Working at a daycare and hating it

[KCMommy]

I am a single Mom and I've done an in-home day home in the past. There's little daycare two blocks away which hired me, last week. The location is great, because I can't afford a car. The director also has accepted both my girls (16 mo and 4 yo) for just the government subsidy amount, without charging the difference. That is, I don't pay anything out of pocket for them - the government just kicks in $1100/mo subsidy plus $280 D.O. Grant to the daycare for them. Sooo.. sounded like a perfect situation.

BUT, I am very AP and she is not. Here are some of my issues:

She insists that all 12 kids at the daycare have to nap for 2 hours. That means, even non-napping 4 year olds have to lie on a cot in the dark for 2 hours without a toy or book.

The centre is very small and, IMO, there are too many children in the space without any kind of separation of play areas. This one is kindof minor, I guess, since the space does meet regulations, but it doesn't make a great atmosphere. Oh, and she has very loud music playing constantly.

Here is the worst one, though....A little 4 mo infant is left to cry for AGES and she won't let me pick him up, even if I am not busy. Every time I try, she says that I will just cause him to become more needy and difficult for her. Today, I tried 5 times to pick the little sweetheart up, and she wouldn't let me . I brought along a baby bjorn front carrier from home and asked if she would let me put him in it. Again - No. Then, the director told the Mom that her baby was sick because he had been crying for 4 hours. But he wasn't sick, he just needed to be taken out of the crib - because every time I picked him up, he would stop crying until she instructed me to put him back. How can I look the mother in the eye, knowing that I allowed her precious little guy to cry, unattended in a crib, for HOURS.

I have been working there for a week and a half, and there has been no outdoor play time at all and the only art activity was one that I planned at home, bought materials for, and brought myself.

She uses a lot of time outs for minor offenses, including one instance where the child hadn't done anything wrong (she assumed C had pushed P, but I had been watching and knew that P was actually crying over something else).

Last week she left me with two full groups worth of children all by myself for extended periods of time, every day, with no phone. This was like 4 infants under 18 mo, 3 young toddlers (18mo - 2 yrs), and 4 preschoolers. If there had been a fire, I can't imagine how I would have evacuated them all. And, if there had been a medical emergency, I would have had to have left everyone and ran to the next business to use their phone. The phone issue has been resolved since she had one put in this week, and she promises not to leave me with so many kids alone again after I brought the issue up with her today... but I just keep feeling like this is a sweat shop factory daycare situation and I don't really want to be a part of it.

I think I have to leave the place. I know I would never leave my own girls there if I wasn't present to make sure they were treated well. But I also think I'm having some impulse and commitment issues, lately. I mean, I keep starting things and then suddenly jumping ship and taking a whole new direction and I don't know if I trust myself anymore.

I am also broke as a joke. I probably should start my own day home again but I am dreading giving my 2 week notice. The director is very kind to me and my own girls (she is a member of my church), but I don't want to be a part of her daycare.

What do you think? This can't be normal for a daycare, can it?? And if I give my two week notice, what should I say? Should I be honest about my concerns or find an excuse? I will have to face her every Sunday.

[Justmee]

Wow what a difficult situation for you! No, that is NOT normal, especailly a poor baby crying in a crib for hours

In fact, it's probably against regulations, but how often they come and check out daycares in your state I have no clue. I would be tempted to call the certifying agency (since I assume she is "legal" if she takes the subsity for your kids).

I don't think I could stay in that situation, but I don't know how I would get out of it if I was broke. Plus I would worry about her badmouthing you if you try to start another at home daycare just 2 blocks from her house.

Sorry no practical advice except telling you that you are not nuts, she is. Those poor kiddos

[Kristine233]

I see far too many red flags to ignore. I'm assuming this is a daycare center and not a home daycare?

For one, she can't leave you alone with kids, period, unless you are an assistant teacher or a teacher. AND there needs to be more than just you with that many kids. There needs to be a teacher for EACH age group or they need to follow ratios for the YOUNGEST age group and have extra aides and asst to make ratio. Obviously that is not happening.

Like it or not, they have to follow the schedule they put in their policy handbook. If that says outside play, they play outside. (except for things like weather or staff ratio issues that would affect it) The only group that normally doesn't' is the infant group.

