or Connect
Mothering › Mothering Forums › Mom › Parenting › People not watching their kids....
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

People not watching their kids.... - Page 3

post #41 of 180
im not worried about your parenting. I said I was GLAD to hear you taught him who is the right person to go to. I think that is just the good kind of thing a mother would do who want's to prevent a dangerous situation. And I'm not saying the mother from the OP is a bad mother, I just relate to the OP's concern about the mother's lack of concern . I just found that response to be very strange. I douby a child who looks 4, or a 5 year old who is small for their age, is okay in this situation. apparently the child was out of his comfort zone as another poster said.

then again, I'm the crazy lady in town who doesnt understand why kindergartners are walking to school when we live in one of the highest child abduction areas, and the windows to all my kids rooms are permanantly hurricane shuttered, and a security system in place. It could just be I'm overprotective.
post #42 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by AFWife View Post
lol Nah, I was just commenting and agreeing with your point.
I see just wanted to make sure it didnt sound like I run around accusing people of kidnapping every time their child has a tantrum. Perhaps, in consideration of this, it might help to find a way to gentle intervene in a HELPFUL way, when we can. Like "Can I help you to the car with those groceries? I have had my share of days where my kids were the ones having trouble at the end of a shopping trip. it happens to the best of us" (insert warm smile)
post #43 of 180
These types of threads have a pretty predictable course. First, someone comes on and shares something they witnessed another parent do which the poster finds irritating, frightening, shocking, or horrifying. Then a couple folks respond, "Yeah, that would bug me too" or whatever.

Then other folks who see more shades of gray, or could imagine a reason the action might have been warranted, or could see themselves doing something like that on a bad day, or have been in similar special situations where someone might have judged them but special circumstances were at play, or who simply feel the thread is lacking of compassion, come and post, "yeah, but..." or "judge not," or "what if?" or "It could have simply been..." etc.

Then some more folks come on agreeing with the "yeah, but" crowd, and so those who want to support the OP, or who see why the OP was shocked, or who share viewpoints with the OP, or have been in similar situations as the OP in terms of witnessing something they didn't feel was right, etc. jump back in and draw the line in the sand again.

And most of the time there are one or two really militant-sounding posts from people who are feeling super strong one way or another.

I can see why the OP was upset.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Storm Bride View Post
I just object to the assumption that the mother lost him, because she was "too preoccupied" to look after him properly.
It does sound like she was visibly pre-occupied, which explains the OP's upset.

That said, we can't generalize the particular situation she witnessed to all situations with lost kids, parents that don't retrieve their kids right away after being found, etc. There are a lot of different scenarios out there. So I can sort of understand the other responses too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by momtokea View Post
You know, we like to go to bookstores a lot. When we enter the store my kids automatically go to the kids section. I have a few sections that I like to check out myself and I take a few minutes before I join my kids in the kid section. My biggest concern is not that they will be kidnapped. . .
This is a well-grounded, reasoned position. The chances of a child being kidnapped by a complete stranger are extremely, extremely low. Kidnappings are not happening in stores across the nation every day (If I remember correctly, statistically, most kidnappings by the way are non-custodial parents takin their kids). It really bothers me when people go off on the risk of being kidnapped on threads like this. Yes, it could happen. But it is so highly unlikely, that if you are going to worry, the real things to worry about are the child getting scared and so forth.

Quote:
. . .but that I will be judged as a bad mother. Seriously, I head to the kids section thinking that everyone is going to be wondering where the mother of those unsupervised kids is, not that my kids need me or are in trouble. Instinctively I feel that my kids are fine. It's the judgement that worries me more.
I've so been there. Not so much in leaving my kids alone, as they're still little (and wild ) enough I'm not yet tempted to leave them alone in the bookstore, but in other situations. Sometimes *I* know something is safe, or the best approach, or a reasoned action, etc, but I can't bring myself to do what my gut and my brain tell me is right because I have to worry about who will freak out about it. I hate that.

Quote:
. . . .Sounds crazy, I know.
Not at all.

