what works for toddler tantrums

[julie128]

My 2 2/3 y.o. DD has been throwing about 20 tantrums a day. Maybe not quite that high, but it really seems like it. "Do you want oatmeal?" TANTRUM "Do you want eggs?" TANTRUM "Do you want Cheerios?" TANTRUM That's already three and we haven't eaten breakfast yet. Ignoring it doesn't work. Putting her in her room doesn't work. I feel that she wants attention, but I don't want to reward the tantrums by paying attention to her. Her behavior of late has been exceptionally bad, actually, going into the computer room where she knows she is not allowed, refusing to come here when I tell her to come here fifty times, etc. I am sure that this is from new-older-sister stress. The baby takes 2-3 half hour to 45 minute naps a day, so I don't get much time alone with her. Sometimes, though, when the baby is sleeping, she will start making noise and wake her up. I get a babysitter once a week to watch the baby so I have time alone with her. I don't think that sibling stress is the source of breakfast tantrums, though. Any advice?

[Oklahoma Mama]

My ds is a little younger but what has been working for him is to encourage him to kick more. He loves to kick on the changing table when he is upset. I tell him that he can kick bigger than that and keep encouraging him to kick really big. It usually breaks him out of his mood and the kicking stops. I have heard of people who send older kids to their rooms to practice their tantrums to get them really good. Don't know if that would work, but the idea really helps with my ds's kicking/tantrum.

[emmasayshi]

first, take a deep breath and relax, good mommie!

Then take a look at your dd. She's telling you something important. From what you said, I'd say a change in aproach will help. If she doesn't like hearing, "do you want some...", then try asking something like: "which do you choose, cheerios or toast?". Give her a choice and let her make a decision. Whenever she does the right thing, especially with the baby, praise her and say, "how lucky I am to have you to help me!" or, "I'm so lucky YOU aren't a baby! You are so grown up, and I am so happy I have you!".

My dd used to be the big center of attention from strangers until my boy was born, then all the fuss went to him. It was so unfair! So I tried to make her feel like she was the special big sister. It helped. :LOL Sometimes, it wasn't what I said when she needed scolding, but what I said when she needed hugging that made the difference.

[scoutycat]

Ok, I've got a 14 mo old, so no experience & take this with a grain of salt... but...
Maybe she doesn't know how to answer your question? If she's hungry and wants to eat, but doesn't want eggs, then it's no but a qualified no, kwim? I think developmentally kids that age are just beginning to see that choosing one thing means *not* choosing something else, and so they get kind of stuck sometimes. Before, they just knew that they wanted that or they didn't. Maybe saying, are you hungry? we have cheerios, eggs and toast. Which would you like? would help, or using the phrasing that emmasayshi suggested. But it sounds to me like it's more about an inability to phrase her thoughts that a big sis thing, although that might be compounding it. good luck!!! and keep us posted - I'll need to know what happened in a year or so

[Turtle Woman]

My experience at different moments depending on moods and whereabouts.

*I used to hold DD1 tightly and rock her slowly until she stopped. Then we would talk or I would talk to her.

* If she wanted to get away I told her I would be there when she was ready and sometimes sit nearby or ignore her and go on with what I was doing.

*If she was hurting me or her sister I held her tightly and told her I was going to hold her body until she stopped hurting. If she tried to get away I let her go as long as she didn't try to hurt anyone.

*Let her tear paper or scream in a pillow or kick or hit something not someone.

*THROW A TANTRUM YOURSELF!!!! They are so shocked and mine think it's hilarious. I still do it sometimes when they are whining or arguing with me. After, we talk about how it feels when someone acts so demanding. They get it!

Suggestions:

Give two choices. (clothing, food, treats) It makes them feel important and they aren't overstimulated. Ex: They have to decide if they are really hungry.

My DD1 is now almost 7 and a really great kid to be with. Very fun, loving, caring, interesting and thoughtful. She has two younger siblings and does pretty well with them. I am very thankful that she asks for what she needs most of the time. She still acts out in anger sometimes but it is rare and she always knows what she did and is truly sorry and will usually communicate about it right away if not then soon after.

Hang in there. Everything takes time and it goes by so fast you won't believe it.

[Mommiska]

I think you've gotten some good advice. This is a hard age, I think, especially when there is a new baby on the scene.

My dd2 is 2 years, 8 months, so about the same age. And we have a new little one (ds - almost 4 months). And dd2 has been having a really rough time. I also sometimes think that she tantrums over EVERY choice she is given!

That said, things are getting better (after 2 months of non-stop tantrums, it felt like). She has good days and bad days now (an improvement from all bad days...).

Some things that have helped are to just stop and name her feelings for her when she is tantruming (i.e, 'I see that you are very upset about not having your coat on right now. When you are ready for me to help you put on your coat, let me know.' And then just staying with her until she can come out of it).

With the breakfast example, I'd probably say something like, 'I can see that you are upset, and it seems like you aren't sure what you want for breakfast.' Then just stay with her while she gets the upset out of her system. I do think that sometimes children don't know what they want, and that makes them even more upset, kwim?

Is your dd still nursing? That can calm a tantrum around here, although I tend to not offer (which is fine, as she asks often enough! LOL).

Lots of positive attention when she is behaving positively really helps, although you already know that I'm sure.

Sounds like you are doing a great job - hang in there. Things will get better!

[redsmama]

Even more individual attention for the older sib plus emphasis on the many big kid things the older sib can do but the baby cannot always seemed to help us.

