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UGH!! MIL rant! Update post #79 - Page 2

post #21 of 87
Thread Starter 
When dh got home this morning we argued about it again. He has no reason for wanting except that he is a man with a penis and thats what he wants. He feels I have gone behind his back and made the decision with out him. I have tried to tell him its not medically needed, not one medical community recomends, he doesnt care, he wants it done, and I think its pretty much because of looks. I tired of arguing about the whole thing so I just said fine, you and your mom win, and walked away. I dont know what to do. I have tried imagining what it would be like to change his diaper every day and look at it and it just tears me up!!! I hate what this is doing to our married and relationship. I will not leave my dh for this like some have suggested they would do, I love him but Im dont know what to do!
post #22 of 87
I'm sorry.

Don't you think the reason to do such a thing on an innocent person is kind of shallow?

He will come around. Protect your baby. He will thank you for it later.

I didn't fight hard enough and my husband won that battle. Now that we both know better we both terribly regret what happened and are very VERY ANGRY at the American Medical Community for doing what they did to our precious newborn. We won't ever give birth in a hospital again.

The difference between you and I is, YOU KNOW BETTER! If you give in and allow something so terrible to happen to your intact son YOU WILL HATE YOURSELF! Trust me, your guilt will be worse than mine! Guilt is poison. It will ruin your life. You will carry this to your grave.

Hang in there. This will soon be a non-issue between the two of you. If it does happen, you can never get it back and he will be robbed of that choice over his own sex organ. Once its gone its gone forever. You CAN give him that choice over his own body. I'm not saying you or your dh should ever present to him that choice but rather if he decides on his own he wants to undergo this surgery AFTER experiencing what its like to have an intact penis as an adult then he will have the greatest pain medication available, he will feel empowered over HIS CHOICE, and his surgeon will have a grown organ to work with which is MUCH BETTER than something that hasn't grown into his potential yet.
post #23 of 87
Don't let him win because you will resent him for it for the rest of your life. Talk about harming a marriage.

Instead, tell him that since you are at a crossroads you both need to go to a counselor. Get some recommendations from friends (and from this board) and go talk about it.

As you said, you love him and it isn't worth ruining your marriage over but what type of marriage will you have if you feel like you didn't protect your son from harm and grow to blame your husband for it?

This is tough, but as parents and partners you'll have to work it out.
post #24 of 87
Quote:
I have tried to tell him its not medically needed, not one medical community recomends, he doesnt care, he wants it done, and I think its pretty much because of looks.
Would he be pushing for this if he didn't like the look of his daughter's sex organ? Probably not. Would he be pushing for cosmetic surgery if he didn't like the look of his son's perfectly healthy nose/eyes/ears? Doubtful. Keep reminding yourself and him that this is only cosmetic surgery. You both love your son dearly and only want what's best for him so surgically altering him to make him meet some random ideal of beauty is beneath either of you. Send your son the lasting message that you love and accept him as he is, and that surgery is for helping sick people not for giving in to peer pressure about beauty. You can do this, Mama! Stay strong for your son - he will thank you for it.
post #25 of 87
Um this is your baby! Over my dead body would somebody do something to MY baby I didn't want done!

Tell your DH to hold off on getting anything done until you both reach a compromise. Afterall, it CAN be done later, but it can't be taken back. kwim?

GL to you! My lil guy is intact and I'm so so happy we left it that way!!!!! :
post #26 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by heamae View Post
When dh got home this morning we argued about it again. He has no reason for wanting except that he is a man with a penis and thats what he wants. He feels I have gone behind his back and made the decision with out him. I have tried to tell him its not medically needed, not one medical community recomends, he doesnt care, he wants it done, and I think its pretty much because of looks. I tired of arguing about the whole thing so I just said fine, you and your mom win, and walked away. I dont know what to do. I have tried imagining what it would be like to change his diaper every day and look at it and it just tears me up!!! I hate what this is doing to our married and relationship. I will not leave my dh for this like some have suggested they would do, I love him but Im dont know what to do!
can you honestly live with yourself if you allow this to happen?

This is your ds's life it is not yours or your dh's Dont give up mama just say NO. The one who has the most to loose here is your ds.

Your dh will learn to live with it but what if your ds is one of the ones that has major complications later on. What are you going to tell him when he asks you why? Your answer will be that you just gave up on fighting for him.

