Swine Flu - Page 6

[HomeopathyMama]

Swine Flu

I guess the death toll in mexico is up past one hundred now, almost two hundred.

[luminesce]

Originally Posted by Amylcd

I'm not sure why there is panic. From what I've read, all of the US cases have been mild and everyone has recovered.

Because all the right factors are here for a possible pandemic. A new virus that humans have not encountered before that can be easily transmitted between humans - one that is no longer containable and is spreading across the globe.

From what little I've read, I think the pandemic in 1918 started out relatively mild. It sputtered out in the spring only to return with a vengeance a few months later with more severe waves to follow. Granted, we have better health care in 1918 but there were reports of healthy young people dying within hours of getting the disease. Do a few google searches about the 1918 pandemic - rather scary!

This is definitely not something to brush off; hopefully, it will stay mild here but with the comments from doctors in Mexico, I'm quite a bit worried. I know how the media tends to create hype but I honestly think that in Mexico the number of people infected, the seriousness of the disease in some and number of deaths has likely been under not over reported.

[earthmama369]

I know it sucks, and I know it's human tendency to try to figure out what others did "wrong" to catch something in order to feel more protected ourselves, but Mexico City really isn't unlike many U.S. cities. It's not some Third World diseased hovel...we have the same issues here in many of our cities. Mexico City has its wealthy neighborhoods, its middle class neighborhoods, its poor neighborhoods, and some truly desperate areas. So do we. Bad air quality? We've got plenty of that in different parts of the U.S., too. Same with water quality.

There is no "us" and "them" here. More than ever, we're a global community, but what hasn't changed is that sometimes very healthy people get sick and sometimes those very healthy people succumb. We don't have all the answers yet, but I'd rather acknowledge the reality that disease doesn't pick and choose its victims, rather than hide in the false comfort that there's a magic trick we can do to protect ourselves, or something special about us that protects us. There are certainly common sense measures we can take -- good diets, good nutrition, plenty of rest, good hygiene, limiting travel to affected areas for the time being, etc. There's a tone of "well, it's Mexico" and "well, if those people had only...." here that's a little disturbing to me.

[luminesce]

Originally Posted by Calidris

I saw it mentioned once, and I think it bears repeating, the one significant environmental issue that Mexico City faces is poor air quality. I don't think there are any figures on what percentage of infected persons have died.

And does anyone know what the percentage mortality rate of "normal" flu in Mexico City is? That would give something more meaningful to compare to.

If you look at the number of reported cases of infection and the number of people who died the mortality rate is VERY high, maybe as high as 10%. My guess is that there are way more (milder) cases than have been reported and the mortality rate is lower; but even a 2% mortality rate could easily mean that a few million people could die. Think about it though; if all these students went back to their home country with the flu, what is the likelihood they came in contact with one of these 1400 index cases? My guess is that the infection is probably much more widespread. I've read that in the past swine flu antibodies have been surprisingly found in pig handlers and their families showing that our immune systems likely tangle with these unidentified viruses more often than we know.

ETA:
Some statistics on "normal" flu (but in Spanish): http://www.scielosp.org/pdf/spm/v48n5/32096.pdf

I think "defunciones" means deaths.

[mom2x]

The cartels' route wars were focused in the border towns, but are being stuffed back down into central america by the military. mexico city is seeing a steep rise in violent crime again over the recent weeks and it must be a very scary time to be there. the tourism is gone as is its revenue, maybe not wartorn, but still... http://www.time.com/time/photogaller...720389,00.html

eta: my point is not to be confrontational, but i am afraid that there is such an air of superiority to mexico here, that if their struggles are not noticed and this is only bad in mexico, it could fuel an anti-mexico fire, yk?

and this! http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/...83606463_x.htm
wild pig pop. soars - that should help?

[eclipse]

Originally Posted by carriebft

They have not been on the brink of civil war, and most of the violence and issues related to the cartels has been in Juarez and like areas- which are now being policed by the military. But Juarez is not Mexico City and I have not seen anything to suggest any nearness of 'civil war'.

Agreed. I live in one of the cities that had a high death toll due to the drug wars (it has slowed down to a trickle in the last couple of months) and it's nowhere near civil war here. There's a lot of media fear mongering in relation to the drug war. The general consensus seems to be that if you aren't involved in drugs, you have little to worry about in that regard.

In any case, I think air quality could be one of the biggest causes of concern.

[k9sarchik]

OK, the latest news report says 149 deaths in Mexico. BUT todays update from WHO says 7 confirmed deaths. http://www.who.int/csr/don/2009_04_27/en/index.html

So is the news actually reporting the truth?

[Scattershoot]

Originally Posted by k9sarchik

OK, the latest news report says 149 deaths in Mexico. BUT todays update from WHO says 7 confirmed deaths. http://www.who.int/csr/don/2009_04_27/en/index.html

So is the news actually reporting the truth?

I read the Dallas Morning News earlier and they reported that "confirmed" cases were certainly lower than "reported" cases. They could say anything right now and people would believe it.

