Butt Dimples (aka mid line issues - spun off from tongue-tie thread) - Page 5

[NamastePlatypus]

How can you tell if a palate is higher than normal?

[NamastePlatypus]

whoMe, how did you get started in the detoxing pathways stuff? I am very interested.

[tanyalynn]

Originally Posted by NamastePlatypus

How can you tell if a palate is higher than normal?

One thing that's not normal (apparently) is that there isn't supposed to be a line down the middle (from front of mouth towards the throat). When I run my finger across the top of my mouth, it feels like an arch, the kind in cathedrals, with a bump I can feel where the two halves of the arch come together. Some people also have a bubble palate, which I think is an abrupt upward, round shape in the middle of the top of the mouth.

[Theloose]

Originally Posted by NamastePlatypus

whoMe, how did you get started in the detoxing pathways stuff? I am very interested.

After about 20 months of trying to figure out the cause of dd's sensitivities, I got my MTHFR gene tested as a result of these midline defect threads.

And the rest kinda snowballed

[gromero]

What a great thread...you really do learn something new every day on MDC.

I was told by my chiro when I was about 16 that I had spinda bifida occulta. I had been suffering with some sever lower back pain, which is how we found out.

Now...my 16 month old ds, he has a sacral dimple with a slight little tuft of hair. We are also having issues with his eating solids right now. He is still 100% ebf. He wants to eat solids, but he can't. He starts to choking with even the teeny tinyest piece of food. What he usually does is just suck on the piece of food, then spit it out when he is done. The most we get is maybe a bite or two at each meal (each bite is about half the size of a dime...and he still chokes). We just got a refferal for an OT from his pedi for this. She thinks he may not know how to swallow, but the more I am reading I wonder if it could be he has a pallet/tongue tie issue (dh was tongue tied when he was born and had it clipped). Would I be able to tell without having his pedi point it out to me? Would this be related?

Also about the midline stuff...someone here mentioned something about teeth. I have noticed how weird it is that on his bottom teeth, the two front ones make like a v shape, pointing towards the back of his mouth. Does this have anything to do with what you are talking about?

The other thing is rashes. Ds will break out in random rashes that will last from just a few days to 2 weeks. You can see the most recent one one my blog is my siggy...it is about the 5th or 6th post down. It lasted like that on his back and stomach for about two weeks. It is gone from there, buy now it is on his little bottom/thighs. It doesn't cause him any discomfort or anything, but we have noooo idea what it is. I am reading that info about allergies, etc., so I am just trying to piece together this puzzle right now.

Hmmm.....one more thing....about the midline stuff. When dd was born she had like this skin tag on her chest, on her left collar bone right at the end of it. When she was about 2 1/2 or 3, it became infected and we were told that it was an infected cyst in her chest wall, and we wound up getting it surgically removed. We have had to do this twice now, and every now and then she will have it 'flare' up, become red and inflammed and tender to touch, but then goes away. No of her dr's can figure out why it does that, or what exactly it is. She will also break out in random rashes that will last 1-2 weeks like ds, but I don't recall her having a sacral dimple (I will check tomorrow morning though).

I'm sorry about being all over the map...I just have a ton of questions.

[kjbrown92]

Originally Posted by TanyaLopez

One thing that's not normal (apparently) is that there isn't supposed to be a line down the middle (from front of mouth towards the throat). When I run my finger across the top of my mouth, it feels like an arch, the kind in cathedrals, with a bump I can feel where the two halves of the arch come together. Some people also have a bubble palate, which I think is an abrupt upward, round shape in the middle of the top of the mouth.

I need to find a normal mouth for comparison. Using the above, DD2 has a high arch and so does DS, and so do I. Though DS's and DD2's are smooth and cavernous (though with a line). Mine has sort of a bubble down at the top. I'm trying to think of a good analogy -- like it is cavernous but has a dip down in the middle. I haven't looked at DD1's, but she's already in school (and had a palate expander a couple years ago; not sure if that's going to affect it). And haven't looked at DH's either. But maybe we do have some midline issues (see, we're not the exception! yippee).

[quelindo]

OMG, I wonder if *I* have spina bifida occulta. I've had back problems since I was a kid, and during one doctor's visit I remember them doing an x-ray and telling my mom that one of my vertebrae was turned or twisted. My chiro has wondered if maybe I had/have a mild form of scoliosis. And just now I found a definition of SBO that says that one or more vertebrae are malformed, and that sometimes there is no dimple or hair or any indication that you have it.

[NamastePlatypus]

Originally Posted by TanyaLopez

One thing that's not normal (apparently) is that there isn't supposed to be a line down the middle (from front of mouth towards the throat). When I run my finger across the top of my mouth, it feels like an arch, the kind in cathedrals, with a bump I can feel where the two halves of the arch come together. Some people also have a bubble palate, which I think is an abrupt upward, round shape in the middle of the top of the mouth.

I thought mine was high but after checking I do have a ridge and a bubble at the back.... will have to check j somehow...

[WuWei]

Originally Posted by gromero

but the more I am reading I wonder if it could be he has a pallet/tongue tie issue (dh was tongue tied when he was born and had it clipped). Would I be able to tell without having his pedi point it out to me? Would this be related?

Also about the midline stuff...someone here mentioned something about teeth. I have noticed how weird it is that on his bottom teeth, the two front ones make like a v shape, pointing towards the back of his mouth. Does this have anything to do with what you are talking about?

