Food to meet all our Nutritional needs - Page 2

[bluets]

have you tried using a nutrition counter? fitday.com or nutritiondata.com both have free sign-up and you can at least see proportions of fat, carbs, protein, along with approx. how much of the various minerals, vitamins you're intaking.

while you're nursing, i would focus on maintaining weight, not losing. once you're done nursing, decreasing carbs and/or total food intake (without decreasing exercise) would be an easy way of losing pounds.

of course, my personal bias is to eat low carb in general (almost paleo, in fact) and i'd love to move to a one-meal-a-day thing in the style of intermittent fasting/warrior diet.

[hummingmom]

Originally Posted by arismama!

2165 cals isnt enough imho if you are excersizing frequently and breastfeeding. in eat fat lose fat the authors state 2500 cals as the MINIMUM for nursing moms, not athletes who are nursing moms. assuming the op is truly running 5 hours a week she probably needs about 500 cals per hour of excersize, so 2500 extra cals per week, so approximately 350 extra calories a day due to the excersize. unless of course weight loss is a major goal. but just to maintain i would guess the op needs at least 2850 cals a day. so basically a whole other meal in addition every day.

I agree about the calories, especially if this is a solid hour of heavy exercise, but I think it would be possible for the OP to do this without drastically changing her eating pattern. For me at any rate, eating an extra meal is burdensome, as it means more cooking and cleaning up. I'm likely to just end up grabbing something quick, which usually means it's high in carbs (not necessarily a bad thing for everyone, but could lead to unwanted weight gain for the OP).

For instance, when I'm feeling like I can't keep up with my calorie needs, I've been known to make my yogurt with 1 quart whole milk + 1 pint heavy cream. One cup has almost 300 calories, more than twice as much as whole milk yogurt. Replacing the regular yogurt and kefir with this extra-creamy kind, and adding another bowl at lunchtime -- maybe with fruit? -- would be an easy way to add about 650 calories.

Of course, there's more to life than dairy fat , but it's easy and palatable, and IMO very appropriate for women who are pregnant or nursing.

[eastkygal]

I so appreciate all the time you mamas have taken with these posts. It is really helpful and getting me to think in a healthy way about the foods I need. I talked with DH last night who is 6'3" and 200lbs. He says I eat almost as much as he does and he doesn't think I'm lacking calories. Then, I get on the scale this morning and had lost another 5 pounds in a matter of 3 days! This is weight I was particularly trying to lose, though I'm not going to cry about it. I feel now, I'm at an ideal weight and probably should maintain. My size 12 pants I bought 2 weeks ago don't fit now! I'm a big girl naturally and am fine with that. I still have a goal of toning and keeping up exercise as it is something I enjoy very much.
So, it seems like since switching to TF the weight is coming off so easy. : I've always struggled before. I'm thinking most of my calories should come from fat rather than carbs. but, we really need a lot of potatoes to eat within our budget. I love my oats as well for that reason because if I don't do oats every other day we will go through a dozen eggs in 2 days and at $3.49 a dozen!!!! Yikes! So, at least I'm thinking. I really liked seeing it all laid out hummingmom. I don't have the patience for those fitday programs and my internet speed.
I have read Eat Fat to Lose Fat and am currently in the first chapter reading it again.

[hummingmom]

Originally Posted by eastkygal

I'm thinking most of my calories should come from fat rather than carbs. but, we really need a lot of potatoes to eat within our budget. I love my oats as well for that reason because if I don't do oats every other day we will go through a dozen eggs in 2 days and at $3.49 a dozen!!!!

Budget is an important factor. Here are some more figures that you might find interesting.

In our area, local organic pasteurized butter is $6.00/lb. 1 lb. of butter has 3200 calories, so $1 worth of butter = 533 calories.

Kerrygold is cheaper, around $5/lb at Costco (a little more at Trader Joe's), so $1 = 640 calories.

Raw butter is more than twice as expensive, at $13/lb, so $1 = 246 calories.

I don't remember how much organic potatoes are... maybe around $1/lb, if you buy the 5 lb. bags? 1 lb of potatoes has around 420 calories, so that would be $1 = 420 calories... i.e., not really a better deal than the butter.

Amazon has Country Choice organic steel-cut oats for $20.65 for 180 oz. This works out to about $2/lb, which seems to be a pretty competitive price (I think they're over $3 at the HFS). 1 lb. of oats has about 1570 calories, so $1 = 785 calories.