[Piglet68]

Sounds to me like your DD is harbouring alot of negative feelings and is having trouble expressing them constructively and effectively. Acting out like you describe is, IMO, a symptom of something else underneath. I think you'll find that just talking to people about their feelings and *validating* them does wonders. I know so many times when I'm upset about something, it's really helpful for me when my DH just listens and says "wow, I can understand why you would feel that way". Even if the something that bothered me doesn't change, just having someone acknowledge how I feel does wonders. Try it with your DD!

(the book "How to Talk so Kids will Listen..." gives explicit details on how to have such conversations, in case you are stuck on how to begin)

[julie128]

Thanks, all. Giving choices leads to even more tantrums, that's why I ask her if she wants a particular thing, yes or no. I think she doesn't quite understand choices or questions yet, which is a source of confusion for her. Throwing a tantrum myself also makes her throw her tantrum even harder. One thing that seemed to work: I wanted to take a picture of her in tantrum mode, for posterity, but as soon as she saw the camera, she got very interested in it. Maybe I'll just take a deep breath (or a few deep breaths) and go get the camera every time and see what happens. Actually, since her daddy returned from a short trip and since she recovered from the flu, she has been in a much better mood overall.

[GardenGuru]

I don't know that it's as deep of a problem...she sounds like she's going through normal 2yr old stuff. wink

Not feeling well (flu) may have increased her irritability, but overall kids get this way sometimes as they are getting ready to master a new developmental skill.

I still think that it boils down to her wanting to feel more in control of her situation and instead of offering her A, B or C...since that isn't working...consider this.

Make her a menu with pictures of breakfast food, lunch food, snack food, etc so when it's the appropriate time...she can pick what she wants in a fun, big girl sort of way. Kids LOVE games and songs.

[Nanner]

Maybe if you had a drawer or shelf full of yummy, acceptable breakfast foods, and also a shelf or basket in the pantry with the same, then every a.m. either she can go in the fridge herself, or you can open the door and let her decide. Some things (like eggs), she can't get all by herself, but she could still look in the drawer and tell you that's what she wants you to fix. We do this b/c dd drives me nuts by saying she is hungry but then either saying no to everything I offer or just ignoring me when I ask her if she wants something. So, now I point her to her drawer in the fridge and her basket in the pantry, which holds most of the food available for breakfast, lunch, and snacks.
Also, maybe she is really hungry (therefore grumpy) when she wakes, so you could have a yummy snack that she is likely to eat by her bedside for her to munch as soon as she wakes up, without having to make decisions with a hungry brain. If you are not too picky about what she has, maybe it could be something that is more of a treat or somehting so that she will most likely want to gobble it right down. Then once she has a little something in her tummy she will be up for making the decision of what to have for breakfast. Hope this helps!
S

[beanma]

well, i know this thread hasn't been active in a bit, but i've been digging for some tantruming threads 'cause we're dealing with it at our house, too. in fact, we sound like we're in almost the exact same situation, older dd
(ours will be 3 in feb) and new baby (7 weeks old here). dd1 was great for the first month or 5 weeks of dd2's life, but the last week or two has been lots of oppositional defiance. she's just miss contrary a lot and it wears on mama's nerves. i think it's a case of both a developmental stage of trying to assert her independence and also of not having mama and daddy's undivided attention any more.

we get things like, "did you have a happy christmas?" "NO! you had a SAD christmas!" (you=I -- she's very verbal, but still has that pronoun thing backwards.) the other day a little friend told her "bye" and she snarled a vicious "hi" in his direction. she'll throw a mini fit at not being able to get her shirt or jacket on, but won't want our help, either. i could easily see a breakfast tantrum here, too. it's probably happened, but i just don't remember it. anything will set her off if she's ready to go. today has been a great day, but the other day she had a 30 minute fit complete with the classic thrashing around on the floor and screaming and wailing because i asked her if she was ready to nurse minutes after she had been asking to nurse. meltdown! it could be over anything, though, really. i don't think the triggering question/action/thing is the real cause. it's just developmental coupled with the new sib plus she had a little cold coming on, too.

that said, i'm not at all sure what the best way to deal with it is which is why i was searching the threads. i need to get reading all those books i've been putting off. the other day in mid-tantrum she was saying, "you (i) wanna run away!". i let her go for awhile (this is all in the house), mainly 'cause i was at my wits' end, but i think she really wanted me to get her 'cause when i finally got down on the floor and hugged and nursed her she got it under control a bit more.

there was an article in mothering a few months ago that was a conversation between a mom and her grown son and they talked about that book "the runaway bunny" by margaret wise brown. (if you don't know the book the little bunny says he wants to run away and become all these different things like a crocus in a hidden garden and the mama bunny says she'll become something else like the gardener and find him.) the son in the article when he was a little boy had apparently always wanted the little bunny to get away. why was the mama bunny stopping him? why didn't she help him runaway? but his older brother had been comforted by the idea of mama bunny always being there to find and take care of the little bunny. so, that leads me to believe it's different strokes for different folks. duh... i don't think, well, really i'm sure there's not one magic cure to stop all different kids' tantrums or even all the different tantrums of one individual kid. it seems like my dd, who has always been _very_ attached and almost a little shy/wary might like mama bunny to come and get her, but i'm not sure if she wants me immediately or if she needs to get some bad feelings and hollering out first or what. i'd love to have some different tactics to try when we're in the throes of it.

well, it's been fun/cathartic/LONG to write this, but i hear her waking so i better run, before she melts...