I haven't finished reading your post. But, wanted to link the video and photos about the tongue tie and v shape teeth. http://heal-thyself.ning.com/forum/t...eth-and-tongue

Here is the original 'tongue tie' thread: http://www.mothering.com/discussions...ght=tongue+tie


Pat

[gromero]

Pat...thank you, thank you, thank you for those links!! Ds does have that same v shape of his teeth...it is actually a bit more severe then in the pictures of the first link you posted.

I am reading the tongue tied thread right now!

:

[NamastePlatypus]

Checked J and he has the ridge on his palate and it seems much higher and arched than e's. His teeth also do the v and he has a gap, have a pic off to look!

[NamastePlatypus]

Ok here is a pic from his birthday last week.
http://s175.photobucket.com/albums/w...t=IMG_4985.jpg

[sonnambula]

a proper wide palate will be beautifully curved, low and while there may be a slightly visible line in the center it won't be that palpable.

The ridge doesn't fuse until around 10 years of age. This is something that *can* be addressed until that time.

[Theloose]

So dd's got many signs of a tie ('v' teeth, gags on food and drinks, ridge on the roof of her mouth, falls off the breast, clicks while nursing when really tired...) but is 2yo and just getting over a fear of medical professionals...

What would indicate not clipping a tie? And what would be necessary for helping palate issues?

[sonnambula]

hmmmm. If a child your dd's age had no issues with speech I would think about just doing CST intensively. There are many ramifications for having the mechanical issue persist, but I can understand not having access to a doctor who knows how to clip as posterior tie. In that case I say optimize function with manual therapy.

There's not great studies I've seen that show they grow out of it or that the frenulum stretches. However many *say* this. I think behaviors change due to compensations. The presentation would change. IT's similar (in my mind) to having kids "grow out of eczema) when all that happens is that the pathology changes. It goes deeper, so YAY your kid grows out of eczema but now has asthma.

An unclipped tie creates the need for compensations. You can lessen those with cranial work. Can you eliminate them? I have no idea. Is it better than nothing? Absolutely. My dd never got clipped and she has as bad of a tie as you can imagine, lingually and labially. It wasn't caught as she had alot of other things going on as well. She wasn't diagnosed until she was over 2. She had intensive work done as an infant. She still does, though it's not as rigorous a schedule. She is better than she was, but she still needs to be clipped. I'm not sure I'm going to do it, but that's a whole nother thread.

Ds2 was clipped twice. He had extensive work done as well. The difference between the two is remarkable.

[Chinese Pistache]

Can someone explain the ridge in the mouth as it relates to all of this? I mean, I know it's a midline issue (and surprise, surprise, only my two allergy kids have it), but does it necessarily mean they have other midline issues of the mouth? Or is it just one of the random midline issues that can occur? I see it being discussed in conjunction with the v teeth and tongue tie, but as far as I can tell, neither kid has those characteristics.

[BeantownBaby9]

wait, stop the presses, I am on the verge of tears....I just stumbled on this post and now in my head I am all over the place

DS (7.5mo) had tongue-tie, it was clipped at 4wks. Since then BF has been fine. He has a corn sensitivity I found two weeks ago, and I just looked at his butt crack, and it makes a V at the top, essentially splits in two, and one side has a little red mark in it. His right butt cheek has a dark birthmark. Oh and he sleeps for crap!

I have a high palate, a roof ridge, KP, and spinal issues, but no allergies per se. I have eliminated dairy, most gluetin, and am in the process of going TF. I eat very healthily, very little processed foods, no fast food, etc

What does this all mean? did I not have the right nutrient balance during my pg and now DS is suffering bc of it? Should I stop all solids, go to a straight ED, and start all over? Seriously, for as much as I love learning something new on MDC every day, this is not a fun day of discovery. I just called DH and he thinks I have lost my mind.

:

[tanyalynn]

Originally Posted by Chinese Pistache

Can someone explain the ridge in the mouth as it relates to all of this? I mean, I know it's a midline issue (and surprise, surprise, only my two allergy kids have it), but does it necessarily mean they have other midline issues of the mouth? Or is it just one of the random midline issues that can occur? I see it being discussed in conjunction with the v teeth and tongue tie, but as far as I can tell, neither kid has those characteristics.

I think the general link is nutrition, but how things manifest is individual. I think the high, arched palate usually correlates with a posterior tie (along with not being able to elevate the tongue very much--but I am having a hard time really seeing what that's supposed to look like, all four of us have high, arched palates) and the posterior tie can relate to peristalsis problems and digestive issues. But I think we can have digestive issues without them being caused by the posterior tie as well, and just address the digestive issues the normal ways.

I think the v in the teeth more often goes with an anterior tie, but I don't know if 100% of kids with the v also have an anterior tie, maybe they just often overlap. My daughter has only the arched palate, no anterior tie, no v, while my son has the arched palate and the anterior tie and the v.

I think the first ways this stuff shows up is genetically influenced, but we could have more stuff than previous generations if we're more affected, or nothing if we figure out the nutrition stuff and correct it.

[Theloose]

Originally Posted by BeantownBaby9

What does this all mean? did I not have the right nutrient balance during my pg and now DS is suffering bc of it? Should I stop all solids, go to a straight ED, and start all over? Seriously, for as much as I love learning something new on MDC every day, this is not a fun day of discovery. I just called DH and he thinks I have lost my mind.

:

This means that you just stumbled upon some information that will allow you to get your family in great health. You've got some major clues, and you can look for more here. You could choose the elimination diet route, or some of us are experimenting with adding specific nutrients. My progress is in my sig, and this conversation might be interesting, too.

You did the best you knew how to while pg, and now you can learn more to make things even better!

[changingseasons]

Also- it's not necessarily something that YOU did, or that you were deficient in. It could be a deficiency that has been passed down for generations. No mama guilt!!