You'd have to check your local prices, but for us, this is the ranking in order of "calories per dollar":

Organic oats: 785
Kerrygold butter: 640
Local pasteurized organic butter: 533
Organic potatoes: 420
Raw organic butter: 246

Hope that helps.

[Fi'sMom]

Hi all! I'm gonna jump in here as well. I eat very much the same as most of you: lots of grass-fed red meat and liver, cooked veggies w/ lots of raw butter or coconut oil, raw milk, etc... Well I'm wondering if, now that it's nearing April, it's time to back off of the heavy foods and allow my liver and colon to rest a bit? Maybe opt for more nuts and seeds, raw veggies and EVOO in place of all the heavy fats? In yoga this morning our instructor was talking about this and it just sounded logical and right. What do you all think? And if you agree, I'm wondering what other spring-type TF's there are to choose from.

[hummingmom]

This is kind of addictive, LOL. Here are a few more calories/$ figures:

Pasteurized honey (Costco) = 680
Beef tallow (US Wellness 2.5 lb pail) = 620
Organic carrots (Costco) = 270
Organic bananas (HFS) = 220
Organic honey (Tropical Traditions 15 lb. pail) = 160

This assumes that the calories are 100% digestible, which isn't the case for whole grains and vegetables; for instance, you can't digest the fiber. So the amount of usable calories in the oatmeal, potatoes, carrots, etc. would actually be somewhat lower. OTOH, these foods also contain some protein, which is typically more expensive than fat and carbohydrates.

BTW, this has been a very helpful exercise for me. Our family of 5 needs 9800 calories a day. If we were all following a low-carb, natural, organic diet, then even if we ate pure fat -- with no protein or fresh food whatsoever -- we would still have to spend over $500/month on food. And our children are still very young. I shudder to think about what it would be like with teenagers.

I think we need to move to the country and buy a cow.

[hummingmom]

Fi's mom, it seems like many cultural and religious traditions have periods of fasting built in. (Yet another thing WAPF seems to avoid talking about.) It would be great if we could start to rediscover some of those practices.

For instance, we're Catholic, and in the Middle Ages, Lent meant 40 days of grains, fish, legumes, and vegetables.... no added oil or fat, no sugar, no meat, no eggs, no dairy. This was done for spiritual reasons, but it clearly had physical effects as well. Today's practice of "fish on Fridays" just isn't going to do the same thing.

Something else that comes to mind -- it was traditionally common for Europeans to drink lots of nettle soup when it was first in season.

Why not start a new thread on this topic? It seems as if it would be of interest to many people.

[TzippityDoulah]

have you considered upping your iron intake? it's very normal for moms both pregnant and PP to be anemic or just simply low on iron. it can cause fatigue, a feeling of never being full and things like pale skin and what not. It also makes your blood sugar off causing you to always feel hungry.
I started eating a lot more beef, chicken and dark leafy greens and that wasn't enough to I added chlorophyll and after a week or so that finally helped.

that fact that you are exercising AND nursing means you need even more calories. I would throw an egg in anything I could... like if you make meatloaf or anything like that just add an egg or two. and fi butter is somethigng you can eat - just put it on everything

oh and beef tallow is relatively cheap if you find somewhere good to buy it. you can cook EVERYTHING in it and it will add a lot of good fat. (and it tastes fabulous!)

[AJP]

Originally Posted by hummingmom

I think we need to move to the country and buy a cow.

Come to the dark side...we have cream!

[eastkygal]

I think I need to journal our day to day food, and analyze where my calories are coming from i.e. is my diet more protein or fat heavy? where are my carbs coming from?

I'm becoming more and more interested in the traditional foodways of Appalachia. It is interesting that the fasting and such was brought up, because during the spring and summer months the diet of the mountain people was more heavily reliant on their garden foods. Hog killing happened in November mostly and was cured/salted to last the winter.

I'm not sure that fasting is in order for me right now as I'm still trying to figure out how I lost 5 pounds in three days without trying to lose weight. I have always been naturally heavier. My thought is my body is healing and getting back to its healthiest state??? Not sure. Though I am looking forward to plates of fresh garden veggies with bacon fat and butter. :

[WuWei]

A couple of things jump out, rapid weight loss dumps any stored toxins to breastmilk and baby. Do you have any amalgam fillings in your teeth? If so, the die-off of candida due to the probiotics and coconut oil could be exacerbating the headache and hair loss.

