Hypnobirthing/Hypnobabies - Page 2

[qimama]

I took the Hypnobirthing class and I listened to the Hypnobabies CDs. I felt very relaxed and fear-free during my birth which I think helped it go as smoothly as possible. (My doula was also indispensable to the whole process.) The nurses were all amazed at how calm I was throughout the birth. I also have a pretty low pain tolerance and was able to do it med free.

I also read "Birthing from Within" which is a fabulous book, but I found the Hypno stuff to be more helpful. In BFW, she talks about ways of "managing" the pain and I just don't think that's possible. Completely surrendering to it was the only way to go for me. I felt like it was a hazing- preparing me for the constant surrender that is motherhood.

I'm pregnant with my second and I will definitely be using at least the CDs again. Best of luck to you for a smooth and happy birth!

Jen

[em123]

I used Hypnobirthing for my son's birth in December (he is my first and only so far, my birth story is posted in the Dec 08 DDC). I had an incredibly positive birth experience and definitely plan on using it again. I labored at home until 9 cm's, then went in and gave birth at the hospital with a midwife. I will definitely say that the skills I learned helped me through it. I stayed calm, trusted that my body knew what it was doing, and relaxed.

It was the most intense thing I've ever been through but I would certainly not call it painful. It was difficult (it is labor after all!) but it was not the painful experience everyone led me to believe. One thing that helped was if I "came out" of the relaxed state I was in my birth partner reassured me that I was doing great and helped me get back into the calm state.

I definitely recommend Hypnobirthing, but I think you have to go into learning about it with an open mind and believe that it will work. Picturing a positive birth helped create it. I know we can't control everything with our thoughts of course, but it worked for me.

Oh and they say Hypnobirthing babies are calm and don't cry as much. Not sure if that's always the case but it's true with my son. He only cries when I do something silly like clip his finger when trying to cut his nails!

[nighten]

Originally Posted by Raene

Not true at all. We will NEVER tell you it's pain free. It even says in the opening statement of Hypnobirthing that we do not guarantee pain-free. We give you methods to COPE with the feelings you are having.

We choose not to use the word pain in general, because for one thing, if you think of pain, even if you are thinking of alleviating pain, your subconscious hears the word "pain" and that's what you get. Next, several people do not feel pain, so we're not going to tell you that you will.

Hope that clears things up a bit.

All I was going by is what I've read from mamas who've used Hypnobirthing and it seems (unfortunately) fairly consistent that if things didn't go as planned -- and there was pain or something that wasn't expected -- they felt as if they'd failed or weren't prepared for it, as several mamas in this very thread have mentioned.

It's quite possible it's not the fault of Hypnobirthing as a course, being lacking somehow, but rather was due to faulty teaching or something. I don't know. But in my research and asking for feedback, the consistent comments regarding pain and failure were red flags to me and enough to make me choose Hypnobabies instead. I know labor hurts. I know it can be very unpredictable. I want to be armed to handle anything -- including vomiting nonstop for 20+ hours (which was my first labor).

Perhaps there's nothing that can fully prepare you for any situation, but based on the feedback I've gotten from other threads here and elsewhere, it seems Hypnobabies was a better fit in terms of being more accommodating to a variety of scenarios, including painful labors, which is what I tend to have.

It's nothing against Hypnobirthing nor anyone who teaches/uses it. It just wasn't as good a fit for my needs, based on what I'd read. The last thing I wanted was a repeat of my previous labor in terms of feeling unprepared.

But obviously it does work for some mamas and that's great.

[Veritaserum]

Originally Posted by nighten

It's quite possible it's not the fault of Hypnobirthing as a course, being lacking somehow, but rather was due to faulty teaching or something. I don't know. But in my research and asking for feedback, the consistent comments regarding pain and failure were red flags to me and enough to make me choose Hypnobabies instead. I know labor hurts. I know it can be very unpredictable. I want to be armed to handle anything -- including vomiting nonstop for 20+ hours (which was my first labor).

Honestly, when I taught HypnoBirthing and presented things the way Mongan taught us to at our training, I felt like I was telling women there is no physiological reason for birth pain. I think that's what Mongan believes. I think she thinks that women only feel pain because they expect to. (She also thinks that women only feel an urge to push because they've been told that they will. Ie. She doesn't think there's a physiological reason to push your baby out.) Therefore, any woman who does feel pain after taking HypnoBirthing did so because she willed it on herself. That's just not right and was a big reason why I chose to switch to teaching Hypnobabies instead.

