Someone please explain to me why "Emma" is supposed to be so great?

[minkajane]

I've been listening to it on CD. I got about halfway through and this afternoon I gave up. They go ON and ON about NOTHING and what is the point??? Nothing is really happening besides Mr. Elton being a total jerk and Emma being jealous of Jane Fairfax and Mr. Woodhouse being a hypochondriac. The last straw was when one of the ladies (I forget who) started going on about how she thought there were two steps but there was only one and she she just could have sworn there were two steps and watch out for that step, there's only one, not two! *snore*

Seriously, am I missing something? There are so many tedious conversations that don't advance the story at all. Nothing much is really happening. I get how it's supposed to be a commentary on the banality of their lives and how everybody thinks they're doing the respectable thing and it never works out, blah blah blah. Please, if there's something I'm missing, enlighten me!

[Murihiku]

I started and gave up on Emma several times befrore I read it through. I can say with conviction that the second part of the book is much better than the first--although you may not think so.

[KaraBoo]

I was complaining in the book thread about how Austen is so damned repetitious. She needed an editor. Her stories are great, characters are great but man, she does go on and on...

[redeyedvireo]

Wait, wait, it's not supposed to be a commentary on the banality of their lives! Maybe you're thinking of Madame Bovary, which is, and whose main character is Emma Bovary?

Emma is a comic novel: you should expect romance, amusing conversation, subtly and not-so-subtly revealed quirks of personality (such as Mr. Woodhouse's hypochondria, which is, among other things, the way he ensures himself a comfortable life), and a happy ending. Oh yes, and a few illustrations of moral failings (such as Mr. Elton's selfishness) and mistakes (such as Emma's matchmaking).

They aren't meant to be banal. They are supposed to be just like your neighbors and friends: not doing anything extraordinary, but going about the important day-to-day business of life.

May I recommend two things? First, watch the movie version of Emma starring Gweneth Paltrow, which is quite pleasant, and gives the right tone. Second, say to yourself firmly, "ah, now I am going to read a comic novel," and pick up Northanger Abbey or Pride and Prejudice or another Austen which appeals to you and read it, starting fresh. Then maybe go back to Emma the book. I find that when I expect the wrong thing from a book, sometimes I don't enjoy it at all until I get the idea I started with right out of my head.

(Side note: Emma is sometimes my least favorite of all Austen's novels because I get impatient with her blindness and meddling. Then I make an error of judgment myself and feel more kindly towards her. This lasts for a year or so.)

Or you could just go on to something you enjoy more to start with.

[Mama Shifra]

Honestly, while I love Jane Austen's books, they are very hard to get into. Like you said, there is a lot of tedious dialogue. One thing I do is read the end first, just to see where we are getting to, and then go back and see how we got there !

[Tradd]

Oh, that's funny! And here's why: a friend, some years ago, picked up Emma. She also had a hard time getting into it. She said, "All these good Christian woman I know love this book, so there can't be anything wrong with it."

She eventually came around.

In its time, Sir Walter Scott reviewed Emma and praised it for its realism.

And yes, do see the Gwyneth Paltrow movie version. It's lovely.

[KittyKat]

The Gwyneth Paltrow version is super-hollywood.

I rather prefer the BBC version.

But then, I did like the book when I read it. I'll read almost anything, especially if it's a big thick book with loads of pages to turn.

I also agree that if you are having trouble with Emma, maybe one of Austen's other novels would be an easier introduction to her brand of satire and wit.

[journeymom]

I'm not going to do my thoughts justice right now. The super bowl pre-stuff is on, I'm sipping a beer and the dog is barking.

It may not help you enjoy it more, but it's interesting to understand that Austen was one of the first to do what she did, and was one of the better writers. She was a woman. She wrote novels about society, personal relationships, romances no less, from the woman's point of view.

And now I'll confess that I've never finished any of her books. I started S & S and within a few pages was completely confused as to which Mr. Dashwood was being referred to. Though it was neat to find that Col. Brandon is a richer character in the book than how he's portrayed in the movie.

I liked the Northanger Abbey with Billie Piper, on PBS. So maybe I'll read it someday.

[KaraBoo]

I don't have trouble reading it. I just think Austen repeats herself too much. I think she needed a really good editor

[Tradd]

Originally Posted by journeymom

And now I'll confess that I've never finished any of her books. I started S & S and within a few pages was completely confused as to which Mr. Dashwood was being referred to. Though it was neat to find that Col. Brandon is a richer character in the book than how he's portrayed in the movie.

You've NEVER finished ANY of her books? Oh, bite your tongue!

Mr. Dashwood=husband of Mrs. Dashwood, father of Elinor, Marianne, Margaret.

Mr. John Dashwood=the son who inherited the Norland estate and his wife Fanny was the reason the widow and daughters of Mr. Dashwood had to move.

The elder is always addressed as just "Mr. Last Name." This would work for either a father or eldest son, depending on context. "Mr. First Name-Last Name" is either an only son or a younger son.

That's why Elinor is confused towards the end of S&S when the family's man servant says he's seen Lucy with "Mr. Bertram." The Mr. Bertram turns out to be Robert Bertram, Edmund's *younger* brother.

For women, the eldest/an only daughter is "Miss Last Name" such as Jane Bennet (Miss Bennet) in P&P. Younger daughters, such as Elizabeth Bennet, are "Miss Elizabeth Bennet."

If you read a lot of 19th Century fiction, a great book to explain lots of the little bits is "What Jane Austen Ate and Charles Dickens Knew":

http://www.amazon.com/Austen-Charles.../dp/0671882368

ETA: I have to confess that at one time (It's been a while since I did this), I read all six JA novels EACH MONTH. Obsessed? Yes, a wee bit! :-)

[St. Margaret]

I think Emma is a bit harder to get into. But I love its portrait of small town life in that place and time.