Also, cashews are high in copper. Many of us have copper loads from copper pipes. And lead loads from old houses. And pesticide storage, depending upon if you've *always* eaten organic or not. And the heavy metals in the soil from which your vegetables grow and your animals are fed.

Tuna is generally high in mercury also, especially for daily consumption while pregnant or nursing!!

Potatoes, unless organic, usually are high in pesticides. Here is a list of produce high in pesticides: http://www.eartheasy.com/eat_pesticides_produce.htm

Not sure what bottled probiotics you take, the kefir is superior, in every way. So, that is just expensive, unnecessary cost, imo.

You are missing many nutrients essential for natural liver detox pathways: http://heal-thyself.ning.com/forum/t...4160Comment655

And missing many essential vitamins and minerals and amino acids, when we eat a limited variety in our diet: http://heal-thyself.ning.com/forum/t...nt-dense-foods

I'd also do the "Pink Pee" test to evaluate your stomach acid and digestion, which impact nutrient absorption: http://heal-thyself.ning.com/forum/topics/the-beet-test Add a fermented vegetable (Bubbies sauerkraut), or lemon in water, early in the day and with every meal.

Any history of yeast, candida, antibiotics, especially during pregnancy or birth?

I'd suggest reading more about detox pathways. It seems you are eating some foods high in glutamates also: http://dogtorj.net/id26.html

I'd consider soaking your oatmeal and any other grains. http://www.suegregg.com/recipes/brea...erwafflesA.htm

Using raw dairy sources, but ideally cultured dairy. Cheese has 10x the casein as milk.

I'd increase your folate from lentils (soaked) and dark leafy vegetables (four servings a day); and add zinc and selenium: pumpkin seeds and Brazil nuts (only two a day). And those will help digestion and the hair loss. It sounds like there is a thyroid issue, perhaps hyper-thyroid. Are you consuming any iodine source?

What about essential fatty acids? Fermented CLO is preferred. Wild Alaskan salmon twice weekly helps.

And most every American's diet is deficient in magnesium. Food sources are bone broths, nuts. But, I'd suggest supplementing with Natural Calm. Epsom salt baths daily are another source of magnesium and sulfate, both necessary for liver function optimization.

I'd also recommend a liver serving, one ounce, three times a week. Organic, grass-fed, free range source only.

How is your sleep, your skin, your stools?



HTH, Pat

[NettleTea]

: :

[eastkygal]

Originally Posted by WuWei

A couple of things jump out, rapid weight loss dumps any stored toxins to breastmilk and baby. Do you have any amalgam fillings in your teeth? If so, the die-off of candida due to the probiotics and coconut oil could be exacerbating the headache and hair loss.

Also, cashews are high in copper. Many of us have copper loads from copper pipes. And lead loads from old houses. And pesticide storage, depending upon if you've *always* eaten organic or not. And the heavy metals in the soil from which your vegetables grow and your animals are fed.

Tuna is generally high in mercury also, especially for daily consumption while pregnant or nursing!!

Potatoes, unless organic, usually are high in pesticides. Here is a list of produce high in pesticides: http://www.eartheasy.com/eat_pesticides_produce.htm

Not sure what bottled probiotics you take, the kefir is superior, in every way. So, that is just expensive, unnecessary cost, imo.

You are missing many nutrients essential for natural liver detox pathways: http://heal-thyself.ning.com/forum/t...4160Comment655

And missing many essential vitamins and minerals and amino acids, when we eat a limited variety in our diet: http://heal-thyself.ning.com/forum/t...nt-dense-foods

I'd also do the "Pink Pee" test to evaluate your stomach acid and digestion, which impact nutrient absorption: http://heal-thyself.ning.com/forum/topics/the-beet-test Add a fermented vegetable (Bubbies sauerkraut), or lemon in water, early in the day and with every meal.

Any history of yeast, candida, antibiotics, especially during pregnancy or birth?

I'd suggest reading more about detox pathways. It seems you are eating some foods high in glutamates also: http://dogtorj.net/id26.html

I'd consider soaking your oatmeal and any other grains. http://www.suegregg.com/recipes/brea...erwafflesA.htm

Using raw dairy sources, but ideally cultured dairy. Cheese has 10x the casein as milk.

