Kosher eating at a restaurant

[whiddle]

I know this is probably a dumb question but I've been curious about it. I tried looking on the internet but all I can find is restaurants that are geared towards Jewish people. My question is: How do Jewish people eat at general non Jewish aimed restaurants? Like say Outback Steakhouse.

TIA!

[Sweetjane]

People who keep kosher eat at kosher restaurants. :

[Mommal]

People who are truly serious about keeping kosher will only eat at kosher restaurants. But some people who are fairly rigorous about keeping kosher at home are a little more relaxed when eating out- since many of the issues that are most difficult with "kosherness" are issues having to do with meat, many people will avoid the meat but will eat vegan or vegetarian food at a non-kosher restaurant. If I went to Outback Steakhouse, I would order a salad and a piece of bread, but not the steak.

[2bluefish]

Some less strict Jews eat "clean" - avoid forbidden species (pork, shellfish, etc.) and possibly avoid mixing meat and dairy at meals. That's not really keeping kosher. To my understanding to keep strict kosher you can only eat kosher foods on kosher dishes.

[Magelet]

hmmm I guess I keep "clean" not kosher then. But you know, this is still coming a long way for me, and I've done a lot of work to get here. Its not necessarily about how kosher you keep, but how much you try, and how much improvement you make.

Me, I ask crazy questions when I go out to eat. Mostly concerning the use of dairy and meat. And sometimes that means a lot of questions. "Is there dairy with the steak?" "Let me check." "No, there is no dairy." "Not even butter?" "Oh, of course there is butter." "How about the lamb?" "No, no dairy in that." "Not even in the sides?" "Oh, it comes with veggies that have butter in them." "Could you ask the chef to substitute a dairy free side that he or she thinks would go well?"

Half the time, I get fish instead. I've had some really amazing things created by chef's who were inspired instead of annoyed by my requests though.

Of course, I always feel bad when I'm at a fancy restaurant and they bring out an amuse bouche, and I want to be like "oh yay, thanks" instead I have to ask "what is it? is there bacon? is their meat and dairy? is there crab?" This passover, the amuse bouche at aqua when my mom took me and her fiance there included breaded tuna cakes. I had to ask (though I was already pretty sure of the answer) if there was flour in the cakes. there was. the lady kindly brought me a tomato salad though. (which was AMAZING, which shocked me since it wasn't tomato season, but it tasted like heirlooms ripe in season.)

I don't think I've ever in my life even been to a kosher restaurant. As far as I know, they simply don't have them. There are jewish restuarants, loads of jewish delicatessens, and scrumptious ones, but not kosher.

[MisaGoat]

It really depends on how closely each person follows the rules.

3 examples:

1) I have a friend who sticks to the big rules, no meat and dairy together, no pork , no shellfish.

2) My BIL keeps kosher at home. When he is out he eats at kosher restaurants or eats vegetarian at non-kosher places. Sometimes there really isn't anything for him to eat, sometimes what he eats is very meager. This usually happens at family gatherings because he can't control what food is there. When he comes to our house he eats vegetarian food or maybe something with fish.

3) I have another friend who very seriously follows a kosher diet. She brings her own food to a lot of places (school, work, parks etc). She will eat at kosher restaurants. If she brings her own food to work, she microwaves in double layers and eats at a table separate from people who are not eating kosher food. I've never given her anything to eat, even kosher prepackaged food.

Magelet come to NJ! There are definitely kosher restaurants here!

[Chavelamomela]

Magelet, there are a few kosher restaurants in the SF bay area.

www.shamash.org has an excellent kosher restaurant database.

[Liquesce]

Originally Posted by MisaGoat

Magelet come to NJ! There are definitely kosher restaurants here!

Any worth recommending? :

[Rosehip]

Originally Posted by Magelet

I don't think I've ever in my life even been to a kosher restaurant. As far as I know, they simply don't have them. There are jewish restuarants, loads of jewish delicatessens, and scrumptious ones, but not kosher.

There are a lot of kosher restaurant in the NYC area.

http://www.nachas.org/BethYehuda/kosher.html

[SaraFR]

As stated above, some people hold different personal standards.

Personally, if I couldn't find a kosher restaurant then I wouldn't eat in a restaurant. When traveling we tend to bring non-perishable foods with us so we have what to eat. Foods prepared without kosher supervision would not be an option for our family. We're so used to it that the idea of being able to eat in any restaurant (or even being able to find a restaurant in any location) is strange to us. We're Orthodox Jews, if that helps.

Oh, many Jews live in large Jewish communities and those communitites do have kosher restaurants and everything. The main street here must have at least 3 kosher pizza shops. Who needs so much pizza???

[smeisnotapirate]

MisaGoat, I'm a #2 , however we won't eat out during Pesach. Too difficult to find places to eat with no flours. I don't know how GFCF people do it.

