What do you do when....

[StephandOwen]

you need a new car, so need to sell your old car but your old car isn't worth nearly as much as you're still paying on it???

I have a car that I think I might need to get rid of, for various reasons. I still owe about $6000. The interest rate is over 8% currently (stupid amount and in the 2 years I've owned it I've barely touched the actual principal on the darn thing... I bought it for almost $8000 on a 5 year loan.... stupid stupid stupid never again). It's worth *maybe* $3000, but that's pushing it (on NADA and the blue book).

What do I do? I need a reliable car, as I use it to get ds back and forth to therapy and such. We also use it to go visit family about every other month or so, and that's 2 states away.

ETA- I was considering refinancing it to get a lower interest rate (pretty sure I could) but I don't know if I want to do that since I think I need to get rid of it.

[phathui5]

Basically, you would have to pay $3000 to get out of the loan. Does it need more than that in work? Why do you need to get rid of it?

[mamaofprincesses]

Ouch. Being upside down on a car is really tough. Personally, I would try to refinance, pay down the principal, and live with it a while longer. It might be worth the occasional cab ride to therapy if the car breaks down. I would forgo trips to family for six months and throw the gas money at the loan as well.

The only other option I know of is to trade it in and roll the difference between what it's worth and what you owe into a new car loan. My SIL has done this and right now she is so far upside down on her current car, I don't think she'll ever get out from under it.

[StephandOwen]

Originally Posted by mamaofprincesses

Ouch. Being upside down on a car is really tough. Personally, I would try to refinance, pay down the principal, and live with it a while longer. It might be worth the occasional cab ride to therapy if the car breaks down. I would forgo trips to family for six months and throw the gas money at the loan as well.

The only other option I know of is to trade it in and roll the difference between what it's worth and what you owe into a new car loan. My SIL has done this and right now she is so far upside down on her current car, I don't think she'll ever get out from under it.

Comment on the bolded first.... it's not possible. I legally have to take ds back to Michigan about every 8 weeks to give his bio-dad a chance to see him (not that he takes that chance but... that's another story ). So.... I have already cut the trips down to 5 this year instead of 6+.

The car is not at risk of breaking down. There is, what we thought was, a small problem that we think has ballooned into a huge problem (or is in the process of becoming a huge problem). Basically we could fix it temporarily but when we do go to sell it that person will be able to tell there was a problem, which means I'll never get much of anything for the sale of it. If I sell/trade it now when the problem isn't as bad I'll possibly be able to get more for it. If I fix it then the car will be fine for us to continue to use (it'll cost less than $3000 to fix, I hope).

So my choices are to keep paying the car (I have over 3 years left ) and hope it makes it 3 years. Or sell/trade it and find some way to pay the difference and start over with a new car. Or.... I don't know.

The other thing DP just pointed out is he doesn't think I can get it refinanced at a new bank. The car is only worth, at most, $3000. I need almost $6000 financed on it. A bank isn't going to give out a loan for twice as much as the car is worth.

[phathui5]

If I fix it then the car will be fine for us to continue to use (it'll cost less than $3000 to fix, I hope).

You mentioned that it would be a temporary fix. Is the car beyond permanant repair or can it be put back in good working condition?

[lolar2]

Originally Posted by StephandOwen

The other thing DP just pointed out is he doesn't think I can get it refinanced at a new bank. The car is only worth, at most, $3000. I need almost $6000 financed on it. A bank isn't going to give out a loan for twice as much as the car is worth.

Not as a car loan, but maybe as a personal loan. A credit union might do that too. It would be worth applying anyway.

[Skywise]

Originally Posted by StephandOwen

The car is not at risk of breaking down. There is, what we thought was, a small problem that we think has ballooned into a huge problem (or is in the process of becoming a huge problem). Basically we could fix it temporarily but when we do go to sell it that person will be able to tell there was a problem, which means I'll never get much of anything for the sale of it. If I sell/trade it now when the problem isn't as bad I'll possibly be able to get more for it. If I fix it then the car will be fine for us to continue to use (it'll cost less than $3000 to fix, I hope).

That's kind of dirty and unfair to do to the person that is buying the car.

[madsommer]

Originally Posted by Skywise

That's kind of dirty and unfair to do to the person that is buying the car.

Not if selling as is with no warranty and making the buyer aware of all problems known to her. It's up to the buyer to have it looked at by his mechanic of choice if he chooses to buy it.

But I agree with what some other posters have said...if you can afford to get it fixed in the temporary, I would go with that. And really talk to the bio-dad about the visitation. Why isn't HE making any efforts to visit from two-states away? Or maybe you can meet in the middle to cut down one expenses and wear and tear.

Can you take any public transportation? Does the doctor's office or hospital where your son gets therapy offer any shuttle services or have any information of where you may be able to get some extra support in order to attend his therapy sessions?

Take it to a really good mechanic, see what all the problems are and patchwork fix as you get the money.