How do you think he will feel about that?
post #27 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by heamae View Post
When dh got home this morning we argued about it again. He has no reason for wanting except that he is a man with a penis and thats what he wants. He feels I have gone behind his back and made the decision with out him. I have tried to tell him its not medically needed, not one medical community recomends, he doesnt care, he wants it done, and I think its pretty much because of looks. I tired of arguing about the whole thing so I just said fine, you and your mom win, and walked away. I dont know what to do. I have tried imagining what it would be like to change his diaper every day and look at it and it just tears me up!!! I hate what this is doing to our married and relationship. I will not leave my dh for this like some have suggested they would do, I love him but Im dont know what to do!
I know this is tough, but forget about your husband and your MIL for a second and think about your son. I am a young guy who was circumcised, and wished I wasn't. This is not about the pressure you feel, this not about your feelings, or your husbands feelings, this is about your son. What if your son also feels violated like so many men in america? What will you tell him then? As a parent your number one job is to protect this baby, and this is your first test.
Remind yourself that in the end this is NOT not a choice between you or your husband. This is about allowing your son to make this choice for himself. Tell your husband that your not trying to "go behind his back" with this decision. You are saying this is your son decision, not "ours" its his body, let him decide.
post #28 of 87
You are not alone. Many mom's here have faced this very issue. Some decided to not allow it no matter what. Some allowed their dh to "win" their stories of guilt and regret can be found in the "If you regret having your DS circed" thread there are several hundred stories there. Have you read it?

If not take the time and read it now. http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=112410
post #29 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by heamae View Post
When dh got home this morning we argued about it again. He has no reason for wanting except that he is a man with a penis and thats what he wants.

My husband didn't think too much about it, just assumed it was something that was done. Since I felt so strongly about our son not being mutilated, he was willing to go along with my feelings. I didn't think that was enough and made sure he had plenty of access to information about circumcision, parental attachment, etc. And *on his own*, he realized that he never wanted to inflict something like this on his child. I wanted him to realize how barbaric and horrible it is and to not just "go along", but to wholeheartedly agree with our decision to leave our son as nature intended.

My husband is a creature of logic, often to a fault, but it worked out in my son's favor.

Anyhow, if he'd been ruled by emotion, instead, I'd have just told him that the mere presence of his penis didn't necessarily qualify him to make this decision. After all, he has no prepuce. As an intact female, I DO have a prepuce. It's functional and I shudder at the thought of *not* having it. Therefore, I know what an intact prepuce can be and my experience holds more weight and there would be no amputation of a tiny newborn's genitalia.

I suppose it helps that I'm the crazy passionate one in our relationship. He's not emotionless, he's just not ruled by his heart quite as much. He prefers that I not be a harridan and I try not to steamroll him too often. I would *never* let him strip my child of his genital integrity, however. Fortunately, it became a non-issue.

There used to be information in this forum that was VERY useful and informative and that information made a HUGE difference in his feelings regarding circumcision. Sadly, I think those threads are now gone. I haven't been able to find them in awhile.
post #30 of 87
If you feel very strongly about this (and you should), please don't give in. It may be tough now, but it will be worth it for your son in the long run. And like others have said, the guilt will be unbearable.

My best friend had my God-son when she was very young. She didn't want to cut him, but her son's father felt very strongly that they should, and she did give in. After the circ, she cried uncontrollably every time she changed his diaper, and really, really resented her boyfriend for insisting on the circ which caused a lot of issues in their relationship.
When his penis started to heal, it was obvious that there was a problem. Gavin is 8 years old now and has had 11 surgeries to try to correct his botched circumcision (I haven't seen his penis since he was still in diapers, but at that point after 4-5 surgeries, it was still pretty heartbreaking), and my friend still has horrible guilt over allowing it to happen; so much so that when DH and I were arguing about whether or not to circ, she threatened to end our 23 year friendship if I gave in.

This is not to say that something like this would definitely happen to your son, but if it did, could you live with your decision? Just something to think about.
post #31 of 87
OMG your poor nephew : That much pain and the effect on his future sex life is so not worth a cosmetic proceedure.