It's mostly the large Jewish communities that have kosher restaurants. Here in Lancaster (bustling metropolitan center we are ), we have one kosher hot dog stand inside Dutch Wonderland that sells falafel and kosher dogs. It's run by our local Orthodox congregation. Other than that? Our strict kosher people just don't eat out unless they head to Philly or down the shore in NJ for the night : where there are actual kosher delis and restaurants.

One thing I loved about Israel was that it was VERY easy to find kosher restaurants. It was such a treat to be able to order in a restaurant without worrying "hmm... is my side cooked with non-kosher chicken broth? Does my salad come with bacon bits?" Reading ingredients in a restaurant is exhausting. Sometimes I wonder if we should just go whole-hog and bring our own food. We'll get there someday.

[BelovedBird]

Originally Posted by whiddle

My question is: How do Jewish people eat at general non Jewish aimed restaurants? Like say Outback Steakhouse.

TIA!

We ("orthodox" observant jews) do not eat in non kosher restaurants.

[MamaJenese]

I live in a neighborhood that is majority othodox jewish. In fact right across the street from my house is a school for orthodox jewish children. Our city is on the small side but full of Kosher resturaunts. When we want to go out to eat with our jewish friends we pick one of those. In fact since we do not keep a kosher kitchen if we want to treat them to a meal it is our only choice. I can't cook for them at my home. And the best pizza in the neighborhood is from a kosher bakery that does pizza on thursday nights!

[Mama Shifra]

Originally Posted by BelovedBird

We ("orthodox" observant jews) do not eat in non kosher restaurants.

I am Orthodox, and yes, I do not eat in a non-kosher restaurant (however, many *although not all* Orthodox Jews will buy a soda or a coffee in a non-kosher restaurant. Some people will not buy milk or milk products either). That means that when I am traveling, the most we will buy is soda, juice, coffee, cereal, and other things with a kosher symbol. Seven-eleven is great! They even have kosher certified hard boiled eggs, ready to eat. Some people will buy cut up fruit without a kosher symbol also at a place like Seven-eleven.

[Ruthla]

If I had to go to Outback Steakhouse for, say, a business meeting I couldn't get out of, I'd eat before going and order a cold beverage to drink while my colleagues ate a non-kosher meal. In my less observant days, I would have ordered salad and fish.

When I was in college, living on campus, I bought vegetarian food since that was the best I could do. When I moved off campus, I would eat breakfast and dinner at home, pack my snacks, and either pack lunch or buy from one particular "hot dog cart" type of place that was 100% vegan. I knew the owner personally (a fellow Jewish student working his way through school) and was able to ask about the particular products he used, look at the kosher symbols on the packaging, etc.

I know people who keep kosher at home yet eat anything and everything away from home (or even at home on paper plates). I have friends who will eat meat OR dairy out, but not meat and dairy mixed together, and no pork or shellfish (or other non-kosher species of meat) but don't worry if the chicken or beef isn't kosher. Others will eat anything that's dairy or fish. At one point, when I was a little stricter but not ready for 100% commitment, I'd only eat cold foods at a restaurant (such as the tuna salad platter, but not the baked salmon.) In a pinch I'd still eat the cold salads, if nothing else is available and I'm unable to eat food prepared at home. An example would be the hospital cafeteria when DS was hospitalized. If I'm only out for a day, I'll pack food from home. If I'm at the mall and hungry, I'll go into Target and get a package of nuts or a Luna bar (all certified kosher.)

I know people who observe kashrus to a variety of different degrees. It's not about "being a better Jew"; it's about each person doing the best they feel they're ready for at that time in their lives. If somebody wants to start keeping kosher, after eating anything and everything before, it's best to go in baby steps. It's still knowing "I'm Jewish and I have to be careful of what I put into my mouth." For some people, these various rules of eating in non-kosher restaurants are stepping-stones on the way towards 100% kashrus observance. For others, it's the level where they're comfortable observing, period.

[merpk]

Okay, breaking my oath to never post here again, except for the stray Jewish mamas tribe post ... sigh.


But anyway, the more-strict-at-home-yet-eat-out-anywhere rule (sometimes called "Conservative kosher") has different ramifications in Israel.



The drawback to salads-in-nonkosher-restaurants is the old "are there bugs or are there ain't." And we all remember when the Wendy's fast food chain was sued by a vegetarian for having some meat products in its salad dressing, don't we?



Anyway, FWIW, we're what we call "Conservative BaDaTz" ... we only bring things with that hekhsher into our home (with the thinking that anyone can eat in our home) but we'll eat at friends' homes who don't hold only with BaDaTz. And restaurants, well, if we ever went to them anymore we'd probably deal with it, but our city's rabbanut *is* a BaDaTz hekhsher, so it's not an issue.





Okay, gonna crawl back into my hole now ...