[lolar2]

Originally Posted by StephandOwen

Comment on the bolded first.... it's not possible. I legally have to take ds back to Michigan about every 8 weeks to give his bio-dad a chance to see him (not that he takes that chance but... that's another story ). So.... I have already cut the trips down to 5 this year instead of 6+.

Is it possible you could get the settlement changed to fewer-but-longer trips?

[sunflower.mama]

Originally Posted by Skywise

That's kind of dirty and unfair to do to the person that is buying the car.

I agree - this whole thing leaves a bad taste in my mouth!

[marisa724]

Originally Posted by Skywise

That's kind of dirty and unfair to do to the person that is buying the car.

It really depends, IMO. If you wind up trading in a car that has obvious problems, a dealership will have looked it over before making the trade, and then will fully service it before re-selling. This is exactly what happened with DH's old car, which conveniently starting smoking about two days before we were to trade it in for our baby-friendly ride. While we were drawing up the paperwork they had it in the back checking it out, and while we were nervous about it significantly affecting our trade-in value, it turned out to be not a problem at all.

We saw it for sale again a month or so later when we drove past the lot. I am assuming that the dealership completed all repairs and rolled that into the price of the car (which they were reselling for way more than we got in trade!). If the problem returned it would be between the new buyer and the dealer, if anything.

[GooeyRN]

Financially, I think you are stuck with it and fixing it and keeping it a few years. Unless, you trade it in on something else, and have an enormous loan, for much more the value of the new car. That will then leave you on the same situation again after a few years. What could be wrong with it that can not be fixed??

[StephandOwen]

Originally Posted by Skywise

That's kind of dirty and unfair to do to the person that is buying the car.

Not if I make the person (dealership) aware of the problem, it's not

Originally Posted by madsommer

Not if selling as is with no warranty and making the buyer aware of all problems known to her. It's up to the buyer to have it looked at by his mechanic of choice if he chooses to buy it.

Originally Posted by madsommer

And really talk to the bio-dad about the visitation. Why isn't HE making any efforts to visit from two-states away? Or maybe you can meet in the middle to cut down one expenses and wear and tear.

Because I am the one who moved out of the state. Honestly, ex doesn't really see ds much at all. Last year he saw ds on like 3 of the visits. But my family lives there too so, while I do HAVE to take ds back to michigan (legally), we don't always end up seeing ex during the visits. I am currently trying to figure out what to do about it. I have to tread lightly as ex is threatening to take me to court sometime this year and ask a judge for "standard visitation" for long distance (which is a month over the summer and all school breaks). Which is absolutely insane considering he hasn't had ds alone in years, he knows NOTHING about ds and autism and how it affects him, taking ds away from his therapy for weeks/month at a time would be devestating and set him back so far and... well.... it just ain't gonna happen. I'll sell my soul to the devil before that happens.

But that's not really on topic, is it? I did move it down to 5 visit this year (one of which is rolled into a weekend I'll be up there anyway for my sisters wedding and another rolled into a weekend I'll be there to go with my sis to pick out her wedding gown). I also offered him to come visit ds here during spring break or summer vacation, but he's never come down here yet so I don't think that'll actually happen.

Can you take any public transportation? Does the doctor's office or hospital where your son gets therapy offer any shuttle services or have any information of where you may be able to get some extra support in order to attend his therapy sessions?

I've thought about it, but I really can't. With ds's autism it is really a safety issue. We do have buses here, but I can't count on ds riding it safely every time (including standing on busy roads waiting for a bus). He's likely to dart into traffic. I also have to drive ds to school and pick him up every day since none of us (me, dp or the school) trust ds to ride the bus safely.

Take it to a really good mechanic, see what all the problems are and patchwork fix as you get the money.

It's in the shop as we speak We took it in this morning. Actually, I took it somewhere else where someone gave it a quick look at what I thought the problem was but he says it's not that. Sooo... I don't know. The problem isn't what I thought it was, which could be good or bad. It could be an easier fix, or it could be a harder/costlier fix. Hopefully the person I took it to today will be able to figure it out.

Originally Posted by lolar2

Is it possible you could get the settlement changed to fewer-but-longer trips?

Probably, yes. But a) I'd risk getting fired for missing that much work and b) I'd risk ds regressing for missing too much therapy. Right now we do long weekends (leave Thursday night come back Sunday afternoon) so he only misses one day of school and we only miss one day of work. He doesn't usually have therapy on Friday's anyway so he's not missing that. Starting next fall, when ds starts kindergarten, all the visits are centered around his vacation schedule. So if they have a friday off school then we try to use that as a long weekend. Not to mention ex wouldn't take advantage of a longer visit. Hell, he doesn't take advantage of shorter visits. He has the option of seeing him all day friday, all day saturday and sunday morning before we leave. If he sees him at all he sees him either Friday or Saturday for 2-3 hours. That's it.