The extended crying would be against regulation, as someone else mentioned. I'd tell the parent if it were me.

To me, it sounds like a teacher on a power trip and then add insult to injury by her not caring about the state laws regarding childcare centers.

I can't tell you what to do as far as you working there, but I'd recommend calling state and telling them whats going on. They would make a visit to check things out for themselves, unannounced. Are there other staff who work there as well?

[PassionateWriter]

havent read any replies.....but if my kids were in that setting i would PRAY that you would tell me. and im not really teh praying type. i would be so heartbroken...a 4 month old crying for hours? omg...i have a 4 month old and that breaks my heart sooo sooo badlly.

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The two hour nap is normal. I make all my daycare kids nap for two hours too.

But, they all nap in the playroom with a movie on, so those that don't sleep aren't just lying there with nothing to do.

The rest of the stuff would bug me a little.

The four month old who cries would bug me a LOT. Especially since you could just put him in a wrap or sling and still have both hands free.

Also, the ratios when she leaves you there. I'm not sure what your state's laws say, but I am pretty sure you can't be left alone with all of those kids at one time. A few maybe.. but not 12.

Some people believe in time outs and use them often. I don't. But, I don't care if other's do. Just as long as it's not with my child.

My thoughts are, you need the money, these kids need you, so I PESRONALLY would wish you would stay and if nothing else, build a relationship with the parents and kids. That way if you ever do leave, maybe you can take a few of the kids with you.

I also hope you will try to "nut up" (as my husband calls it) and pick the baby up without letting her see you do it. Just swoop in, grab him and keep working. I know it's hard to do that though, so I understand if you feel like you can't. It is her daycare, and you are following her rules.

If you want an AP friendly daycare, you need to open your own. But, there are a lot of rules. Sometimes it's not ideal for AP. You actually HAVE to provide a nap for all kids who are not yet in Kindergarten. You could tweak it a little, but it works best for everybody if they all nap at the same time.

I understand if you just can't handle this. Ive worked in horrible daycare centers before, and when the working enviroment is bad, it makes your whole life miserable. I'm fortunate to love my job, so, I would want to quit that place too. But, if you can hang in there for just a little longer, it might benefit everybody in the long run.

[Girlprof]

To me, this sounds unbearable and the ratio sounds illegal. Can you talk to some of the parents and try to get them on your side? I guess it depends on whether you think there is any hope for the place. If not, I would get out. And hey, she has to face YOU every Sunday, knowing that she is providing inadequate care.

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One thing I don't understand....

Even if you believe in crying it out... why would you WANT to listen to a baby cry?

If you could make him stop crying by carrying him for a while, why would you RATHER listen to him cry?

I know she must have a reason for preferring he cry... and I am truly just curious. I'm not even being snarky... I just want to know what her reasoning is.

If her teacher's aide wants to hold him, why would she care?

[luv-my-boys]

Im sorry but RUN and run fast! First off that does not sound like a healthy and safe place for your children let alone the other children there. I am a licensed day care provider and those are HUGE violations that you have mentioned. Not only would I be scared something might happen (with no phone around) but also that I could be liable for anything that does happen. I know how its hard but honestly you seem really uncertain of this place and maybe that is your *gut* kicking in. Since you have had a daycare before would it be hard to recertify you? Is it possible to get it going so that you could give your 2 wks notice. You dont necessarily have to say "this place is horrible im not working here" if you dont want to or it makes you uncomfortable since they are church members with you. Maybe something like you really want to spend more time at home with your girls and financially/timing it would be better for you. On a side note once I left I would totally report that daycare to the licensing dept.

[lolar2]

I notice you wrote "centre" so I assume you are not in the US, but those things you describe would likely be against regulations in many countries. Please brush up on your local and federal regulations and, if this place is in violation, report it. (I assume you aren't in an unstable country with sketchy authorities since this subsidy thing sounds quite systematized.)

[madskye]

What if you try to take a partner-like tone with her, and just lay out the situation as you see?

Tell her that you're grateful for the opportunity that she's offered you, but troubled by a few things. You are thinking about leaving, you have issues with the CIO and lack of outside time. You suggest a few changes to the schedule, you suggest trying the use of a sling or non-CIO approach for the little baby. You are happy to help implement these things/new schedules as you'd like to work with her for a long time--but you can't be part of prolonged CIO's with infants.