Certainly expectation plays a role in what we experience, but it's unfair and inaccurate to imply that it is the major reason why women experience birth pain. HypnoBirthing also talks about fear/tension/pain, which definitely makes sense (Hypnobabies, Bradley, and other birth classes talk about this, too). I just think HypnoBirthing leaves a lot of mamas (mistakenly) feeling like they just didn't want it hard enough or do it right.... A mom could do everything "perfectly" and still have a more challenging birth than she anticipated (I'm one of those mamas, btw). That's another place I see Hypnobabies as being very valuable, since the techniques are adaptable to unique situations.

[Raene]

Interesting about your thoughts on "Birthing From Within".

I have always found that book to go against Hypnobirthing concepts b/c it is all about "being a fierce warrior and fighting the pain"...something I don't find relaxing to think about. However, I'll admit I have the book too! There are a few chapters that are more helpful to me.

[veganone]

Originally Posted by BethSLP

Although I ended up induced in the hospital with pre-e and I just used my rainbow relaxation, birthing affirmations, etc. as best I could. And my teacher was available to me all the time, so when things started to go south we had an "emergency session" for hypnosis which was the best part in retrospect. her support was wonderful.

XOXO
B

I had a teacher who made it clear that if you don't have the birth you envision, it is because you failed in the hypnobirthing process. I had a friend call her to tell her why we missed our final session (I gave birth) and never heard from her again.

[veganone]

Originally Posted by Raene

Any practitioner who tells you it will be pain-free must have fallen asleep in the training. Lol. We're advised never to say such things...it's just not true for everyone.

I guess my PP addresses this, but my impression was VERY different and much closer to what Beth said; that if you experience pain it's because you bring it on yourself.

My instructor trained with Mongan, so I don't believe it was lack of training. I think that's what Mongan's view really is.

[Sudonk]

I took a HypnoBirthing class prior to my first birth. I ran into the same issues others have mentioned, plus some others. I found it useful in making me more optimistic about my birth being comfortable, but I left the final class feeling baffled about how to achieve that. I wound up using supplemental scripts designed for women who feel they need more after taking HypnoBirthing to prepare. Those scripts gave me some more powerful skills to use during the birth, so I managed to go med-free. But I had a long, complicated birth and within a few hours found that the only way I could remain focused and calm was to curl on my side with my eyes closed - not at all how I wanted to give birth. That inability to move around as my body wanted to really made the complications worse. But the thing that still irks me to this day is the fact that before signing up for the class, I spoke to the instructor several times about my expectations and the fact that I was looking for as complete an education as possible. She assured me that the class was a complete childbirth education class, and I wouldn't need to take any other classes or even read anything else. It wasn't until long after my birth that I began doing more reading and began to realize just how wrong she was. Much of the difficulty I experienced during my birth could have been eliminated or minimized with even basic knowledge of birth, but I didn't have it. I also had no understanding of potential interventions, so I could tell the staff that I didn't want interventions, but when things were no longer going "by the book", I was completely unable to have an intelligent conversation about my wishes, because I had never learned the risks I was supposed to be avoiding by not getting interventions. I honestly feel like I had a great birth despite taking the HypnoBirthing class. And when I talked to my instructor afterwards, she was happy for me about having a comfortable birth, but made it clear that I needed to study more next time, because the long, difficult birth I described made it clear I wasn't trying hard enough. Ironically, when she had her first child several months later, she wound up with a c-section due to FTP and actually apologized to me for her previous attitude, so it wasn't just my imagination that she thought that.