Also, I relate to this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Storm Bride View Post
(I might add that I was frequently more preoccupied than I should have been when ds1 was small...it's not always something the mom can do anything about.)
I am a total scatter-brain at times, so I do imagine sometimes in public I come off as the world's flakiest mom. I also tend to be a very relaxed, easy-going parent, in addition to feeling strongly that children should be encouraged in their early steps toward independence and self-reliance (Montessori-like...for example, if my kids want to help get the milk off the shelf at the grocery store, and I want to look at the cheese in the same aslie but they are quite a distance apart, I let my kids go get the darn milk), so I know those folks who are more "safety mat" parents as well as those who think that the world should never be incovienienced by children (everyone waits for the older woman to slowly get her milk...I think if people have to wait a minute to get their milk because my kids are slowly trying to get theirs off the shelf, so be it) look down on me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Storm Bride View Post
30+ years ago, lots of kids ran around in stores. I remember playing all through the clothing section of Woolco with my sister. We hid out in the clothing racks, and frequently found other kids doing the same thing. A few years later, we'd play hide and seek behind the hanging rugs in Sears. It was the norm. I've seen a huge difference just between the time when ds1 was little and now. My mom doesn't say much about it, but I know she finds modern parenting a little overprotective in that area, and so do many others of her generation.
I think some of this is actually a sign of the expectations of sedentary lifestyles among children. Some natural foods stores and a few other stores have child sized carts kids can push around to "help" with shopping, but the big trend now is to equip the "car carts" for kids with tvs so they can just sit and watch. Not that I can't see that being a really nice thing on desperate days when the kids are off the wall and the shopping just needs to get done, but it is interesting how even a very low-key hide-in-seek game in the rugs would now be seen as "kids running wild."

Quote:
This is really a cultural thing. 80, 50, and probably 25, years ago in the US, or in other parts of the world today, no one would blink at something like that. And don't try to argue "it was safer then"; it wasn't, people were just less scared (it wasn't hugely less safe, either, for that matter).

Can't we just accept that different people have different comfort zones, and that we don't know anyone else's full story. . .There's a huge and important difference between "I wouldn't" and "how could she??"
This sums up the sentiment very well.

Quote:
All that said...I've worked with my kids on holding hands from the time they were toddlers - all three of them. The only one who has taken it seriously enough not to bolt is dd. DS1 wasn't terrible. DS2 is awful. He has no impulse control at all, and it doesn't matter how often we discuss it, or how quickly I grab him and bring him back. He just does not get it. He sees something or thinks of something, and he's gone. I can tell reading this thread that most of you feel that anybody who was as good a parent as you are wouldn't have this happen. That's very nice for you. Maybe you're even right, but I guess we're not all that great.
Totally! Totally, totally!

ds is one of those kids who, while it was some work, I was able to teach basic safety and stay-by-me and all that. dfd has an almost total lack of impulse control. And no natural sense of safety at all. I don't think she'd even realize if she got lost from me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FiveLittleMonkeys View Post
This is one of my biggest pet peeves. I've never had one of my kids run off while at a store or in a parking lot. Not even when they were little.
Lucky mother! I am not saying you didn't work hard for it. It's just that we worked hard for this with both our kids but we happened to have one wild card kid in terms of being able to internalize this stuff.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AFWife View Post
in the parking lot we knew better than to run off. It was just the way we were brought up. We wouldn't have gotten spanked or anything...but I don't remember ever running around while in the parking lot. That was a good way to get to stay home or, before it became against the law, in the car. I'm not saying it was the BEST way to handle it...
Both my kids know there are consequences to running off. One cares and has the impulse control to stop himself. The other doesn't either care or have the impulse control. See, this kind of post just smacks of "kids of good parents know/do/act _____[fill in blank]____," and "kids who do/act ______[fill in blank]_______ must just have bad parents. I think (and hope) you'll learn over time with your kido that the world just isn't that simple.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Swan3 View Post
UGH. I hate when stuff like that happens. My personal fave is when I go to the mall play area and notice that one kid there doesn't appear to have a mom. Usually said kid is there for at least 1/2 an hour before mama comes waltzing down the mall with her arms heavy with shopping bags. Nice. In one particular case the kid was five, told me how he'd just gotten out of karate class and then proceeded to try and drop-kick my two year old 20 lb daughter.
All the above being said, you bring up one of the problematic parts of leaving kids unsupervised in play spaces or children's sections of bookstores, etc....something that isn't usually talked about. Kids are bound to get into new social situations with complete stranger kids that they don't always have the skills to navigate on their own. While the experiences might be good learning experiences for them in many cases, for the rest of our kids, it could pose a serious problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by claddaghmom View Post
I used to work for a big box retail store. Two little boys, 4 and 6, came up to one morning and said they couldn't find their dad.