Anyhow, I've been watching all this and it just boggles the mind how much influence these people have on the thinking of the masses. I think I'll go watch Wag the Dog again tonight just for kicks.

If anything, this is a field test for all the new "laws" they have in place. Practice makes perfect.

[Marnica]

http://drtenpenny.com/swine_flu.aspx

I found this interesting

[kmeyrick]

My mother had swine flu in Texas way back in the 70's. It's not actually new. Maybe a new strain, but not actually new. Furthermore, swift, adequate medical care I think prevents death. (Though my mother was very, very sick for a good six weeks).

I don't think it's a conspiracy or anything like that.

[amnesiac]

In order for this thread to remain open, please remember to remain focused on the vaccine issues in this forum. If you would like to further explore disease prevention, complications, epidemiology etc, please join one of the discussions in Health & Healing.

[kiara7]

From Dr. Tenpenny's site:

Novavax’s CEO, Rahul Singhvi announced Friday, "There is an emergency authorization avenue that is available that would allow us to use the vaccine in an emergency without further testing."

Not that they do much testing to begin with....

[Crazybean]

The last few posts made me think.. with the "emergency vaccine" perhaps coming out in phase 2 clinical trials, the company will not be held responsible for any adverse reactions- I wonder if this will become a FORCED mandatory vaccine "for the good of the population"

[Fyrestorm]

Originally Posted by Crazybean

I wonder if this will become a FORCED mandatory vaccine "for the good of the population"

I believe the Patriot Act allows for just that possibility...the fact that they have already declared a 'public heath emergency' has opened that door.

[In Exile]

Originally Posted by Fyrestorm

I believe the Patriot Act allows for just that possibility...the fact that they have already declared a 'public heath emergency' has opened that door.

How familiar are we with the Patriot Act? Does the Patriot Act allow for ALL forced mandatory vaccinations under Martial Law? Or is that reserved for Smallpox only?

Just wondering.

[japonica]

Sheesh, the idea of mandatory flu vaxes for you folks...that's even scarier than the swine flu...

Of course, just watch Canada follow suit or some similar nonsense...they were talking on the news tonight about how soon the vax would be ready...in time for the fall shots.

[Fyrestorm]

Originally Posted by In Exile

How familiar are we with the Patriot Act? Does the Patriot Act allow for ALL forced mandatory vaccinations under Martial Law? Or is that reserved for Smallpox only?

Just wondering.

Section 504 of the Act details vaccination and treatment protocols. Following these mandates, public health authorities may compel people to be inoculated and/or drugged with any medicaments selected by The State. Individuals refusing to be vaccinated or treated would be liable for a misdemeanor, subject to police arrest, isolation or quarantine.


Furthermore, "Section 807" repeals existing state laws that are in conflict with the Act. Under this part, for instance, previous laws granting medical, religious, or philosophical exemptions to vaccination would be repealed.

Here is another article

[Veronique]

Originally Posted by earthmama369

I know it sucks, and I know it's human tendency to try to figure out what others did "wrong" to catch something in order to feel more protected ourselves, but Mexico City really isn't unlike many U.S. cities. It's not some Third World diseased hovel...we have the same issues here in many of our cities. Mexico City has its wealthy neighborhoods, its middle class neighborhoods, its poor neighborhoods, and some truly desperate areas. So do we. Bad air quality? We've got plenty of that in different parts of the U.S., too. Same with water quality.

There is no "us" and "them" here. More than ever, we're a global community, but what hasn't changed is that sometimes very healthy people get sick and sometimes those very healthy people succumb. We don't have all the answers yet, but I'd rather acknowledge the reality that disease doesn't pick and choose its victims, rather than hide in the false comfort that there's a magic trick we can do to protect ourselves, or something special about us that protects us. There are certainly common sense measures we can take -- good diets, good nutrition, plenty of rest, good hygiene, limiting travel to affected areas for the time being, etc. There's a tone of "well, it's Mexico" and "well, if those people had only...." here that's a little disturbing to me.

Best post I've read so far.
I actually haven't been feeling panic at all til I started reading this thread. Now I wanna run off to Costco first thing in the morning and stock up on canned goods!

[In Exile]

Originally Posted by Fyrestorm

Section 504 of the Act details vaccination and treatment protocols. Following these mandates, public health authorities may compel people to be inoculated and/or drugged with any medicaments selected by The State. Individuals refusing to be vaccinated or treated would be liable for a misdemeanor, subject to police arrest, isolation or quarantine.


Furthermore, "Section 807" repeals existing state laws that are in conflict with the Act. Under this part, for instance, previous laws granting medical, religious, or philosophical exemptions to vaccination would be repealed.

Here is another article

Oooh, lovely. *puke*

[emma1325]

Martial Law and mandatory vaccines scare the beJesus out of me.

WWYD?

Please tell me that in a worse case scenerio, someone can offer up a workable solution to this.