So we're not vaxing...but now what? How do we stay healthy?

[BarnMomma]

orry for the string of posts all of a sudden but we're losing sleep suddenly over this stuff.

So son is 18 months and is not vaxed. Up until 72 hours ago we werwe FINE with this until I began to think about Tetanus and the time we spend at our stable. So I've been reading 24/7 for 3 days trying to make heads or tails about it all. And int he process I'm now completely shaken up over our decision not to vax, not because I trust vaccines but becasue I'm now leaning about all the ways DS can get sick.

So here's my question....

If we don't vax at all what steps do we take to remain healthy?

So far we:
1. still nurse with no plans to stop
2. Eat only local organic natural produce/pastured grass fed meats and raw dairy, whole grains
3. No OTC or Rx drugs
4. 70% natural ...we try our best...personal care products
5. Lots of outdoor time and "healthy dirt" play in all weather
6. Good hygeine
7. I'm kind f a germophobe so if a toy is dropped onto the floor of the grocery store...gets washed before returned to DS, i hand wash lots, use natural wipes for son when we're out
8. no day care

But what else? I read something about not spending time with recently vaxed kids? HE does take a Music Together class so what about that?


HELP!!!!!!! I'm so worked up over this.

[Mirzam]

Vaccinations do not confer health, just the opposite. I have two completely unvaxed children, one is 11 and the other will be 9 in ten days. I did nothing different caring for them as I did my older child who was vaxed (to a degree). All three have never had antibiotics, nor have they ever needed to see a doctor because of illness, and the oldest is 18. I am no germaphobe and don't do anything with the exception of ensuring they are not exposed to toxins (environmental, pharmaceutical, dietary etc) to the best of my ability, and eat a nutrient dense, whole food diet. I have never limited their exposure to vaxed children, how is the honestly possible, short of keeping them at home all the time?

My best advice to you is raise happy, stress and anxiety free kids because happy people are healthy people. So stressing out about keeping your children healthy isn't going to help.

[kolleen9]

I'm not sure if they are still giving live vaccines anymore, are they? I know when my son was young the polio one was *sometimes* given, but all the others were dead vaccines. So keeping away from vax'd kids might not even be an issue.

As for anything else, looks like you have it all under control. Although, from extensive experience, I can't stress enough about getting lots and lots of leafy green vegetables each day.

In 2004 I had a brain tumor and was juicing for all my meals, which meant the kid was juicing also. He had the strongest immune system and my sister (the virus hunter) was amazed at how he was fighting off everything.

I'll admit that I've been lax here and there since then, so now we take Leaf Greens by AIM everyday.

Otherwise, I agree with the pp, don't stress, it'll make you worse!

hth,
Kolleen

[Gitti]

If you have researched vaccines thoroughly you know that they prime the immune system for diseases. So, since you didn't vaccinate your child, why worry about all what could happen. Most likely it won't.

Now it is time to trust his unaltered, healthy and strong immune system. That is what it is there for. Read about "childhood diseases" and how beneficial they actually are.

http://vaclib.org/basic/vaxhealth.htm
http://www.healing.org/Child-chap%2011.html

Surely your child will get something from time to time. That only strengthens his immune system. That's what it's for.

Take each "VPD" one at a time and research it here in the archives. None are dangerous to a healthy child. There are doctors who believe they are beneficial. When I was a child EVERYONE had measles, mumps and chicken pox (just to name a few) and I never knew anyone who died or got any adverse reaction. Those diseases were considered 'a rite of passage'. We welcomed them so that we got them over with and grow up healthy. Kids were sent to houses where they had the infection. No one thought of them as life threatening. (This is quite different during times of wars, famine or major catastrophes.)

Tetanus has never been a problem for kids not even when they lived in mud and on the farm and there were no vaccines for it. Besides, they don't even know whether the vaccines does anything at all since it is watered down so much to be almost nothing but water.

Originally Posted by BarnMomma

So far we:
1. still nurse with no plans to stop
2. Eat only local organic natural produce/pastured grass fed meats and raw dairy, whole grains
3. No OTC or Rx drugs
4. 70% natural ...we try our best...personal care products
5. Lots of outdoor time and "healthy dirt" play in all weather

Sounds good up to here. Except here I would really include fluoride free water. Research fluoride. It is a poison.


