In Pediatrics?

[Deborah]

Looks as though it is just in the online version, though.

http://pediatrics.aappublications.or...ract/123/3/771

about measles and allergies--kids who have had measles have less allergies.

[mamakay]

Interesting. I wonder how the effect (if it's real) matches with the one in 7,000 measles mortality rate. Atopic disorders do kill. How many atopic deaths could be prevented with measles per birth cohort? How does that match up with the deaths from measles prevaccine?

[ema-adama]

Originally Posted by mamakay

Interesting. I wonder how the effect (if it's real) matches with the one in 7,000 measles mortality rate. Atopic disorders do kill. How many atopic deaths could be prevented with measles per birth cohort? How does that match up with the deaths from measles prevaccine?

Yes.

And Wow - just wow.

[Ophelia]

Can someone interpret this sentence for me? "However, no associations were found between measles vaccination and allergic disease."

I can't tell exactly what they are saying. thanks!

[shuttlt]

Originally Posted by Ophelia

Can someone interpret this sentence for me? "However, no associations were found between measles vaccination and allergic disease."

I can't tell exactly what they are saying. thanks!

My reading of the results section of the article is that both measles and measles vaccination are associated with a reduction in allergies. The sentence you quote seems quite difficult to read. I take it to mean that, after they eliminated subjects who showed signs of allergy during the first year of life, the positive association between measles and reduced allergies went remained, but the one between vaccination and reduced allergies went away.

[kiara7]

Originally Posted by Ophelia

Can someone interpret this sentence for me? "However, no associations were found between measles vaccination and allergic disease."

I can't tell exactly what they are saying. thanks!

Inverse association between measles infection and allergies - children who had measles had less allergies.

No association between measles vax and allergic disease - children who had measles vax, didn't have less (or more) allergies. So, measles could mean less allergies overall, measles vax - nothing.

[mamakay]

My reading of the results section of the article is that both measles and measles vaccination are associated with a reduction in allergies.

I'm reading it was just measles (and NOT the vaccine) is associated with a reduction in allergies.

[mamakay]

This isn't the first study to find this result, by the way.
But...with all these studies, there's a good chance there's a confounding factor in there. The two most plausible are that anthroposophic kids are encouraged to play outside more, and it's exposure to "the great outdoors" that creates the effect, and measles is just a coincidence...or...that the kids who caught measles weren't vaxed for anything, and it's the aluminum adjuvant exposure in the vaxed kids that creates the effect.(again, measles would just be a coincidence.)

[shuttlt]

Originally Posted by mamakay

I'm reading it was just measles (and NOT the vaccine) is associated with a reduction in allergies.

This is the line that made me think otherwise:

In the whole group of children, atopic sensitization was inversely associated with measles infection, and a similar tendency was seen for measles vaccination.

As I read it the inverse association with vaccination dissappeared after they removed children who showed allergies before 12 months. This is an interesting finding (if I'm reading it right) and I'd be grateful for an explanation.

[mamakay]

The fulltext will probably be available for free somewhere in a month or 2. It'll be easier for us to discuss once we can read the whole thing.

[shuttlt]

Originally Posted by mamakay

The fulltext will probably be available for free somewhere in a month or 2. It'll be easier for us to discuss once we can read the whole thing.

I agree.

[mamakay]

Originally Posted by shuttlt

This is the line that made me think otherwise:


As I read it the inverse association with vaccination dissappeared after they removed children who showed allergies before 12 months. This is an interesting finding (if I'm reading it right) and I'd be grateful for an explanation.

If the effect is real, it could be that both measles and the vaccine have a "curative" effect on pre-existing allergies, but only "real measles" has a preventive effect on developing allergies later in childhood?

[shuttlt]

Originally Posted by mamakay

If the effect is real, it could be that both measles and the vaccine have a "curative" effect on pre-existing allergies, but only "real measles" has a preventive effect on developing allergies later in childhood?

Odd, but possible. We need the full paper.

[Deborah]

I don't think it is just the anthroposophic lifestyle effect. They have anthro kids without the vaccine and without measles who have allergies.

Back a ways I knew an anthroposophic family who had skipped the vaccines. Their kids had never had measles and one had allergies and asthma.

Eagerly awaiting the full-text, here, also.

[mamakay]

Oh, you're right. Those are all anthroposophic kids.
So I guess either the effect is real, or maybe it was the presence of the other shots that caused allergies. Or maybe a mix of both.

[gardenmom]

Originally Posted by mamakay

The fulltext will probably be available for free somewhere in a month or 2. It'll be easier for us to discuss once we can read the whole thing.

Not if HR 801 gets passed:
http://www.maplight.org/HR801_2009_Analysis

[Deborah]

Oh crap! They are trying to keep research paid for by the taxpayer out of the hands of the public. Sweet.

I should be able to get hold of a copy through a public library, if worst comes to worst.

[mamakay]

Originally Posted by gardenmom

Not if HR 801 gets passed:
http://www.maplight.org/HR801_2009_Analysis

[Deborah]

Language! We are all ladies around here, you know...

Except when we are talking about the CDC and/or greedy journal publishers!

[JollyGG]

Originally Posted by Deborah

Oh crap! They are trying to keep research paid for by the taxpayer out of the hands of the public. Sweet.

I should be able to get hold of a copy through a public library, if worst comes to worst.

Actually I view the fact that it would keep research out of the hands of other researchers as even worse. No research facility, university, or individual researcher can afford to subscribe to every journal. Nor do they have the time to comb through every article ever written. Researcher rely on PubMed. If researchers can't get access to other researchers work easily and affordable research as a whole stalls.