I guess look at what is really an issue, and what is just not ideal and try to think as if you can make a difference. The worst she can say is no, right?

[Michelle Renee]

Wow.
That has to be hard.

Especially because you have found a way to make money and be with your kids without needing a car.


Could you possibly consider being an in-home nanny for someone where they would let you bring your children? If you found the right family who had 1 or 2 children and you could bring yours - you may be able to make some money, be with your kids and also help raise someone elses who actually would LOVE to have someone with AP ideals.

Please no flames - but you may be able to find someone who wants a nanny but cant afford one but would be totally ok with 2 kids coming with you.

[zersha]

Originally Posted by madskye

What if you try to take a partner-like tone with her, and just lay out the situation as you see?

Tell her that you're grateful for the opportunity that she's offered you, but troubled by a few things. You are thinking about leaving, you have issues with the CIO and lack of outside time. You suggest a few changes to the schedule, you suggest trying the use of a sling or non-CIO approach for the little baby. You are happy to help implement these things/new schedules as you'd like to work with her for a long time--but you can't be part of prolonged CIO's with infants.

I guess look at what is really an issue, and what is just not ideal and try to think as if you can make a difference. The worst she can say is no, right?

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I totally agree with this. You wouldn't have to make up some excuse to leave and wouldn't appear flaky, and you have the possibility of making things better for those children. Maybe she'll see that there is no harm in trying a few new things - especially if she can keep a good employee. If she says NO, then you tried your best, were honest with her, and I would hope that she would be adult about your differences and be civil to you at church.

As for the poor children and parents - I would hope to God that you would say something to them if she doesn't agree to some changtes. I assume that mother doesn't know that her baby is left to cry when there is someone willing to hold him - that's just awful. I totally get that daycares get busy and sometimes someone can't hold everyone, but to deny that holding to a young infant on some idiotic theory that they will be 'spoiled' is horrible.

I also wonder about her professionalism about the phone. I can't imagine a situation in which a center would be without a phone. I used to be a home provider, and our phone lines got water in them and went out once, so I was without a phone for a day while we figured out what was going on. I got a cell phone that night as backup (this was several years ago when cell phones weren't that common). She should never have left you with no phone with that many children. In this day and age she could have at least left a cell phone. But actually she shouldn't have left you at all.

To be honest...it's scary that she's allowed to care for children. Maybe I've changed my mind a bit since I first started posting. I sure wouldn't want my kids there but maybe you are in a position to make things better.

[KCMommy]

Thanks for the replies. I will quit and start my own licensed dayhome. However, I don't confront well and think I will tell her that I will continue til the end of the month, if she can't find anyone sooner to replace me. I'm probably also going to just make an excuse for why I am quitting.

The things I described are mostly against regulations. I don't know if CIO is against regs, but I am sure that what they are doing with that 4 mo goes way beyond CIO, anyway. Even my most mainstream sister felt that it was gross negligance to leave a very young infant unattended for hours.

I am relieved now to know that I won't have to be a part of it anymore, but now I don't know whether to tell the mother of the infant..... If it were my own, as one PP said, I would pray that someone would tell me. But I have, all my life, worked jobs where workplace confidentially and loyalty were serious virtues. However, in all the other jobs, we were only hurting ourselves by bending the rules. For example - as a radiographer, we concealed our film badges so the regulatory agency wouldn't shut us down for receiving too much radiation. Or, we'd go into very unsafe oilfield environments and NEVER, EVER complain or report the employer. But we were only hurting and risking ourselves... I think I have to shake that employee loyalty in this case, because it's a tiny infant at risk, here.

I don't know the mother's parenting style, but she is a young single mother going to college. She takes great care in packing two diaper bags for him every day, with little sleepers folded up all neatly and she tells me cute little annecdotes about him when she drops him off. She breastfeeds at home and sends a little pumped milk but has trouble pumping enough. I would speculate that she is not a CIO type and highly unlikely that she would be a "drop him into a crib for four hours in the middle of the day" type. She is a subsidy parent and needs a licensed place (like this one is, amazingly!), and it is extremely difficult to find a spot in this town for an infant, especially that young. She only needs care for 4 hours a day while she is in school and I am half tempted to say I will do it for free for her until I can get licensed myself, in a month or so..... Her baby is just such a sweet little guy with big blue eyes. His furious cries are still so high and newborn-sounding.... It breaks my heart.