I'd increase your folate from lentils (soaked) and dark leafy vegetables (four servings a day); and add zinc and selenium: pumpkin seeds and Brazil nuts (only two a day). And those will help digestion and the hair loss. It sounds like there is a thyroid issue, perhaps hyper-thyroid. Are you consuming any iodine source?

What about essential fatty acids? Fermented CLO is preferred. Wild Alaskan salmon twice weekly helps.

And most every American's diet is deficient in magnesium. Food sources are bone broths, nuts. But, I'd suggest supplementing with Natural Calm. Epsom salt baths daily are another source of magnesium and sulfate, both necessary for liver function optimization.

I'd also recommend a liver serving, one ounce, three times a week. Organic, grass-fed, free range source only.

How is your sleep, your skin, your stools?



HTH, Pat

Wow! I am really appreciative of the time in these responses. It is helpful. There is a lot here I didn't know and some I did. So, thanks so much. I don't have any amalgam fillings. I've only had 2 of the other kind in adulthood. My teeth are in excellent shape.

I wasn't trying to lose weight quickly, it just happened. I got sick and dropped 20 pounds and since it keeps coming off. I'm not trying to lose weight now as I considered 160 a good weight for me. I'm at 155 now. I totally realize the impact on breastfeeding there. As far as tuna, I don't eat it that often. I've eaten 2 cans in 2 months of Tree of Life tongol tuna. I just used that as a recent example of what I would eat other than nuts and cheese for lunch. I had no idea about the cashews.

Raw dairy isn't available to me and I do the best with what is and that is organic. I don't have access to organic meats either and would rather not eat livers of animals that could be fed the wrong diets. It just would gross me out. Would a supplement work? Also, I went 4 hours away and bought 3 bottles of kefir. It's about gone. Could I make yogurt and kefir with pasteurized milk? I take Florify put out by Melaleuca. I got it because I don't have raw dairy and haven't made any fermented veggies yet.

As far as potatoes I buy organic whenever my grocery carries them. We just planted some organic potatoes in our garden. So, that will be good.

I soak all my grains and oats.

I don't take antibiotics unless absolutely necessary, but did have them for the c-sections I had. I have only had 2 yeast infections in my life (sorry TMI).

I will definitely look into the links about liver, nutrients, and have added salmon to our diet, but not as often as you suggested. It is too expensive for our budget of $250 a month.

Skin and stools are fine. Bowels don't move everyday though, more like every other or every 2. Sleep, with co-sleeping 4 to a queen, I do the best I can. I still nurse 5 times a night most nights.

Thanks so much. There is alot to consider here. I'm thinking this summer I may add more veggies and a little less meat to our dinners. We'll have our organic garden veggies and that will help my liver out some. It's tradition here too.

[hummingmom]

Re. wild Alaskan salmon -- the canned stuff is a very economical protein source, and has a lot of other nutrients as well. Some people are turned off by the skin and bones, but they pretty much disappear when they're mashed with a fork and blended in. The pink stuff is less expensive than the red, and IMO it tastes fine for salmon burgers and so forth. The red stuff can be eaten plain, with just a squeeze of lemon. It's not the same as fresh salmon, but it's tasty in its own way.

I know there's some concern about the material used to line the cans (as with other canned foods), but IMO that's outweighed by the nutritional benefits.

FWIW, Weston A. Price considered canned seafood to be an excellent food, and recommended it to those who were unable to obtain the fresh kind due to finances or location.

[mbravebird]

I woke up thinking about you this morning, or yesterday morning, or something -- I was thinking that perhaps it would be worth it for you to mail-order some grass-fed liver? Liver itself is pretty affordable, and it lasts forever if you do the frozen-pill method of consumption. It might be worth the high shipping you'd have to pay. I'd be willing to send you some, although a larger place might have lower shipping. I have ice packs and a small styrofoam box to send it in, though, if you want to give it a try. I'd be willing to give you the liver, and you could just pay for the shipping.

I think the reason I woke up thinking about it is just that liver is so important and such good nutrition, especially given the symptoms you've had. It would be great for you to be able to give it a try.

And yes, you can make kefir from your pasteurized milk! I let my grains die because I was having a pregnancy reaction to kefir, but you should be able to get some grains for free on one of the trade boards. Or you could just spend next month's probiotic money on buying some kefir grains -- kefir will beat your probiotic hands down, it's true.

[mbravebird]

Originally Posted by hummingmom

Re. wild Alaskan salmon -- the canned stuff is a very economical protein source

Seriously-- by my math, one can is about 30 grams of protein!