With my subsequent children, I ordered the Hypnobabies Home Study program, and can't say enough wonderful things about it. Within 30 minutes of opening the book, I had learned more about hypnosis and birth than I had gotten out of the entire HypnoBirthing class. I was shocked to learn how very little I actually knew about birth, despite the previous class. I was also surprised that the Hypnobabies home study was actually much more thorough, easy to follow and far easier to learn than the HypnoBirthing class I had taken. But the true test was my birth - I was totally blown away by how much easier it was to use the skills I had learned through Hypnobabies. I remember during my first birth, it felt like I needed a crane or an act of God to change my position even slightly. But with Hypnobabies, I was not only completely active the whole time (except when I napped) - it felt GOOD and easy to move around. I stayed at work for a full day, even though I was well into my birthing time. I came home, had dinner and then happily worked on taxes while calling out my waves to my husband so he could time them for a couple hours so I wouldn't have to do taxes with a newborn (or risk letting my husband attempt them - he's brilliant but not so good with numbers). Then when things became really intense and I couldn't sit there any more, I went to bed and slept soundly for 4 hours. When I woke up, I decided it was time to head to the birth center and arrived 20 minutes later, fully dilated. Now, I did experience one of the same complications from my first birth at that time, and began having intense back labor that turned into a uterine spasm (like a constant birthing wave with no break). So I waited a few hours until that let up before I pushed him out. But I still can't say how incredibly easy it seemed to handle even something like that using my Hypnobabies self-hypnosis and hypno-anesthesia skills, rather than trying to do it with the HypnoBirthing relaxation approach. I could move around as my body needed me to, which helped relieve the intensity and shorten the experience. Plus, I had learned all about natural childbirth through Hypnobabies, and knew all the typical ncb "tricks" to staying comfortable and moving the birth along. That knowledge would have helped so much with my first birth!

I think HypnoBirthing means well, and I know that having any additional relaxation training will make a woman's birth better than it would be without any. But I still think there are very few, if any instances where someone would be better served by taking a HypnoBirthing class rather than doing Hypnobabies (Home Study or Live Class). If you're going to take the time to prepare, it just makes far more sense to me to spend that time preparing completely. In my experience, there is really no comparison between the two as far as the level of preparedness and effectiveness goes.

[catemom]

Okay, I did a sort of minimal hypnobirthing class with my first pg. I had a hospital induction for being "post dates" and I definitely do not remember it hurting (although at the time it may have), I just remember it being so intense that I really had to go into myself and focus. Hospitals don't like to wait around to see what happens for very long after they batter you and your baby with pitocin for 8 hours, so I ended up getting a c/s. :::

This time, I took a much more informative (Hypnobirthing) class taught by a hb mw instead of a hospital employee. I really liked the class, and I liked having an instructor there to ask questions and to teach us everything. It wasn't as cheap as hypnobabies (which I believe is being sued by the hypnobirthing people for illegedly stealing their content, btw) but it was worth the money to have hands on instruction. I'm planning an hbac waterbirth this time, and I am getting pretty excited about it.

Anyway, if you don't care whether or not you go to an actual class, I'm sure either one is probably going to really help you (if you practice!) when you need it most.

[sheridanskids]

I have used both programs

I used HypnoBirthing for my 2nd baby and Hypnobabies for my 3rd. I felt like Hypnobabies had a LOT more tools and I had a very comfortable birth. You can read my comparison of the two programs here.
http://www.pregnancybirthandbabies.c...pnoclasses.htm

You can also see my birth video on that site too.

[nighten]

Originally Posted by catemom

It wasn't as cheap as hypnobabies (which I believe is being sued by the hypnobirthing people for illegedly stealing their content, btw)

It's my understanding that Mongan sued and lost.

[MG01]

I am doing some hypnobirthing stuff for my upcoming birth. I had been interested in it during much of my pregnancy, and spoke with various people- some who swear by it, others who feel it is a good option but tends to fall short as the one and only option if a woman does not have other tools available. I think I have a fairly balanced perspective on it. My take is that I didn't want to commit to any one mindset or program or way of doing things for my pregnancy and birth, but to create a positive frame of mind and gather as many different tools as possible, taking what fits well for me from a variety of sources.

I read Birthing From Within and got some good input from that, especially in terms of the birth art and some coping skills for during the birth- actual, concrete exercises as well as attitudes/philosophies.
eta: I did also take a more traditional birth class through our local birth center, covering the stages of labor, positions and pressure to help, complications, etc.

I also found a doula who has completed the Mongan/Hypnobirthing training, but has chosen not to get certified or teach the program- she likes the concept but not all aspects of it, and finds that doing it without certification gives her more flexibility. I love her approach, and while I loved the concept from the first time I heard of it, I was a bit skeptical that I would be able to achieve hypnosis or learn to use those tools effectively. I think my approach and my doula's may differ from the official class. I did read the book, and do the rainbow relaxation daily once or twice. I am doing this without a partner, so much of this is just me practicing and preparing. I also meet with my doula weekly to practice deepening and visualization scripts with her.

