Describe the financial future...?

[Theoretica]

The other thread got me thinking, what are we headed for? And I mean specifically, I get it the markets aren't stable, interest rates suck, yada yada yada. I mean day to day life, and how we, every day people, will see and experience the changes that are still coming from our nation's slide into financial ruin. Is it going to be a repeat of the Great Depression or Russia in the Cold War? Do you think we'll see bread lines and soup kitchens? Will grocery stores be empty? What about gas...do you think the price will go back up, will there be shortages? Or do you think we'll notice because the wealthier of the middle class are going to have to give up their luxuries?

I'd love to hear what everyone here thinks.

[marimara]

I read James Kunstler, author of The Long Emergency
http://jameshowardkunstler.typepad.com/
He does a pretty good job of explaining what life would be like post peak oil. I agree with him.

[Violet2]

IMO events are rapidly outpacing Kunstler's predictions and analysis. Further, he has a marked bias as he is a staunch, hardcore dystopian. I think he would be sad if the human species survived.

The future will be a middle point between extremes. It won't be like it was, but it won't be as bad as everyone thinks. I like Sharon Astyk's vision.

But specifically--

--No retirement
--Limited healthcare
--Barter economy
--Everyone gardens
--Increased crime
--dead oceans
--water scarcity and resource competition
--expensive gas


CAVEAT: If we transition to natural gas for almost every energy need and if it is true what I've been reading that there is actually an abundant supply, natural gas will likely fuel another boom cycle within the next 10-15 years.

V

[SeekingJoy]

http://www.chrismartenson.com/crashcourse

nak

[marimara]

I also like Sharon Astyk and Chris Martenson. I agree that Kunstler can be a bit 'dystopian'. Sharon is more 'real life' and Chris is more economic 'big picture'. But IMO they all offer 'some' explanations and visions to look at.

[velochic]

I have no idea, but I'd guess it looks a lot different than it did 2 years ago.

[Theoretica]

I guess I'm looking along the lines of what you (general public) think as opposed to what experts think, ykwim?

[MilkTrance]

Originally Posted by Violet2

IMO events are rapidly outpacing Kunstler's predictions and analysis. Further, he has a marked bias as he is a staunch, hardcore dystopian. I think he would be sad if the human species survived.

The future will be a middle point between extremes. It won't be like it was, but it won't be as bad as everyone thinks. I like Sharon Astyk's vision.

But specifically--

--No retirement
--Limited healthcare
--Barter economy
--Everyone gardens
--Increased crime
--dead oceans
--water scarcity and resource competition
--expensive gas


CAVEAT: If we transition to natural gas for almost every energy need and if it is true what I've been reading that there is actually an abundant supply, natural gas will likely fuel another boom cycle within the next 10-15 years.

V

Everyone gardens? Really? That does not seem very realistic to me at all. A bit fantastical, even. I'm not putting you down, but it does not make sense to me. What makes more sense is -- and I hate to say it because I'm very pro-organic -- large-scale corporation run farms so that at least food supply is taken care of.

To address the original post. What do I think will happen? I have no idea. Nobody knows. But if you consider how utterly wasteful "we" (North Americans) are, if we did not "waste" HALF of what we currently waste (food, electricity, water, etc), we would STILL be very comfortable.

My friend put it this way (paraphrasing her) -- 'Nobody knows what will happen. We could get hit by a car tomorrow and die. We cannot predict the future. Why, when we anticipate change, do we assume it will be negative? It could be positive.'

I'm not trying to be all Pollyanna, but really, in my opinion Christ said it best when he was all up in that boat in the storm and asked -- why do you worry?

[Sonnenwende]

Economy is cyclical. It will suck for awhile, but eventually, it will recover reasonably. People will begin to forget this ever happened and swear it will never happen again. Times will be good. Then too good. Then collapse again. Repeat ad nauseam.

[mandib50]

i think it will end, things will be back to more or less the way they were. did we actually learn anything from previous recessions ... doesn't really seem like it, but things eventually returned to "normal". i hope that people become more wise about their spending and institutions and people involved in companies selling stocks become less greedy.

[Violet2]

Originally Posted by MilkTrance

Everyone gardens? Really? That does not seem very realistic to me at all. A bit fantastical, even. I'm not putting you down, but it does not make sense to me. What makes more sense is -- and I hate to say it because I'm very pro-organic -- large-scale corporation run farms so that at least food supply is taken care of.

To address the original post. What do I think will happen? I have no idea. Nobody knows. But if you consider how utterly wasteful "we" (North Americans) are, if we did not "waste" HALF of what we currently waste (food, electricity, water, etc), we would STILL be very comfortable.

My friend put it this way (paraphrasing her) -- 'Nobody knows what will happen. We could get hit by a car tomorrow and die. We cannot predict the future. Why, when we anticipate change, do we assume it will be negative? It could be positive.'

I'm not trying to be all Pollyanna, but really, in my opinion Christ said it best when he was all up in that boat in the storm and asked -- why do you worry?

Actually if you watch the documentary The Power of Community about when Cuba lost it's oil supply due to the collapse of the Soviet Union, agribusiness was not sustainable. Guess what fertilizers are made out of? Oil.

So everyone gardened. On the rooftops of big buildings. They ripped out concrete parking lots to grow food for local consumption. And all farming was organic b/c they had no other choice.

V

[shayinme]

Originally Posted by MilkTrance

Everyone gardens? Really? That does not seem very realistic to me at all. A bit fantastical, even. I'm not putting you down, but it does not make sense to me. What makes more sense is -- and I hate to say it because I'm very pro-organic -- large-scale corporation run farms so that at least food supply is taken care of.

To address the original post. What do I think will happen? I have no idea. Nobody knows. But if you consider how utterly wasteful "we" (North Americans) are, if we did not "waste" HALF of what we currently waste (food, electricity, water, etc), we would STILL be very comfortable.

My friend put it this way (paraphrasing her) -- 'Nobody knows what will happen. We could get hit by a car tomorrow and die. We cannot predict the future. Why, when we anticipate change, do we assume it will be negative? It could be positive.'

I'm not trying to be all Pollyanna, but really, in my opinion Christ said it best when he was all up in that boat in the storm and asked -- why do you worry?

I agree that the idea of everyone gardening is not realistic at all. I used to live on the 22nd floor of a high rise in Chicago, there is no way I could have gardened in that situation since at that high up, my windows didn't even have ledges so even putting something in a pot wouldn't work.

I'm with you, I cannot worry about all these possible doom day scenarios. Yes, I am making some changes, I try to keep a surplus of food and cash on hand. This year I have signed up for a CSA again and am looking at a meat CSA as well. I want to be prepared but at the same time I am not going to drive myself crazy either.