My concern with measles

[stacey05]

I have been reading about measles lately and how to treat it. I am so surprised at how many sources say that measles is a killer. I guess I thought it was a normal childhood illness that most children used to get and used to get through just fine...like portrayed on the Brady Bunch. These sources act like it is a death sentence.

I have not vaccinated my 2 younger boys with the mmr. One is 7 and the other is 19 months. I am usually pretty sure about my decision re vaccinations. (I have moments where I panic, and then I research and am reassured again)

But, with my research on measles and even with using cod liver oil and vit c to treat it, I still have a big concern that is making me think about giving the mmr to my 7 yo. That is croup. My 7yo has always suffered with croup when he has a virus. He wakes up with that horrible barking cough. If I give him cold/allergy medicine before bed and have him sleep in a chair (upright), he will usually do better. Anyway, I thought he was growing out of croup, but a few weeks ago we had a nasty virus around here. 4 out of 5 kids had it...my youngest who is still bf and not vaccinated at all, had a VERY mild case!! Well, this was a flu-like virus (not the flu...we tested) and produced very high fevers, runny nose, cough, etc. Well, in the middle of the night, my 7 yo woke up NOT being able to breathe. It was like the croup he had had before, but WAY worse. He was scared to death and literally gasping for air. We took him to the ER and they gave him breathing treatments and oral steroids. He has never done that before. Normally, when he isn't sick, he doesn't have asthma, allergies or anything. So, now I am worried that if he gets the measles, this could happen to him again and could be worse. I read that the 3 main causes of death in measles is pneumonia, encephalitis and croup. ( So, I am considering this vaccine even though this is one of the vaccines that I worry about. Does anyone know if side effects of this vaccine are less if the child is older...7 vs. 15 months?? I would NEVER give this to my 19 month old because he is so young and because so far he doesn't show any breathing problems when ill...but, then again, he really hasn't been very ill before.

Please help me decide this. I really am torn...it was the scariest thing to see my son wake up and not be able to breathe right. He told us later that he was scared he was going to die. Broke my heart.

Thanks,
Stacey

[emma1325]

The side effects of the MMR can possibly put your son in the same situation or worse. With measles being so rare, I personally wouldn't take the risks of the vaccine.




http://measles.emedtv.com/mmr-vaccin...ffects-p2.html


Serious Side Effects of MMR

Symptoms that may indicate an allergic reaction or other serious side effect include:

Trouble breathing
Hoarseness
Wheezing Hives
Pale skin
Weakness
Fast heartbeat
Dizziness
High fever
Behavioral changes.

[Ophelia]

(((HUGS))) that sounds scary, so glad he is OK now. Sorry I don't really have any advice for you except I would continue to check to see why he has the breathing problems from viruses. I think if you can get to the root of the problem and correct/control it it won't be so much of a worrisome issue.

[tanyalynn]

That sounds really scary. My son was 7mos old when he got croup the first time (and it was my first time dealing with it because my daughter's just not prone to it--I'm thinking there's a slight structural difference between them so that croup-y illnesses give him the barking cough but not her).

For me, esp for my son (who gets sick a lot) it comes down to figuring out what _my_ kids need, support-wise, to get through illnesses. I'm grateful that our bout with croup (we were away, it was Thanksgiving!) was quite mild, and I think it's because I was already treating the cold (he started showing cold symptoms around 5pm that day, then did the midnight barking cough thing). That first night I had to sit with him propped up on me, but all the nights after were better. So for me, figuring out what the kids need (for us it's usually nutritional support) has gotten us through many, many colds and various illnesses.

And re: vitA and measles, we use cod liver oil as general nutritional support, but if I suspected measles, I think I'd go get a high-dosage vitamin A supp, something like Carlson's vitA capsules. They're from fish oil, not synthetic, but I think my son may need the higher dosage that you can get from them.

[prettypixels]

Measles is becoming less and less rare; there were just outbreaks in NY and San Diego. How do you feel about SSPE (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subacut...encephalitis)? That is my bigger concern with measles than the disease itself, honestly. I'm so sorry about your sons rough time with croup! Is it possible for you to have stuff to give him breathing treatments on hand, much like you would if your child were asthmatic?

[anewmama]

Also, a case or 2 in San Francisco. I know that's not much though

[Gitti]

The truth is that before the vaccine came on the market, the CDC said (paraphrasing) we will never need a vaccine for measles because it is a very mild childhood disease.

As soon as they brought the measles vaccine on the market, they called it a killer disease.

I had measles and so did EVERYONE I know. I am of the generation where all kids or at least 90% had measles and many other childhood diseases. My dh was sent over to the neighbor's house because they had the measles and he had not gotten them yet. His mom wanted him to get it over with. No one was afraid of measles. No one!

In 1950 doctors who wrote home health care books for moms wrote very similar things about measles as Dr. John Gibbens wrote:

“It is much better to have the disease and get it over when you are young than begin school and have to go into quarantine”

“Fit Children are rarely ill with measles. They get over it quickly, their general health is little upset, they jiggle about happily in bed and play with their toys and seem quite unconcerned.

