I am just at a loss.

[BedHead]

19 yo ds is living in the basement and does nothing but play WoW. He has done NOTHING for the past year. He had to start paying rent in Feb and still isn't working. He's also started smoking (takes the butts of cigars that dh and I sometimes smoke and uses them in a pipe) and does chores for me when he wants smoke money (now that I've caught on to that one it's stopping), but other than that he never moves his butt. His WoW subscription runs out in 14 days and I just know he's going to try and finagle a deal with me or dh to get $$ for it again.

Please, I need strength to deal with him. To say NO, to put up with his anger when I bug him to get his a$$ out of bed, to get him out the door and GET A JOB. The doc prescribed antidepressants but he isn't taking them - he actually doesn't seem unhappy (why would he be - he's doing what every one of us can only dream about - coasting through life with someone else paying for everything).

I also think he lies about going out to put applications in just to keep me off his back but I have no proof. He sleeps all day and is up all night. He says he wants me to bug him, and I do. I call him when I get up, then 4 or 5 more times before I leave for work. I turn the light on in his face (he freaks). Same thing when I'm home for lunch. I offer to drive him places after work to put resumes in. I buy him bis tickets so he can go and job hunt. I've always thought that providing kids with the opportunity and resources would be enough - well, not for him apparently.

How can I make him need to get out the door and get a job?

[Ceinwen]

This may be extremely unpopular - but this was me at 19, simply replace WoW with drinking/partying... and my parents kicked me out. As in, literally packed my stuff in bags and boxes and put it in the front yard. Now, it was summer and I knew it was coming.

Talk about a wake up call. I slept on a friend's couch for a bit, got my act together, went back to school, etc.

Now I'm an RN, have two children, own my own home, etc. It was the best thing my parents could have done. My mother is my best friend in the whole world and we literally die laughing sometimes about what a wretch I was at that age... and that wasn't even ten years ago.

ETA - I too had no emotional/mental health issues. I was just lazy and enjoying the free ride... I could have lived at home indefinitely if I was working/going to school/volunteering/something...

[nextcommercial]

Except for the WoW addiction, and the fact that I don't have a basement.. I can totally see this happening to my daughter.

I have no wisdom. (obviously) But, I will watch this thread for ideas/advice.

On a side note, I have quite a few friends going through a divorce right now because of WoW. I'm amazed that a computer game can destroy lives. How does that happen?

[jeliphish]

You can gain the strength by realizing you are enabling him. You have spent your whole life raising this young man to be the best man he can be and by allowing this behavior, you are undoing every ounce of mental and physical work you have put into raising him. YOU HAVE TO TELL YOURSELF THIS!
Take a step outside this situation and ask yourself what advice you would give a poster in this situation. He is going to keep freeloading as long as you let him. Be stern mom.....be stern because you love him. Make rules, give deadlines...etc. Sometime motivation is hard to come by at 19 lol, but you have to enforce the behavior that you wish him to have as a young man, a husband, a father. You think it's difficult to deal with his anger and grumpyness now...just think how it's going to be 5 years from now when the girl he meets on WoW moves in with him in your basement. Your firm boundaries in this situation will make him realize one day just how much you love him.

[choli]

Don't pay for his WoW subscription. Remove internet access. Get rid of cable. Stop providing free food. Stop driving him around. Stop making it attractive to laze around at home.

[nextcommercial]

Originally Posted by choli

Don't pay for his WoW subscription. Remove internet access. Get rid of cable. Stop providing free food. Stop driving him around. Stop making it attractive to laze around at home.

I'm thinking, if the only reason she wouldn't get a job and move out was my internet access, I'd cancel the internet AND the cable. I'd rather live without it than have my child become a freeloader.

[Ceinwen]

Originally Posted by nextcommercial

On a side note, I have quite a few friends going through a divorce right now because of WoW. I'm amazed that a computer game can destroy lives. How does that happen?

I'm intrigued by WoW and the other RPG - but I have an extremely addictive personallity and have been warned by many people (including some friends who play) to avoid it, for that very reason.

Still.resisting...

Seriously though, my parents did all that - cut cable, stopped driving me around, stopped giving me money. It made it much easier to make me move out - I wasn't happy at home anymore anyway!

[~PurityLake~]

Originally Posted by nextcommercial

On a side note, I have quite a few friends going through a divorce right now because of WoW. I'm amazed that a computer game can destroy lives. How does that happen?

Yeah, my husband has a WoW addiction and has for 3 years when his boss introduced him to the game. It is a serious problem in our marriage. :

[purslaine]

He doesn't sound that bad:

Seriously - he is not addicted to drugs, hanging out with criminals or being abusive. He is simply coasting a bit. He is 19, not 35. Coasting is OK.


I think early adulthood can be difficult for some people. There is a lot of pressure to get a job, go to school, do something - and it can be hard on people who do not know what they want (or - they do know what they want (WOW), but it is not acceptable to those who love them). My youngest sister struggled with coasting during early adulthood - she did come out of it - but not until she was about 23.

