you come down to it, RIC is a human rights violation.

I respect that you care about his feelings- I care deeply what my husband feels too! But like a pp said- I'd go to the mat on this one, because what my husband feels and the protection my son deserves from being cut without his consent are not something I can give equal weight to.
Must go, back later to talk more.

[mom2tig99Nroo03]

my ds was cut, and if this baby is a boy he will NOT be.

maybe print out the thread from CAC "if you regret circing...."

[Lula's Mom]

Yes! That sticked Regret thread is one of the most powerful things I've ever read. It is heartbreaking to read, but at the same time it makes you hopeful that other boys will be spared, and other parents will not have to feel the pain of realizing after the fact that circumcision really is a big deal and they wish they'd researched it more.

[mom2tig99Nroo03]

angela, how does he feel about bf? is he at least passionate about how good it is for y'all? if so, let him know that a little one that has been cut frequently has nursing/latching troubles...

[OTMomma]

If I thought finding out the gender would help our family make better decisions for our kid, we'd find out- hands down. I have no clue though if discussing the hypothetical is enough at your house or not to make it a real discussion.

We don't circ- dh was RIC and was VERY opposed to that happening to ds.

[midwestmeg]

I think I understand what you are saying regarding US for gender and RIC.

I was ready to have a US with my last pregnancy b/c dh said 'we'll discuss circ later' and I know his mom (a dr) and family (also dr's) are very pro-circ. So my feeling was that I *needed* to know the gender so that we could have this discussion. Well, dh likes the surprise at the birth so much, he relented and sat down for a real discussion with me.

I tried not to push it (although I had already done the research to see how courts side in these situations) and he told me all about how pro-circ and blah,blah,blah he was but that if I REALLY didn't want it done to our children he'd respect that b/c we make parenting decisions together.

Oh I wanted to push the issue all over the place but I let it go- I assume his position relates to the fact that it was done to him and some bs that he isn't ready to admit to.

Now he watches his intact son and actually even did admit that he is happy we let him be. :

So there ya go. I've kinda been there mama and I agree that your partners feeling count also. Meg

[Pinkbruise]

We're not finding out the sex but circ is not an issue here.

DH was cut, but I only had to show him the video of a little baby boy being cut once and he said "I will never do that to my child"

DS is intact

[AfricanQueen99]

Originally Posted by mom2tig99Nroo03

maybe print out the thread from CAC "if you regret circing...."

I know that would work for a lot of men, but my dh would absolutely get annoyed at "scare tactics" (as he would call them). I pulled up a bunch of sites yesterday and I'm going to write him a letter with quotes and research and whatnot. He's a smart, empathetic man. I know he'll see the light, but, like it was mentioned, it might be hard for him to come to grips with his one penis if we're doing something different with a newbie. He'll get there.

[AfricanQueen99]

Originally Posted by mom2tig99Nroo03

angela, how does he feel about bf? is he at least passionate about how good it is for y'all? if so, let him know that a little one that has been cut frequently has nursing/latching troubles...

Nursing is important for all of us. Maybe I'll add that point to my letter.

Meg - I'm glad somebody gets me. I'm not trying to make this husband of mine as some neanderthal that wants to hurt babies. He might be a pain in the ass, but he's my pain in the ass.

[midwestmeg]

Originally Posted by AfricanQueen99

Meg - I'm glad somebody gets me. I'm not trying to make this husband of mine as some neanderthal that wants to hurt babies. He might be a pain in the ass, but he's my pain in the ass.

Yep, I know whatcha mean. I love/guard/protect my babies with all of my heart, but they wouldn't be here without the help and support from my partner- and his opinion counts also.

We live next door to my SIL, who had a boy six months before we did and circ'd 'just cause' and it hurt my heart (and I had gently given her info by passing on Mothering Mags). It took me a long time to wrap my head around it.... but in the end I concluded that they love their son very much, it is a legal and advocated procedure in our area and they aren't locking him in a closet or withholding love or food or anything. So, I made peace with it. Not great, but the best rationalization I could do. Then my other SIL who has become anti-circ threatened to rip off everyones fingernails b/c they MIGHT become infected someday and had a HUGE anti-circ tirade at dinner... haha.

[wearbaby]

My DH was absolutely FOR RIC. DS1 I did some research when we found out we had a boy. I decided I was against it, but DH was adamant. And after my CS, I told DH if he wanted it done, he had to sign the consent. He did and DS1 is regretfully circed. Pregnancy #2, I planned a HBAC. I knew circ would come up again. We did not find out sex this time. DH was again, adamant about circ. The more I read the harder it was to let it happen. PLUS it is just more complicated when you homebirth! I told DH that I was not going to help him at all get this done. I told him I would go to the appt (if he could set it up) and refuse to sign consent. I don't think he believed me! After DS2 was born (surprise another boy!!) DH dropped it because he realized how much work it would be to get all that done without my help/support. Now, almost a year later, DH is satisfied with the intact results of my persistence. LOL. He saw the Penn and Teller video and realized that the foreskin is extremely functional. I showed him there are adult males regrowing foreskin, and how you can never take it back once you cut. Friends think I'm crazy for having one circed and one intact, but the kids don't care. Joshua (my son who is circed) is 3 and commented on his brother penis for the first time last week. He said "mommy River has a big wee wee". And that was that.

[black balloon]

We're not finding out the gender (I know it's a boy, though, in my heart), but we're a family. He's not cut and nobody else in his family is, so it's not something we want for our little boy either.