I paged every 3-5mins for an HOUR. The boys sat behind my desk and BAWLED for and HOUR.

Then the dad wheeled his cart up (he had everything bagged and had already checked out) and proceeded to yell at them for getting lost.

I asked him if he had left the store to look for them??? (Aka where the heck were you when I was paging you). He said, "Well, when I heard the pages I figured you guys had 'em so I might as well finish shopping.
About this, I had to wonder if this was his approach to natural consequences. Not that it wasn't over the top and quite sad, but maybe he really thought it would nip a budding problem with his kids running off?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arwyn View Post
But they'd be Bad Parents if they did that today. It's a fascinating phenomenon.
Agreed.
post #44 of 180
It's always annoyed me to hear a parent, upon being reunited with his or her lost child, to immediately start scolding the child, especially since the child is often crying. Hug your kid and be thankful you have him/her back!

But kids and parents do get separated sometimes and it's not always of a question of them "running off" either. Both times my DS and I were separated it was not because he ran off. I just laugh a bit at the posts that are more or less about how "MY kids would never get lost in a store" Good for you, you'll be spared some harrowing moments if that proves to be true. If it proves not to be true, welcome to the club.
post #45 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arwyn View Post
Not just other parents, other mothers.

This is really a cultural thing. 80, 50, and probably 25, years ago in the US, or in other parts of the world today, no one would blink at something like that. And don't try to argue "it was safer then"; it wasn't, people were just less scared (it wasn't hugely less safe, either, for that matter).

Can't we just accept that different people have different comfort zones, and that we don't know anyone else's full story, and just lay off the judgmental shaming please? There's a huge and important difference between "I wouldn't" and "how could she??"
Golly, I can remember wandering around stores at a fairly young age while my mom did her shopping. Large stores, grocery stores, department stores. I knew where I was supposed to go or supposed to stay and she was just a bellow away (boy, she had a set of pipes lol). I don't think I could do that now, but ask me again when my kids are 11.
post #46 of 180
There are a lot of unattentive, not-so-good parents out there. Thank goodness you were there to help.
post #47 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by kennedy444 View Post
Thank goodness you were there to help.
That's exactly what I was thinking. I completely understand why you felt the way that you did. As for not judging others too harshly, I think that's good advice, and easier to follow if you hear the story secondhand. If you are actually the one there dealing with a sad, scared, lost child and the emotions that the situation provokes in you, and then the parent that finally meanders up as if nothing has happened, it might be more difficult to take a step back. I hope that her nonchalance was covering up embarrassment. If that's the case then I have some sympathy for the mother, that might be my reaction to embarrassment or shame. However, I also sympathize with the OP who actually took it upon herself to help another mother's child and therefor, IMO, is entitled to her emotions. Maybe the OP's emotions are a very visceral reaction to a terribly upsetting situation.
post #48 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Super Glue Mommy View Post
what to do about it? go to a stranger? if he knew what to do they would have a meeting place if they got separated or he would know to go to the front desk or ask staff for help - not a stranger.
It's actually a common recommendation that children who are lost should look for a mother with children to help them. It's easier for them to identify, and statistically mothers with children are the least likely to be predators. So I don't think that's odd at all. I've taught my daughter that if she ever gets lost (she hasn't) to look for a mom with kids. Have you read Protecting the Gift? That's where I read that recommendation first, though I've seen it elsewhere since then as well.
post #49 of 180
I never hear that zee, thank you for sharing that is great information to have!
post #50 of 180
My daughter, who is barely two, ran away from me at target. THIS HAS NEVER HAPPENED TO ME BEFORE. I let her hand go for a moment and was putting some of our things in the carriage. She bolted. Her brother and sister ran after er. I am pregnant and do not run fast. But I bolted after her. She was lost in a matter of a minute. I found her almost right away in a rack of clothes. I panicked. She was only "lost" for about a 3 minute period.