I don't consider myself a die-hard proponent of the method or believe that is my only tool, but it may well be. That said, I know I have other tools in my arsenal, and believe that is ideal, since I won't know until my birth how I feel or what exactly I need. When I first started the exercises, I wasn't sure I understood how that would carry over to birth, whether the relaxation/hypnosis would be a skill I could implement in labor, with distractions and surges and all going on.. But as I have practiced more, I feel much more confident. The big thing for me has been practicing consistently, in different positions and settings, and working with my doula on some of the more intensive scripts.

I recently had an external version done, and wanted to try to do it without the terbutaline, to use hypnosis to relax the uterine muscles to prevent them from contracting and allow the doctor to getting a good grip on the baby, as well as to overcome the fear/tension/pain which I had been told is awful with this particular procedure. That was an awesome experience as I was able to implement some of these skills in a medical setting with significant uterine pressure/pain, new people, noise from machines, etc. and to do so more spontaneously, entering in and out of relaxation as needed, rather than start script-relax-end script, yk? It was not successful in turning the baby, but it was successful in that I feel much more confident in my ability to control my body's physical relaxation and my mental/emotional response to such feelings. The best way I can describe it is intense pressure/pangs, which I could tell "should" have been painful, and may have been interpreted that way by some, or myself in another context, but I did not feel it as pain in a distressing way. I am not sure how to explain it better than that. I was relaxed and calm, it was not a big deal, although I was told they were pushing extremely hard, and my uterus can sure feel it today.. That gives me some confidence that these skills are preparing me for the birth process.

I don't know about the class or the "official mindset," but I also think it makes sense to make a conscious effort to talk about pressure, surges, etc. rather than reinforcing the idea of labor as first and foremost a painful endeavor. I think one should leave themselves open, rather than succumb to labeling the feeling before they have even experienced it. It may be painful for many women, but why address it in that way before having gone there, yk? And to me, much of that really is how you see it. I think something could be the same stimulus, but be interpreted both as pain, and not painful, by the same woman in different circumstances, or by two different women.. it really is subjective. A lot of that is just how you define it.. Bbut I agree, it may not be realistic to convince women they shouldn't feel pain and if they do it's wrong/bad.. I think it makes more sense to just leave things open, that whatever sensations occur are natural and manageable and to be evaluated by you in the moment, not by a stereotype or a fear or a cultural standard, yk? That is how I interpret that aspect, anyway..

[octobermoon]

Originally Posted by Mama_Gaia

I am doing some hypnobirthing stuff for my upcoming birth. I had been interested in it during much of my pregnancy, and spoke with various people- some who swear by it, others who feel it is a good option but tends to fall short as the one and only option if a woman does not have other tools available. I think I have a fairly balanced perspective on it. My take is that I didn't want to commit to any one mindset or program or way of doing things for my pregnancy and birth, but to create a positive frame of mind and gather as many different tools as possible, taking what fits well for me from a variety of sources.

I read Birthing From Within and got some good input from that, especially in terms of the birth art and some coping skills for during the birth- actual, concrete exercises as well as attitudes/philosophies.

I also found a doula who has completed the Mongan/Hypnobirthing training, but has chosen not to get certified or teach the program- she likes the concept but not all aspects of it, and finds that doing it without certification gives her more flexibility. I love her approach, and while I loved the concept from the first time I heard of it, I was a bit skeptical that I would be able to achieve hypnosis or learn to use those tools effectively. I think my approach and my doula's may differ from the official class. I did read the book, and do the rainbow relaxation daily once or twice. I am doing this without a partner, so much of this is just me practicing and preparing. I also meet with my doula weekly to practice deepening and visualization scripts with her.

I don't consider myself a die-hard proponent of the method or believe that is my only tool, but it may well be. That said, I know I have other tools in my arsenal, and believe that is ideal, since I won't know until my birth how I feel or what exactly I need. When I first started the exercises, I wasn't sure I understood how that would carry over to birth, whether the relaxation/hypnosis would be a skill I could implement in labor, with distractions and surges and all going on.. But as I have practiced more, I feel much more confident. The big thing for me has been practicing consistently, in different positions and settings, and working with my doula on some of the more intensive scripts.

