Difference of opinion - Page 2

[nettieferg]

Originally Posted by jwhispers

Well, like I said I don't think we should focus on the experience good or bad but just the act itself.

--- Agreed! Just meant 'the experience' compared to others'

Most of those reasons are 'overblown'. It's important to consider them in perspective. For example, UTI are rare in boys. Even if circumcision does protect against them, the actual difference is very small. The cervical cancer link is equally small, if it exists at all. A lot of times when you hear about benefits of circumcision they say, it reduces this or that by some big percent. But they don't tell you that even with such a big relative reduction (if you were to even believe the numbers) the actual reduction, especially in a first world country, is usually very small. Meaning you have to circumcise say 1,000 or 2,000 or more to maybe derive a benefit. Plus, they rarely consider (or mention) the fact that the benefit can be more easily, safely, and more effectively be realized in better ways.

--- Grr -- Why does this smack of the vaccine issue (everybody has an agenda and is lying through their statistical teeth) ?? . . . Also haven't make up my mind on this for my 6.5 m/o --- just doing NOTHING at present.

It's tough to see through the dogma when it surrounds you but we can help you. So if you want to discuss specifics, let us know we're here for that. I hope you'll stick around and learn.

--- I will -- thanks for being so helpful. Other posters should know that sounding offensive may push other questioners the other way . . . And, I assume most of you lovely people are here for the same reason I hang out on the BF board -- you have an agenda to push: ---You want to help the babies! ---

[kriket]

OP. I would delay my nuptials if I knew my SO wanted to circ my son.

I could never imagine cutting a functional part off my son, your instincts are right. It isn't right, it isn't acceptable and it is worth leaving the man to save your son from mutilation.

[Bm31]

Originally Posted by 3pink1blue

just because your DF has "no problems" doesn't mean your son wouldn't. two of the four circed guys ive been with had severe sexual dysfunction due to their circumcisions. and how many men would ever actually admit to having an "inferior" penis, even if it were true? not many that i know, anyway.

leave it up to your (future) son to decide. it can always be taken off, but never put back.

Excellent points all!! Many side effects of circ are either not recognized as such and/or men are very reluctant to talk about them. I was in my mid 30's before I connected the dots, so to speak, as to what caused my indifference/lack of enjoyment with sex. And the thing is, the whole time I KNEW I had two corrective surgeries as a child (though it wasn't made clear at the time they were because of the original circ). In this society, admitting anything short of having a stellar penis is seen as a huge chink in a man's armor.

As far as that guy that hated being intact, I wouldn't underestimate the mental side of things. Living in a "cut" society could easily make an intact person feel something was wrong with them. However, the few intact guys I've met IRL (that admitted so at least) have not had that level of trauma. Four of them that still are intact shrug it off as "normal" to them and wouldn't dream of getting cut. The other guy now in his mid twenties chose to get circ. as a 15 year old. He doesn't pine away over it but now freely admits it was a mistake and would tell anyone else in the same position NOT to do it.

[jessjgh1]

Here's some random thougths, suggestions, take what you will...

Give your fiance a little time to absorb the information, too. Remember you were just at a point where you thought you'd go ahead with it, but now you have more info. Tell him what you have learned that is not emotional like the video--- that it was recommended (as when he was a baby) but is no longer recommended, that it started for crazy reasoning in a time obsessed with 'hygiene' (started to prevent masturbation), that around half of people in the US are going to be leaving their sons intact, that most of the world is intact and NONE of them are having the crazy problems he mentioned.

Tell him that you envision a peaceful pregnancy and birth, bringing a child into a world of love and being a part of that process and that circumcision goes against that instinct because it is painful and carries potential risk. Tell him that since it is medically unnecessary you need him to be willing to research more and understand the implications of circumcision. Tell him its not about what was done to him, but that medical practices around birth have changed drastically and till you both agree on a reason to have something unnecesary done, you are uncomfortable with iit.

Tell him to keep MIL and others out of the issue till the both of you can discuss it rationally--- and that there are many myths out there that people believe and pass on.

Just some suggestions..... hope he can come back with an open mind, but he may need a little time to catch his breath and wonder where this is all coming from

Jessica

[savvybabygrace]

*deleted*

[Seie]

I live in a country where hardly anyone is circ'ed. I have been with a lot of men in my time - only two of whom were circ'ed. And both of them had problems. They both thought using a condom was difficult and unpleasent (while most men I have been with have thought it was better without condoms, then only these two circ'ed men have actually felt uncomfortable wearing one)
One of them was circ'ed at 6 years old - no drugs at all. He said its the most painful thing he ever experienced - he couldnt wear trousers for a month.

For me being used to intact men my experience is that the circ'ed penis just doesnt work as its supposed to.

Where I live as mentioned most every man is intact. And every man I have ever discussed the subject with find it barbaric and wrong to even consider circ'ing healthy babies. I have yet to meet an intact man who would willingly part with his foreskin..

[LavenderMae]

I was responding to a post that was down playing circumcision and making it out like there is a way to do it right. And that marital harmony is worth more than a child's body part. That is wrong on so many levels and I don't think it's inappropriate in the least for anyone to say so.


I am very glad to hear when anyone chooses to get educated and rethink a poor decision they've made in the past.


I have much empathy and compassion for any parent who has made a heartbreaking mistake with their child/ren. It hurts like hell and I'm sure none of us will escape it. However that is not what the post I was responding to was about (rather it was down playing and excusing) and thus my reaction was not of sympathy for the parent but the child.

[Tjej]

Circ or not, it sounds to me like your fiance is being disrespectful of you (belittle-ing your research and effort and opinion). Marriage is very hard work, and it is very very hard when you and your DP are not respecting each other. Maybe it just comes off worse than it is, but that is my take on what you have said.

As far as circ-ing, it has been hard on my DH and I that we do not agree. DS was not circumcised, but somehow DH still thinks that if we have another son then we'll circ that one - um... he obviously just feels he has compromised about DS's foreskin to appease me. That's a whole other thread.

There will be things that you and your DP will not agree on when you are married (if you are married), and things will have to go one way or the other. It is really difficult and it is important to be able to approach problems with an attitude of putting the other first and loving the other person, which his reaction to your discussion does not sound like his attitude.

Tjej

[My*Scorpio]

This article may be helpful: The Vunerability of Men

One thing that helped to convince my DH was when he heard others speak out against circumcision. Then it wasn't just one crazy person

I applaud your efforts to resolve this issue before you are married!

[becominkindacruncy]

Thank you for all the responses. I really do appreciate it. I haven't shown him the video or asked him to do research himself because I haven't had the chance to ask him. We have been really busy since our conversation about circ. I plan on talking to him again tonight. Does anyone have a link to a site about the numbers of intact males by state? Is there such a thing? We live in WA and maybe if I could chow him that not that many guys around here are circed that it might help with the "teasing."

Thank you all again and I will continue to fight this battle! On a good note, my younger sister (19 yo) is due in May with a boy and she is not going to circ! : She doesn't see the point and doesn't want to pay for it. She said he could pay for it later if he wanted it done. I was so excited to hear that!!

[Yulia_R]

Good luck, mama.

Great news about your sister. One thing I wanted to ask you if you could please forward her these two very important links:

A Warning For Parents of Intact Sons http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=129378

The Definition of "Retraction" & Why it is BAD http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=575627