Like I said everyone I know in my generation had measles and I know of not one person who ever died of complications. I don't even know one child who had complications. They closed the school for 2 weeks because basically we all got the measles at the same time and after 2 weeks we all came back healthy (and smarter).

If your children are not vaccinated and there is no one that messed with their immune system, I would have no qualms about measles. I am actually hoping that my three grandchildren do get the measles. Of course there is no way to know whether they already have immunity to it, since immunity is such a personal thing.

Anita Petek Dimmer just said that when there was a measles outbreak last year in Switzerland, her son got the measles. He is 15 yrs old. And he had no problem with it. He now has life long immunity.

Did you know that measles is the one childhood disease that is credited with preventing cancer? It is also the one that cures asthma and skin ailments. It's a deep fever that teaches the body to protect itself against many other ailments.

"Chronic tendencies, such as ... psoriasis or chronic kidney problems. Children susceptible to infections are healthier and stronger after contracting measles; the need for medical treatment clearly decreases. Children in the Third World countries are less likely to contract malaria and parasites after measles . .. Hay fever is more rare in children who have older siblings and had measles than in those who were vaccinated against measles . A large African study showed that children who have had measles are 50% less at risk from allergies than those vaccinated. Furthermore it is shown that experiencing measles protects from diseases of the immune system, skin diseases ..."
Anita Petek-Dimmer

Does anyone know if side effects of this vaccine are less if the child is older...7 vs. 15 months??

I don't see how. And there are no studies to show otherwise. Doctors may tell you they are less vulnerable, but where is the proof?

Stacy ultimately you have to decide. If it were me, there is just no way to give this or any vaccine. Why would I mess with an intact immune system. After the vaccine he may never get the chance to outgrow his weakness for the croup. I had the croup a lot when I was a kid and never got it again after about 10 yrs old.

Please help me decide this. I really am torn...it was the scariest thing to see my son wake up and not be able to breathe right.

That is when you go and get help. You go to a doctor when you see that you can't deal with it. But why do something so drastic as vaccinating with a toxin that may forever mess him up, when he may never come in contact with measles? I would not.

[Marnica]

I agree with Gitti.

I don't think vaccinating with the MMR will do anything to help. IMO it will just tax his immune system

[taterbug1999]

Measles is becoming less and less rare; there were just outbreaks in NY and San Diego. How do you feel about SSPE (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subacut...encephalitis)? That is my bigger concern with measles than the disease itself, honestly. I'm so sorry about your sons rough time with croup! Is it possible for you to have stuff to give him breathing treatments on hand, much like you would if your child were asthmatic?

Frequency of measles is of no concern to us, except that I wish we could get it before my ds gets grown...as for encephalitis my dd had the encephalitic cry for a month, weight loss, etc., etc. after her first round of shots so the vaxes are not without their risks too.

A good study was done giving high dose Vit A to children who had measles in third world countries. I can pull the link if you need it, but we are talking HIGH DOSES (I think 400,000 IU per day for the first several days) given early after onset of symptoms. It reduced secondary infections and mortality drastically. And that is in places where nutrition is very poor. Measles itself is not the problem it is the secondary infections brought on by the extreme depletion of Vit A. Viruses lile to consume Vit A and people with low Vit A stores tend to recover less quickly and have more severe symtoms from said viruses.

Ah, here it is:
http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/abstract/323/3/160 It is a very good study. The 189 studied were already hospitalized in South Africa with complications from measles i.e. pneumonia, diarrhea, or croup

All this to say, if you ds gets the measles start supplementing with large amounts of Vit A. And that is IF you even see measles...Pps are right that it is rare. The Vit A should help him fight off the secondary infections that are the culprits of any real trouble with the measles. Even a child who appears to eat healthy diet can be low on Vit A.

[stacey05]

Thank you for all your responses! I have researched this some more, read your thoughtful responses and talked to my mother in law about measles. She said just what Gitti said...everyone got them and she doesn't remember anyone dying from them or having a bad reaction or being afraid of them. I know that some children did die/do die in other parts of the country from measles, but I think the death rate was going down BEFORE vaccines!! Also, if treated with vitamin a, there are many studies showing that complications/death are reduced. I have been feeling more comfortable NOT vaccinating with MMR. I am just not comfortable with MMR, even though my first 3 kids were vaccinated with it and seemed to do fine. I didn't know ANYTHING then about vaccines and I don't even remember if they got sick a week to 2 weeks later (possible mmr reaction). If they did, I wouldn't have thought it was the vaccine. I am going to talk to our dr. about his croup attack...we live in Colorado (just moved from Tx) and many friends here have said that kids that have croup have more flare ups here because of the altitude...thin air, etc. So, I am going to ask to have some breathing treatments here at home, in case he gets any virus again that can produce that reaction in him. It was most unpleasant for him and for us and I would hate to repeat it. Thanks again for your help! This board helps keeps me sane, and that is a big job...just ask my "NO WORRIES" husband!