Thematically, I think it's all about the social system and living up to the obligations (like, Emma only dislikes Jane because Jane is everything Emma SHOULD be, and she tries to go against social order setting Harriet up with gentlemen, when she should be befriending Jane instead) and how she learns to stay in her place. Totally nonrevolutionary stuff! But ripe for comic satire.

I like almost all of the movie versions! Different but good.

I think Pride and Prejudice is the perfect starter Austen, because most of the satire and social commentary is so clear, and stuff moves along at a pretty good clip.

But I love all of Austen.

[BookGoddess]

Obviously I adore Austen. Just look at my location to the left of the screen.

However, Emma is not one of my favorite Austen stories. I read it because it was assigned reading in English Class but I haven't re-read it many times thereafter unlike Pride & Prejudice or Persuasion which are far more interesting works by Austen. I can quote entire sections from Pride & Prejudice but not so with Emma or Northanger Abbey.

[StoriesInTheSoil]

Have you read Pride and Prejudice? If not, try it first. It's much better in my opinion.

That said, Emma was my first Jane Austin book, read in 4th grade for my mother's book club. I enjoyed it reasonably well but enjoyed it much more a few years later. I think that maybe reading the book instead of listening to it on CD might help? That might go a lot faster at least. I almost always have trouble getting in to books on tape because they are read so s-l-o-w-l-y that I can read the actual book in half the time or less. (Oh and exception to the book-on-tape statement above is when the actual author of the book reads it. I am a sucker for that!) I really love Austin's writing style if I'm in the right mood but I don't know if I'd ever like it read aloud.

If you aren't enjoying it or any book my policy is to get to page 100 (which also won't help on CD... sorry I'm not helpful in that area!) and if you still hate it, put it down and either come back and start over in a year or two or just leave it. There's no reason to read something you aren't enjoying!

[QueeTheBean]

Originally Posted by Tradd

ETA: I have to confess that at one time (It's been a while since I did this), I read all six JA novels EACH MONTH. Obsessed? Yes, a wee bit! :-)

I love them all & re-read them every few years. I was an English major, though . . .

The only one that doesn't delight me is Mansfield Park. Fanny is just too good for me. Me likey my Austen characters more flawed.

I'd pick S&S for an Austen starter.

[Verity]

I absolutely hated it. The conversation that sticks out in my mind is the one in which some of the characters are trying to decide whether to go home because it has started to snow. DECIDE ALREADY! We didn't need two pages of that tedious back-and-forth! I almost threw it across the room several times, but I managed to finish it.

I read Northanger Abbey (I think--is that the one with the main character named Catherine?) in college and hated it as well, though part of my dislike probably had to do with the fact that I was sweating out trying to get an A in English lit. After struggling through Emma, I swore I'd never put myself through another Jane Austen book.

My MIL loves Jane Austen, and we simply have to agree to disagree about her books.

[MeepyCat]

Originally Posted by Verity

I absolutely hated it. The conversation that sticks out in my mind is the one in which some of the characters are trying to decide whether to go home because it has started to snow. DECIDE ALREADY! We didn't need two pages of that tedious back-and-forth!

That conversation is all about Emma being a masterwork of obliviousness while Mr. Elton tries to maneuver himself into a coach alone with her. I'm sure there's other things too - I can't seem to find my copy, or I'd tell you.

Austen was really good at these conversations - it's rare that people stand up at the end of an evening, figure out who's driving and go in just a few minutes, and when they do, it's not very interesting. Austen's genius is the recognition that the discussions of these details conceal points of much greater interest: can Elton find a way to politely dispense with Emma's infirm (possibly senile - Alzheimer's has been theorized) father for ten minutes so that he can speak to the woman of his dreams privately? He's been trying and failing to get her alone for several chapters by that point.

[Verity]

Originally Posted by MeepyCat

That conversation is all about Emma being a masterwork of obliviousness while Mr. Elton tries to maneuver himself into a coach alone with her. I'm sure there's other things too - I can't seem to find my copy, or I'd tell you.

Austen was really good at these conversations - it's rare that people stand up at the end of an evening, figure out who's driving and go in just a few minutes, and when they do, it's not very interesting. Austen's genius is the recognition that the discussions of these details conceal points of much greater interest: can Elton find a way to politely dispense with Emma's infirm (possibly senile - Alzheimer's has been theorized) father for ten minutes so that he can speak to the woman of his dreams privately? He's been trying and failing to get her alone for several chapters by that point.

This is why I wasn't an English major. To me, it was just an incredibly boring conversation.

The book held so little interest for me that I don't even remember the Elton character.

[TEAK's Mom]

I once wrote a paper about carriage rides in Emma.

Of course I'm the same girl who wrote a lengthy paper about Conrad's depiction of women in Heart of Darkness. (If I remember correctly, they appear in something like one paragraph.)

[notjustmamie]

Personally, I pretty much deal with Austin the same way I deal with Shakespeare: If I can watch it or act in it, I will. If I can read/see an updated version (i.e., Clueless, Bridget Jones's Diary, 10 Things I Hate About You, etc.) I will. Unless I'm required to in order to get a grade, however, I'm unlikely to read the original. I think both of them told great stories, I just don't think either of them always told them very well.

: :

[flapjack]

You see, I actually like Emma and Mansfield Park and Northanger Abbey just leaves me cold
Too early in the morning for me to function, but a big : to MeepyCat.