BTW OP the numbers say that 10% of circs will result in complications either at the time of the circ or later in life. The number is higher than that considering they dont count some of the most common complications.
post #32 of 87
he has a penis but NOT a foreskin.
Watch this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gbo3a9ubaz4


PLEASE, please protect your son. YOU are his mother and you are the one carrying him for 9 months in the womb. Ask him to tell you at least 3 valid reasons to get him circ'ed. If he seriously wants it done, I really hope he stands next to him while getting him mutilated, holding his hand, comforting him from the excruciating pain Please, make sure he knows that most babies don't receive general anesthesia, some defecates and go into shock even with some topical anesthetic, some don't return to nurse or can't be held too close because of the wound. There has been studies that show that these babies don't look at the mother's face for some time. Please protect your son from genital mutilation, PLEASE... :
post #33 of 87
Ask your DH why your son should be deprived of the body he was born with, and the choice to change it as HE sees fit WHEN he becomes an adult. There is absolutely NO rational reason to perform cosmetic surgery on a newborn.

Hang in there and do not give in. As others have pointed out, the regret and guilt you will feel will be with you for the rest of your life, as will be the feeling of resentment toward your DH.
post #34 of 87
If she ever watches him make sure she knows not to manipulate his foreskin for any reason!
post #35 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Munki'sMom View Post
Um this is your baby!
It takes two to tango, and this is his son too. If I were you, I would continue to show him intact information and not go down without a "fight", but in a loving way.

If I were in your situation, I would bring up the thought that you are taking your son from a peaceful homebirth to the doctor's office to expose him to risks such as bleeding, infection, and difficulty breastfeeding.
post #36 of 87
Thread Starter 
We talked about it again, more calmly, last night. He told me a lot of why he wants it done, which is mostly bc he is cut and he doesn't know what to say when his son asks him why they dont look the same. He would have to admit that something was wrong with either his or his sons penis. I keep telling him to let his son make the decision to have it cut. DH had to have the doc look at his penis once bc he thought he had an STD and he said he was soo embarrassed, he thinks that his son will be too embarrassed to see a doc and have it cut later in life, if he wants it done. In his mind our son is going to want it done. He cant imagine him growing up and being happy uncut. I kept asking him how he could look at his son right after he is born and not think everything about him is perfect. We finally ended on what I feel is a pretty good note, he wants to talk to the doc that would perform the surgery. I know that there are no medical communities that support so I am hoping that is what the doc will tell him. I talked to our ped about it, and he was neutral. Would not say if one way was better. He said that the only benefits are lowered UTI's but that is only during the first year of life and he mentioned it may lower the chance of penial cancer but that the risk is so low its not considered a benefit. Im hoping seeing the doc will help. We have at least agreed on that.
post #37 of 87
Ask him if he's ever seen his father's penis, and if he did, did he worry about whether his looked like his father's.

Honestly, this doesn't usually come up. Adult humans have parts that look different from young humans - breasts, beards, our heads are smaller for our bodies, etc. That's normal. The kid, if he notices at all, will most likely notice that daddy has lots of HAIR in that area, and that he doesn't.
post #38 of 87
Do they (your DS & DH) plan on spending a lot of time naked, comparing each other? I think the "look like father" argument is just ridiculous, and not a vaild reason to circ. What if they have different eye color? Hair color?
post #39 of 87
show him this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MEkAg3a0EVE this was from Fox
post #40 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ann-Marita View Post
Ask him if he's ever seen his father's penis, and if he did, did he worry about whether his looked like his father's.

Honestly, this doesn't usually come up. Adult humans have parts that look different from young humans - breasts, beards, our heads are smaller for our bodies, etc. That's normal. The kid, if he notices at all, will most likely notice that daddy has lots of HAIR in that area, and that he doesn't.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mama~to~my~bunch View Post
Do they (your DS & DH) plan on spending a lot of time naked, comparing each other? I think the "look like father" argument is just ridiculous, and not a vaild reason to circ. What if they have different eye color? Hair color?


Men and boys are not standing around comparing their genitals! Just as I am not going to sit and compare my genitals to my mother's or my daughter's.

If, for some reason, your son did ask why daddy's is different, why couldn't you just say that "doctor's used to tell you to circumcise, but that they don't anymore because it isn't necessary". I guarantee the kid won't care after that!

My mom got cut with all 4 of her births, and I won't with my birth, that doesn't make me feel like less of a woman, nor does she. Times change, science changes all the time, and we can't be afraid to admit that what was done in the past was incorrect.

As for your MIL, why is she so interested in your son's penis? This is between you and your husband and you need to tell her to butt out. What happens when she starts telling you to wean and give formula because SHE thinks its a good idea? Or she puts baby to CIO in a crib because that is what she thinks is best?
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