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Originally Posted by KCMommy

highly unlikely that she would be a "drop him into a crib for four hours in the middle of the day" type. She is a subsidy parent and needs a licensed place (like this one is, amazingly!), and it is extremely difficult to find a spot in this town for an infant, especially that young. She only needs care for 4 hours a day while she is in school and I am half tempted to say I will do it for free for her until I can get licensed myself, in a month or so..... Her baby is just such a sweet little guy with big blue eyes. His furious cries are still so high and newborn-sounding.... It breaks my heart.

Seriously? Hours? I thought, maybe 30 minutes, but hours?

That to me is abuse.. I NEVER say abuse. I don't even have a huge problem with crying it out if that's what the parents choose. But, NOBODY would ever think more than 20-thirty minutes is acceptable.

Especially at such a young age. He still needs to he carried for hours at a time. Even a baby container while he's NOT crying for hours at a time would border on abuse.

Not only that.. but she's accepting money for NOT doing the job. That alone is innapropriate.

It's so hard to tell the mom.. but, if you can find a way to do it, I wish you would. If you aren't ready to say it while you are at work, maybe you could invite her over to your house for dinner. You are both single moms, you might have a lot in common. Or you could offer to watch him for a few hours one evening so she can go out. Then you could talk to her. SHe may still leave him with the other provider, and she may even be offended, but at least you did your part.

I made a complaint about a center I worked in. They figured out it was me, and I was fired on the spot. So, be sure that if you make a complaint, that you can afford to lose this job. You still have to look out for yourself, and your kids.

[lolar2]

If there is ANY way you can report this information to the licensing board and to the mother, please do. Even if you have to wait to do it, please do it at some point.

[limabean]

Originally Posted by KCMommy

I am relieved now to know that I won't have to be a part of it anymore, but now I don't know whether to tell the mother of the infant..... If it were my own, as one PP said, I would pray that someone would tell me. But I have, all my life, worked jobs where workplace confidentially and loyalty were serious virtues. However, in all the other jobs, we were only hurting ourselves by bending the rules. For example - as a radiographer, we concealed our film badges so the regulatory agency wouldn't shut us down for receiving too much radiation. Or, we'd go into very unsafe oilfield environments and NEVER, EVER complain or report the employer. But we were only hurting and risking ourselves... I think I have to shake that employee loyalty in this case, because it's a tiny infant at risk, here.

What do you mean "employee loyalty"? That mother has every right to know every detail about how her baby is being treated while in daycare -- how could there possibly be some confidentiality clause that would prevent a parent from having the right to know information about their child???

If you're uncomfortable telling your boss the real reason for leaving, that's fine, but please don't withhold this information from the poor baby's mother. That would be wrong -- please don't do it.

[~pi]

:

I would absolutely tell the mom. If you can't figure out how to do it in person, perhaps you could slip a note in her baby's diaper bag?

OP. It could be awkward for you, but IMHO, you would be doing the right thing by the children in addressing these issues and reporting the reg violations.

[samy23]

Originally Posted by Michelle Renee

Wow.
That has to be hard.

Yes it was.

Exactly why I would never leave a child of my own in a daycare, absolutely not, you just never know what is going on when you aren't there.

OP I think you have a duty to report this daycare with a list of all the issues, to whoever it is you're supposed to report them to. Please don't just walk away and do nothing to help those children, or tell yourself "it isn't THAT bad" because it is.

[Momily]

Originally Posted by samy23

Exactly why I would never leave a child of my own in a daycare, absolutely not, you just never know what is going on when you aren't there.

Actually there are lots of ways that parents can check out daycare programs and make sure their children are getting quality care.

OP, I can completely understand that you're in a difficult position, however I agree that you have a responsibility to report what's going on to liscensing. At least here what you see includes many violations.

[diaperqueen]

You mentioned confidentiality--I don't think it applies in this case. You would be telling the baby's mother--not just spreading it around town.