I would probably pay for the next batch of WOW. After that I would ask him to come up with half the cost, and then, perhaps, the whole thing. I think it is often easier (and perhaps healthier) for children and young adults to be slowly weaned of financial "help". I say this as someone who's mommy did pay for her Cable TV at 19 - and yet I have been completely financially independant for many years now.

[meowee]

I was/ am a WoW addict. I have been "clean" for about a month now and was semi-clean for the year before that, and deeply addicted for two years before that. It didn't destroy my life but I can see how it could have... anyway I guarantee that if you can get WoW (and all other VG/ MMOs) out of his life he will wake up.

[amynbebes]

You just described my ex dh to the tee, down to fake applications, only he's 32. Heck, he went as far as to have his mom drive him to a fake job for weeks until she came home early one day and found him there. Unfortunately I think a situation like this is going to require tough love. Please don't allow him to continue to use you and the situation. I see how much it hurts my ex mil and here she's stuck with him home again and treated so poorly by him. I think it's ultimatum time for your ds and if he doesn't meet the requirements within a certain time limit then you need to move him out.

[spero]

Originally Posted by choli

Stop making it attractive to laze around at home.

THAT.

Originally Posted by kathymuggle

Coasting is OK.

I wholeheartedly disagree with the above.

Coasting with a NEAR future plan might be OK - like, kid graduates from HS, takes a break for a month, then gets a job/goes to college, whatever.

Just plain open-ended freeloading, though? Unh-uh.

[karina5]

I don't think coasting for that long is a good idea AT ALL.

He's at an age where it would be best to help cut bad habits before they get even more ingrained. The more "normal" the sleeping all night, playing too much WoW (dang that game seems to be ruining families....it's really weird), and bumming smoke $ is, the more likely that he will want (and expect) things to be this way.

Sorry, but I highly doubt he will change on his own, and if there is a time to be firm it is now.

I'm a pretty laid-back parent who is leaning towards unschooling, but sometimes I do believe a kid can thrive best with a parent-imposed boundary.

[Ceinwen]

Originally Posted by spero

I wholeheartedly disagree with the above.

Coasting with a NEAR future plan might be OK - like, kid graduates from HS, takes a break for a month, then gets a job/goes to college, whatever.

Just plain open-ended freeloading, though? Unh-uh.

Agreed - at sixteen, maybe. To me - nineteen is an adult.

[tug]

I would just say this, before you start trying "tough love," consider reading "live through this" by debra gwartney. it's about a mother who becomes estranged from her daughters and they become more and more wild. she tries the tough love approach because people expect her to and it backfires in a really big way. it's a true story and she does a lot of thinking about why she reacted to things the way she did and how she might have reacted more helpfully to what her daughters were feeling. i'm not saying that cutting everything off would make your son wild or anything, i just think that people imagine tough love to be a panacea, where in some situations, with some kids, it can make things worse than a little forgiveness and love might.

and if you don't feel like reading the book, there is also a "this american life" episode that features this family. i think it's called "i didn't ask to be born." i found it heartbreakening but also enlightening. and it has a happy ending (as does the book)

[karina5]

Originally Posted by tug

I would just say this, before you start trying "tough love," consider reading "live through this" by debra gwartney. it's about a mother who becomes estranged from her daughters and they become more and more wild. she tries the tough love approach because people expect her to and it backfires in a really big way. it's a true story and she does a lot of thinking about why she reacted to things the way she did and how she might have reacted more helpfully to what her daughters were feeling. i'm not saying that cutting everything off would make your son wild or anything, i just think that people imagine tough love to be a panacea, where in some situations, with some kids, it can make things worse than a little forgiveness and love might.

and if you don't feel like reading the book, there is also a "this american life" episode that features this family. i think it's called "i didn't ask to be born." i found it heartbreakening but also enlightening. and it has a happy ending (as does the book)

I also know people that feel that they would have thrived more under "tough love" so keep the balance in mind.

BTW though...I hardly think that cutting off WoW is even in the category of "tough love." That seems more like just "love" to me, and I really don't see how it is on the "tough" side to make an adult pay for their own addiction.

[choli]

Originally Posted by karina5

I also know people that feel that they would have thrived more under "tough love" so keep the balance in mind.

BTW though...I hardly think that cutting off WoW is even in the category of "tough love." That seems more like just "love" to me, and I really don't see how it is on the "tough" side to make an adult pay for their own addiction.

Dead right!

[tug]

Originally Posted by karina5

BTW though...I hardly think that cutting off WoW is even in the category of "tough love." That seems more like just "love" to me, and I really don't see how it is on the "tough" side to make an adult pay for their own addiction.

i agree. i was referring to the references to throwing him out of the house not to cutting off WoW or the internet or cable.

[karina5]

Originally Posted by tug

i agree. i was referring to the references to throwing him out of the house not to cutting off WoW or the internet or cable.

Oh, whew! Yeah, I don't think that would be right to do immediately. I'm not a big "tough love" person although I do feel that it can work in some cases. But not typically as the very first thing to try.

[purslaine]

Originally Posted by Ceinwen

Agreed - at sixteen, maybe. To me - nineteen is an adult.

They are not even allowed to drink in the USA until they are 21.

So I guess the law does not see them as complete adults.

Kathy