But the rest I would go easy on:

6. Good hygeine
7. I'm kind f a germophobe so if a toy is dropped onto the floor of the grocery store...gets washed before returned to DS, i hand wash lots, use natural wipes for son when we're out
8. no day care

Didn't you ever meet some really dirty little kids who run outside in the middle of winter without a coat and play in the filthy snow, or run all summer barefoot and dirty, yet they are healthy?

I would not suggest to go that far, but why do you think they are the healthy ones? Maybe being fed is good enough for health? Maybe they get some strength from playing in dirt?

Of course we should not live in the barn nor in the outhouse...

And day care? My grandsons have always been around a lot of other kids. Not day care, but they might as well have been since their mom takes them to all sort of classes. She never worried about them getting sick because of exposure to other kids. And yet, they are the healthiest in the bunch.

What else?

HELP!!!!!!! I'm so worked up over this.

You have to show confidence in your child's health. How do you expect him to believe that he is a healthy little kid if you look at him as a victim to every bacteria that is on him or lives in him?

Do you know what separates humans from microorganisms? NOTHING. They live on us and in us. And we NEED them. Without them we can not survive. They are our life-line.

Before people knew that there were such things as germs, they never worried about them. How did we get to this stage where we think we need to worry about something that we have no control over? Who instilled that fear and what was their goal? (I think you know the answers.)



Bacteria and all other microorganisms have been on this earth much longer than we have been here. They will survive and outlive us by far. For now we have learned to live in a symbiotic way. Not interfering with them is by far the smartest thing we can do. This keeps things in balance. When they get out of balance, like by vaccinating against a few, it creates a loophole for others and gives them the advantage over us.

I look at the concept of yin and yang in Chinese philosophy. That is all about balance. If one disappears, the other must disappear as well, leaving emptiness. I apply that to the whole body. It must always be balanced to be healthy. Vaccines (and most other modern medicine) damage that balance for the rest of our natural lives. And so, it can only create imbalance or sickness.


A couple of very important things you totally forgot in your quest for health: Contentment. Thoughtfulness. Peace. Tolerance. Acceptance. Tranquility. And most importantly, unconditional LOVE. Without them health is not possible either.

A child must feel that you trust him and that you love him every day. Everything you do must be done out of UNCONDITIONAL love for that child.

[BarnMomma]

Didn't you ever meet some really dirty little kids who run outside in the middle of winter without a coat and play in the filthy snow, or run all summer barefoot and dirty, yet they are healthy?

I would not suggest to go that far, but why do you think they are the healthy ones? Maybe being fed is good enough for health? Maybe they get some strength from playing in dirt?


(sorry I haven't figured out how to use the quote thing)

I probably gave you the wrong impression. We are THAT family. My son rarely has clothes on in the summer so forget shoes. I grow most of our food so we're always covered in dirt. And when we're not doing that, we're at the barn riding our horses while DS hops all over the barn following the tractors around. I"m more of a germophobe in places like the mall...yuck. But outdoor dirt has always been my friend.

And as for the water we don't do flouride anywhere. Not in water, toothpaste, nothing. Even out pool is filtered and we use ions not chlorine.

We've always been very peaceful, and calm, and relaxed. And unconditional love has never been a question...not sure what gave you that idea.

As I said three days ago I had a moment of doubt and it freaked me out. I felt I needed more answers. I don't think that's a bad thing. I think it means I love my child and I want to make certain I am doing the very best for him.

[buttercupmama]

Your son's chances of getting sick are no greater because he is unvaccinated. If the VADs are worrying you because statistics are skewed to show only unvaccinated or partially vaccinated children get them, don't fall prey to the fear mongering. VADs happen in vaccinated children but may look quite a bit different. The theory of immunity is nothing more than just that--a theory. It's based on anecdotal evidence. Would you really be okay with your child receiving 20+ times what is considered a toxic dose of aluminum based on pure observation? I'm sure you wouldn't.