Sorry, but leaving a child lost and unattended for a minute is wrong. I was wrong for letting her hand go. You know a lot of stores have automatic doors? They could run right out of the store and into a parking lot. If after 15 minutes of her child being lost, she had not gone to the customer service desk for help and taken a moment to end her cell phone conversation, I CAN SAFELY say, this mother has poor parenting skills.

We ARE talking about this mom, this situation and she was careless. Besides the fact her kid was scared and she didn't even act concerned. I'm sure he feels SECURE with her. I know I would .
post #51 of 180
I agree with the OP, that scares me for the kid too. It is one thing to have a child wander/dart off and lose them for a minute, but it is another thing to have lost your child for 15+ minutes and not have bothered to check the customer service desk, especially when your name was called! Because yeah, some kids are more easily able to or more inclined get away from their parents for sure, and I would not look down on anyone that has happened to, how scary for you! but I would be concerned if a parent was seemingly unconcerned about losing a young child for 15+ minutes.
post #52 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by FiveLittleMonkeys View Post
This is one of my biggest pet peeves. I've never had one of my kids run off while at a store or in a parking lot. Not even when they were little. We taught them early on that either you are holding a hand, or your "hands are on the van," in the parking lot. When grocery shopping, the baby went into the sling, the 2 yo went into the shopping cart seat, and the other two (ages 4 and 6) - all I had to say to them was, "Hands on the cart, ladies." They range in age from 7 to 14 now, and still we have the little two by the hands and the older two stay together.

Last month when my husband and I were coming back from dinner, we saw a little girl on the side of the road. Barefoot, no adult. We stopped and asked her if she was lost, and she said that her mother had left her to go to someone's house. She was able to take us to where she lived (about 2 blocks away). The mother was not home, and the neighbors said that she does this frequently. We called the police, who responded immediately. Several minutes later, a cell phone number for the mother was obtained, and she was called. It still took her over 45 minutes to get home.

I don't know who does this, but I really wanted to say to the lady, "In the span of time from when we found your daughter to when you got home, we could have been to the airport and GONE, and you never would have known until the next day." (the excuse was that the little girl, age 5, was supposed to be spending the night at a friend's house, but the mother had not taken her there - apparently, she was just supposed to make her way there by herself).

I know that there are times that kids get away, but most people realize it immediately and start looking for their kid. When parents don't, THAT is when I have a problem.
Oh my gosh, that brings tears to my eyes.
I just dont get it. HOw can some people just take their children for granted? Whats so sad is that it would probably take something horrible to happen for them to even open their eyes to what they can lose.
post #53 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arwyn View Post
Maybe she "didn't care" because she didn't think it was a big deal. Maybe because it's happened 50 times before. Maybe because her son knew what to do about it. Maybe because she hasn't read all the "kidnappers are in EVERY STORE" books. Maybe because she hates him and didn't want to be a parent at all. We don't know.
Not to mention, she had ALREADY been paged, she knew the child was safe, why should she be upset?
post #54 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by choli View Post
Not to mention, she had ALREADY been paged, she knew the child was safe, why should she be upset?
The fact that she had already been paged, and then took an additional ten minutes to wander on up, is not an argument in her favor. I would be upset because my child had been lost. It would have been hard for me to just turn that off. Hard for most people, I'm sure.
post #55 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by choli View Post
Not to mention, she had ALREADY been paged, she knew the child was safe, why should she be upset?
Yes, to be upset, she would have to be in tune to her childs feelings and care that here child was upset. She obviously doesn't.
post #56 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sierra View Post
These types of threads have a pretty predictable course. First, someone comes on and shares something they witnessed another parent do which the poster finds irritating, frightening, shocking, or horrifying. Then a couple folks respond, "Yeah, that would bug me too" or whatever.