I recently had an external version done, and wanted to try to do it without the terbutaline, to use hypnosis to relax the uterine muscles to prevent them from contracting and allow the doctor to getting a good grip on the baby, as well as to overcome the fear/tension/pain which I had been told is awful with this particular procedure. That was an awesome experience as I was able to implement some of these skills in a medical setting with significant uterine pressure/pain, new people, noise from machines, etc. and to do so more spontaneously, entering in and out of relaxation as needed, rather than start script-relax-end script, yk? It was not successful in turning the baby, but it was successful in that I feel much more confident in my ability to control my body's physical relaxation and my mental/emotional response to such feelings. The best way I can describe it is intense pressure/pangs, which I could tell "should" have been painful, and may have been interpreted that way by some, or myself in another context, but I did not feel it as pain in a distressing way. I am not sure how to explain it better than that. I was relaxed and calm, it was not a big deal, although I was told they were pushing extremely hard, and my uterus can sure feel it today.. That gives me some confidence that these skills are preparing me for the birth process.

I don't know about the class or the "official mindset," but I also think it makes sense to make a conscious effort to talk about pressure, surges, etc. rather than reinforcing the idea of labor as first and foremost a painful endeavor. I think one should leave themselves open, rather than succumb to labeling the feeling before they have even experienced it. It may be painful for many women, but why address it in that way before having gone there, yk? And to me, much of that really is how you see it. I think something could be the same stimulus, but be interpreted both as pain, and not painful, by the same woman in different circumstances, or by two different women.. it really is subjective. A lot of that is just how you define it.. Bbut I agree, it may not be realistic to convince women they shouldn't feel pain and if they do it's wrong/bad.. I think it makes more sense to just leave things open, that whatever sensations occur are natural and manageable and to be evaluated by you in the moment, not by a stereotype or a fear or a cultural standard, yk? That is how I interpret that aspect, anyway..

very well put.

[Angelorum]

No personal experience but if you go here (or just look up pregtastic podcast in the itunes store, you can download free podcasts with interviews of the founders of both hypnobirth and hypnobabies, as well as shows about various other birthing methods. I really enjoyed them.

ps. the hypnobirth show is one of their earlier ones, you have to click on previous entries to find it.

[veganone]

Originally Posted by nighten

It's my understanding that Mongan sued and lost.

That is really interesting. How can anyone claim ownership of hypnosis? My mom is a therapist that uses hypnosis and has used it with clients during labor, but had no idea any formal anything existed about hypnosis and childbirth until I looked into it during my pregnancy.

I am really getting a lot from this thread. I posted a similar question when I was pregnant and didn't get nearly the same level of discussion, so know I feel comfortable with trying Hypnobabies if we have another...

[callieollie]

I did the hypnobabies home study course with my second child (did bradley with my first) and loved it! I had a virtually pain-free birth but more importantly, I felt calm and relaxed and felt like I could really enjoy the process. With my first baby, I sort of "white knuckled" it through each contraction, just waiting for it to be over. This time, the pressure waves would come and I didn't feel any dread or fear. I just accepted it as what was happening. I didn't experience them as painful either. They felt to me like how it feels when you get your blood pressure taken - a tightening feeling, where at one point it gets to a place where you think "gee, that's getting tight. Is she going to stop tightening it?" but then right when you think that, the nurse let's it out and the presssure goes away. That's how the contractions felt to me - a build up of pressure that would get to a point (when they got more intense) where I thought "ooh, is this going to get any tighter?" and then I'd think that and it would stop. I felt that there were tons of tools that could be used during the labor and I actually didn't even use many or the ones I thought I'd use, but that was mainly because my labor was only 3 1/2 hours! There's also a part in the home study course that is a "if things don't go as planned" kind of thing that your partner can read through and if things change during the course of labor, they can read that script to you. I looked through it briefly and it seemed to talk about just feeling calm and accepting of the change in plans, which I could see being helpful in preventing any feelings of failure or disappointment that could arise.

I really loved hypnobabies and actually am looking forward to labor again (and the pregnancy for that matter - I found it very soothing listening to the tapes each night during my pregnancy) just so I can experience it.