If other illnesses are worrying you, take this from another germophobe. Not only can we not avoid all germs, but we shoiuldn't. If we keep our environment too sterile, how do we build up natural immunities? I don't mind getting sick, I just don't like feeling sick. And when I feel it coming on, I immediately begin taking megadoses of vitamin C. It helps the body create T cells to fight illness naturally. With enough vitamin C, you probably won't even feel sick. Meanwhile, your body is busy creating natural immunity. This is the way I believe nature intended it. Helping the body to function as it was meant to, not simply masking/eradicating symptoms.

[peainthepod]

Originally Posted by BarnMomma

I probably gave you the wrong impression. We are THAT family. My son rarely has clothes on in the summer so forget shoes. I grow most of our food so we're always covered in dirt. And when we're not doing that, we're at the barn riding our horses while DS hops all over the barn following the tractors around. I"m more of a germophobe in places like the mall...yuck. But outdoor dirt has always been my friend.

I totally understand having self-doubt about vaccines and your son's health. We have the opposite life--we live in a densely populated city full of tons and tons of garbage and pollution and people who may or may not be infected with various vaccine-available diseases. Most everyone I know vaccinates on schedule and their kids always seem to be sick with the latest cough and cold and ear infection and sinus infection and it seems like all of them have severe allergies.

Your son is strengthening his immune system every time he is exposed to dirt and germs. He's better equipped to fight off infection with every infection he fights off. His body knows how to protect him, so the best thing you can do is trust that it will. Have you read How to Raise a Healthy Child in Spite of Your Doctor yet? Robert Mendelsohn, the author, was a highly esteemed pediatrician who was ostracized after writing it because he dared to show parents how to treat vaccine-available diseases, ear infections, and other common illnesses at home instead of encouraging them to live in fear of childhood diseases. I cannot recommend that book highly enough--it really set my mind at ease when we were deciding whether to vaccinate or not.

One last thing: do you live in fear of scarlet fever? What about bubonic plague? Both of those diseases are endemic in the United States. Both can result in complications that permanently injure and even kill babies. But you probably don't even think about them, right? That's because the pharmaceutical industry hasn't (yet) marketed vaccines for them. You haven't been trained to fear them, so you don't.

When I was a baby, no one had even heard of HIB. Meningitis happened, of course, but so rarely in healthy children that it was barely a concern. Now a vaccine exists for it and every HIB infection makes headline news and presto! You're scared of a disease you wouldn't even know about if someone hadn't decided you should be scared of it.

This is getting long-winded so let me just say that as cliche as it is, knowledge is power and the more you read about specific vaccine-available diseases and how to recognize and treat them, and the more you learn about the vaccine business and how incredibly profitable it is, the less you'll have to fear from not vaccinating. The emperor has no clothes.

Whatever you decide, it's awesome that you're taking the time to research and read instead of blindly vaccinating because some doctor told you to. You're a wonderful mama who is doing the best she can for her son.

[Arduinna]

I've never felt the need to do anything special, just because we are no vax. I go about my life as usual. I do avoid sick people in general just because I don't like getting sick.

[Arduinna]

Originally Posted by BarnMomma

orry for the string of posts all of a sudden but we're losing sleep suddenly over this stuff.

So son is 18 months and is not vaxed. Up until 72 hours ago we werwe FINE with this until I began to think about Tetanus and the time we spend at our stable. So I've been reading 24/7 for 3 days trying to make heads or tails about it all. And int he process I'm now completely shaken up over our decision not to vax, not because I trust vaccines but becasue I'm now leaning about all the ways DS can get sick.

So here's my question....

If we don't vax at all what steps do we take to remain healthy?

So far we:
1. still nurse with no plans to stop
2. Eat only local organic natural produce/pastured grass fed meats and raw dairy, whole grains
3. No OTC or Rx drugs
4. 70% natural ...we try our best...personal care products
5. Lots of outdoor time and "healthy dirt" play in all weather
6. Good hygeine
7. I'm kind f a germophobe so if a toy is dropped onto the floor of the grocery store...gets washed before returned to DS, i hand wash lots, use natural wipes for son when we're out
8. no day care

But what else? I read something about not spending time with recently vaxed kids? HE does take a Music Together class so what about that?