Then other folks who see more shades of gray, or could imagine a reason the action might have been warranted, or could see themselves doing something like that on a bad day, or have been in similar special situations where someone might have judged them but special circumstances were at play, or who simply feel the thread is lacking of compassion, come and post, "yeah, but..." or "judge not," or "what if?" or "It could have simply been..." etc.

Then some more folks come on agreeing with the "yeah, but" crowd, and so those who want to support the OP, or who see why the OP was shocked, or who share viewpoints with the OP, or have been in similar situations as the OP in terms of witnessing something they didn't feel was right, etc. jump back in and draw the line in the sand again.

And most of the time there are one or two really militant-sounding posts from people who are feeling super strong one way or another.
yep . .. that's why i don't really bother to post or even do more than skim most of these threads. After a few years of regular MDCing, I'm tired of the dance.
post #57 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamazee View Post
It's actually a common recommendation that children who are lost should look for a mother with children to help them. It's easier for them to identify, and statistically mothers with children are the least likely to be predators. So I don't think that's odd at all. I've taught my daughter that if she ever gets lost (she hasn't) to look for a mom with kids. Have you read Protecting the Gift? That's where I read that recommendation first, though I've seen it elsewhere since then as well.
Yup, I taught all my siblings to do that.
post #58 of 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamazee View Post
It's actually a common recommendation that children who are lost should look for a mother with children to help them. It's easier for them to identify, and statistically mothers with children are the least likely to be predators. So I don't think that's odd at all. I've taught my daughter that if she ever gets lost (she hasn't) to look for a mom with kids. Have you read Protecting the Gift? That's where I read that recommendation first, though I've seen it elsewhere since then as well.
This is exactly what we teach our kids also. Look for a mom or a woman. It is also statistically more likely that a mom or woman will stay with the child until the parents have their child safe in their arms again. Which the OP nicely proved.

I have been known to annoy my now seven year old daughter by stopping in the middle of the store and saying "Okay, pretend you are lost. Who could you ask for help in this crowd." Always good to know how their little minds work. Of course, that said I tend to fall on the more lenient side of the discussion when it comes to giving kids freedom out in the real world. As long as I can see the little ones and the older one is close enough by to respond to me when I say her name I am good. This is all dependent on location of course. Parks, the library, and some stores are merit more freedom than other locations.
post #59 of 180
You know. Everyone would do something different in a situation like this. And many of you have told your kids to go to an employee if they get lost. I can respect that. However, Just because someone is employed does not make them safe. My husband's cousin was at a grocery store with his son and they were in the bathroom. there was a janitor also in the bathroom cleaning. Anyway, because his son was in a "big boy" kick, they were using stalls next to one another instead of the same stall. The son finished first and while the father was finishing he came out to wash his hands. the janitor that was there made a grab for the little boy and the boy screamed. The father, who was an ultimate fighter in his before children life, came out of the stall and grabbed the guy and yelled for the store manager. long story short it was a big hoopla and the janitor was arrested, dh's cousin was brought up on charges for grabbing the guy, but everything turned out ok in the end.
my point is that i have taught all children in my like, I used to baby sit and be a nanny and stuff, to go for the customer service desk or a Mom. Basically if they are lost to look for a lady with kids. I know, i know sexist not to say person with kids and I know that Men can be just a capable but I say Mom figure.
As for the over protective/underprotective thing. I'm probably more of a teach your kids to use their heads and let them use it sort of person. Not that my kids will be unsupervised, but I don't feel the need to track their every move, ya know.
Just my 2 cents.
Shawna
post #60 of 180
My dd was one who would bolt away from me until she turned about 3. I really loved her monkey back pack. I could put that on her, she loved it, and tie the other end to a belt loop. I had both hands free, and she was safe. I loved that thing. Now that ds is getting older, I am going to bring it back out for him to keep him safe and from getting lost when my hands are occupied.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Parenting
Mothering › Mothering Forums › Mom › Parenting › People not watching their kids....