ANYWAY, small update... I'm going to talk to the bank the loan is from and see if I can get it refinanced. I want it at a lower interest rate and I want it for a 12 or 18 month loan. DP and I ran the numbers last night and I can afford that and then after a year (or 18 months) we'll be out of this mess. If I can't get it refinanced or they aren't willing to bring down the interest rate then I'm going to use a large chunk of my tax refund and dp will "loan" me the rest and I'm going to pay it off in one large chunk and be done with it. Then for the next 12 months I'll pay back to dp's savings account.

Now we're crossing our fingers that the mechanic calls back and says it's an easy and cheap fix because I really do like my car!!!

[Lisa85]

If you can afford to pay more, then just pay more on it, noting that any extra is to go towards the principal only.

Dave Ramsey would suggest that you buy a beater and pay off the loan as fast as possible. You are saving wear, tear and miles by driving the beater so you'll hopefully be less upside down than if you kept driving it. Also since you aren't driving it, you *may* not have to carry insurance on it, though since you have a loan that might not be possible.

In reality though, once you drive any car off the lot, used or new, you're pretty much always upside down in the loan. *If* you take very good care of the car, don't put a lot of miles on it, and pay extra towards the principal you have a chance of breaking even or coming out ahead. This is why vehicles are such poor investments - they usually wear down faster than you can pay them off.

[mnnice]

Originally Posted by StephandOwen

I've thought about it, but I really can't. With ds's autism it is really a safety issue. We do have buses here, but I can't count on ds riding it safely every time (including standing on busy roads waiting for a bus). He's likely to dart into traffic. I also have to drive ds to school and pick him up every day since none of us (me, dp or the school) trust ds to ride the bus safely.

OT--If you child is in a special education program and can't be trusted to ride a regular school bus for safety reasons then it's the school district's responsiblility to provide the student with special transportation not yours. He should be riding a small bus in a booster or special harness made for school buses. Granted that wouldn't address every safety issue or behavior concern (i.e a child that was downright phobic about buses), but it would a lot of them.

I'm not sure how many miles that would save you, but it's another thing that could help squeeze a little more time/life out of your current car.

[mamaofprincesses]

Good for you for looking at all options. I hope the mechanic says it is a very minor and cheap repair, and your bank refinances!

[StephandOwen]

Update... mechanic couldn't find anything wrong. WTH?!? Nobody can find a thing wrong with this car. Huh.

So the problem was that after the big ice storm last week I went to get my ds into the car (in the backseat, obviously) and there was ICE on the floor. Like, a ton of it. We melted what we could and sucked it up with a shopvac. The next day there was more, and it had spread to the front of the car. So the floorboard from the gas/break pedals all the way to the backseat are wet. The sides of the car and the actual seats are not. We thought for sure there must be a hole in the bottom of the car, right?

This was when the original post was posted. We were told if there was a hole in the bottom of the car we could seal it up, but anybody who bought the car would be able to tell if they looked at the underside, which would reduce the value of the car. Obviously if we were to sell/trade it now we'd mention there was some sort of leakage. We wouldn't have just cleaned it up and sold it.

But there's not. There's not even any rust down there (according to dp and both the mechanics who looked at it). So then we thought maybe a leak in the seal. But the mechanics say they can't find anything. They looked over everything and can't find a single reason for there to be water in my car.

We're all stumped.

As far as paying off the car- my bank that the loan is from won't re-finance it.

I called the other bank that I have a loan from and the main office said they won't re-finance it because it has over 80,000 miles on it. I then talked to someone at a local branch, who never asked how many miles on it, but said they could do a 7.3% but it would have to be 2 years- not 1 year. I could pay it off early and face a penalty (1% of the balance when I pay it off.... so it would be about a $20 penalty). They could do a personal loan with a rate of 8.5%.

But, DP has a different idea. We're thinking if the bank my loan is from will take a credit card (anyone know how likely this is??) then we're going to pay $2200 right away. The balance will go on his credit card and I'll pay that off over the next 11 months (it has 0% interest for 12 months). This is a huge thing for us because we NEVER carry a balance on a credit card. Ever. We could just pay the entire balance right now, and we'd be fine, as long as we didn't hit any unexpected disaster (illness, injury, loss of job, etc). But we'd both be more comfortable with a safety cushion (paying it off wouldn't drain our savings completely, but it would be a big chunk).

[tangozulu]

To do the cc idea you'd probably have to get it as a balance transfer. Balance transfers often have a fee. It may still be worth it - if the fee is, for example, 2% and capped at $75 or something. Find out the details from the issuing bank, and make sure the 0% is good on BTs, not just purchases.

Of course, if the bank will take a cc for the balance, this doesn't apply, but I think that is unlikely.

HTH and good luck!

[GooeyRN]

Wow that is a strange issue! The credit card idea does not sound bad. I knew someone who bought a car on their credit card b/c it had a better rate than the bank would give them.

[shelbean91]

I know this isn't a popular opinion here ever, but especially with the economy as is- but I'd try to trade it in and roll it over. Sucks, yes, absolutely. But, you need something reliable. New car loans are typically relatively low interest.

Good luck.