[Kehaulani]

I used Hypnobabies for my first birth and will be using it again with my upcoming birth of baby #2. For someone who was afraid of needles, pain, hospitals, and childbirth in general Hypnobabies did an amazing job of completely shifting my mind frame to a very positive one...I began to actually look forward to giving birth! I was comitted and practiced everyday (which I believe is key in reinforcing to your inner mind that you will have a comfortable birthing.) I definitely felt tightening and lots of pressure but never any pain. I remember it getting pretty intense (but never painful)...but apparently it was only in my mind because even the doctor and nurses didn't believe I was in active labor because I looked too calm. I was actually 9 cm dilated when I got to the hospital. I felt like both my husband and I were fully prepared to give birth naturally with all the different tools that we learned. We were also prepared to deal with the hospital staff so that we knew what our choices were and were able to make informed decisions. I honestly can not say enough great things about Hypnobabies. I walked away from my first birth feeling so empowered and like I could do it over and over again!

[Veritaserum]

Originally Posted by catemom

This time, I took a much more informative (Hypnobirthing) class taught by a hb mw instead of a hospital employee. I really liked the class, and I liked having an instructor there to ask questions and to teach us everything. It wasn't as cheap as hypnobabies (which I believe is being sued by the hypnobirthing people for illegedly stealing their content, btw) but it was worth the money to have hands on instruction.

Two things. One, Hypnobabies has not stolen any content from HypnoBirthing. They are completely, entirely separate--very different--as anyone familiar with both will say. Two, Hypnobabies is available as a home study program or a live class. The live Hypnobabies class is preferable if available, since it includes helpful in person instruction and additional content. The home study is a viable option, though, for mamas who can't take a live class. If I had the choice between a live HypnoBirthing class and the Hypnobabies home study, though, I would choose the Hypnobabies home study since the hypnosis techniques and childbirth education are more effective and comprehensive.

[mrsrobertson]

With my first pregnancy I took a Hypnobirthing class with an instructor. it was just my husband and me. She showed a few birth videos and we got a book. I asked her about scripts for my husband to read to me as well and she said they were in the book. by the end of all of our sessions i had 3 cds which she had made for me in each class, and the book. That was it. I felt so unprepared, and nervous and scared that this REALLY wasn't enough! I didn't see how this was going to help me have a pain free birthing (which my instructor did teach me i would if i did it right).

By the middle of my 8th month, after scouring the internet trying to WRITE my own scripts... i finally decided to spend the money and buy Hypnobabies.
It was like night and day! A huge workbook. SEVERAL scripts on cd!! handouts for my caregiver, booklet and guide for my husband.

And like a previous poster said, i learned MORE about hypnosis and how my mind works and how hypnosis works in birthing in the first class than i did in my entire hypnobirthing class.

Well, my son came 10 days early and I only got 9 days practice! But with 9 days of practice i'd say about half of my entire labor was completely pain free and very comfortable. i slept a lot during that first half which was great, because by the second half... back labor kicked in and it was one hell of a ride! Thing is... Hypnobabies has a technique they teach for that too! if only i'd had more time!!


When I had my second birth, I had plenty of practice. I started around 20 weeks so I would have the confidence of knowing I had plenty of practice in. I had a completely PAIN FREE birthing, and pushed my 9lb 5 oz son out like butter! I had no "ring of fire" because of all the great stuff they teach about moving your anesthesia around and out in front of your babies head.

My midwives at one point even asked my doula if she could tell if I was still contracting. I was passed out in the birthing pool!
It definitely got a bit intense at the end, I think I was holding him back a bit. Once I turned my "pushing" gears on and realized...oh yeah!! okay i CAN do this... he was born so easily.

I honestly can't say enough good things about Hypnobabies.

sheridan listed above the pregnancybirthandbabies.com site... i do suggest watching the birthing videos. My second birthing video is there as well.

[Raene]

Originally Posted by veganone

That is really interesting. How can anyone claim ownership of hypnosis? My mom is a therapist that uses hypnosis and has used it with clients during labor, but had no idea any formal anything existed about hypnosis and childbirth until I looked into it during my pregnancy.

I am really getting a lot from this thread. I posted a similar question when I was pregnant and didn't get nearly the same level of discussion, so know I feel comfortable with trying Hypnobabies if we have another...

The creator of HypnoBabies, I think her name is Kerry, was a student of Mongan's. She learned HypnoBirthing first and took her knowledge with that and created HypnoBabies. (Just for some background)