HELP!!!!!!! I'm so worked up over this.

Wouldn't you be doing all those things regardless?

[alegna]

What do vaxes have to do with staying healthy?

-Angela

[Gitti]

Originally Posted by BarnMomma

As I said three days ago I had a moment of doubt and it freaked me out. I felt I needed more answers. I don't think that's a bad thing. I think it means I love my child and I want to make certain I am doing the very best for him.

[Scattershoot]

Originally Posted by alegna

What do vaxes have to do with staying healthy?

-Angela

Exactly. There is no proof that I have ever seen that show vaccines create health. None. The only way that could ever be proven is through a longitudinal study of vaxed vs. completely non-vaxed populations. They would have to follow a good number of people for a long time, since we know that vaccines have certain treats, like SV-40 and aluminum, to see what kind of health issues pop up. Since the stuff in vaccines does not like to leave the body, ever, they'd have to see what comes down the road, not just a few months later, but decades later. They'd have to compare cancer rates, diabetes rates, autism rates, alzeimers, m.s., a whole host of other autoimmune conditions, longevity, etc.

The only thing the vaccine movement tries to claim is that they can limit certain diseases. There is a lot to question in that claim alone, but limiting certain diseases, is not the same as creating health believe it or not.

[Gitti]

Originally Posted by Scattershoot

The only thing the vaccine movement tries to claim is that they can limit certain diseases. There is a lot to question in that claim alone, but limiting certain diseases, is not the same as creating health believe it or not.

Right!

[PaulaJoAnne]

Don't ever underestimate the power of eating right. My husband has type 1 diabetes, and one of the complications is that cuts get infected easily, and only heal with antibiotics. We began eating a nutrient dense diet, removed most refined sugars from our diet, supplement with iodine and true cod liver oil, and add probiotics such as kefir and kombucha to our diet. We also apply tea tree oil topically to infections. Since we began eating more naturally, and using tea tree oil, he has had an ingrown toenail get infected, a serious infection on his calf, "fish finger" (bacterial infection from a fish bite), and a cat scratch that began to swell, with no doctor visit nor antibiotics for any of them, and they all healed. Other cuts, scrapes and abrasions also heal much more quickly now. He had fish finger the previous summer, and strep throat in the spring, that both required two courses of antibiotics to vanquish.

The literature we read regarding diabetes nearly all states that you must be on guard against infection and visit a doctor immediately if any signs of infection appear. We were never told by medical professionals that we could treat him holistically and through better nutrition.

So keep little DS eating right, let him take his bumps and bruises, and nourish the body that God gave him, shoring up his natural defenses. Keep the bandaids and ice handy, maybe some tweezers for picking gravel out of scraped knees, and you'll be fine!

[BarnMomma]

Hello,

Thank you for your replies.

I think I should have written my OP more clearly.

By HEALTH I meant, free from the diseases.

As in, what will increae our chances of NOT contracting a disease? I didn't mean to infer that our health would suffer from not vaxing. I believe quite the opposite.

So let me rephrase:

What if anything can we do to increase our chances of avoiding said diseases?

Thanks!

[Gitti]

Originally Posted by BarnMomma

What if anything can we do to increase our chances of avoiding said diseases?

Keep as healthy as you can by what you are doing and trust your immune system to take care of it if or when you do get something.

Get yourself some books that teach you what to do if you do get a disease. Not just VPD but all infections.

The one I like is from Aviva Jill Romm Healthy Babies, Healthy Children


With measles per se, it is mostly avoid contact. And if you do get it, CLO, little food, somewhat darker room, let the fever run its course, fluids, let the child direct you and give lots of TLC.

[alegna]

Originally Posted by BarnMomma

What if anything can we do to increase our chances of avoiding said diseases?

Thanks!

Which ones?

-Angela

[Juvysen]

:

[Gitti]

Originally Posted by alegna

Which ones?

-Angela

Somewhere in the thread I thought op was concerned about measles?

Now I can't see where I saw measles?