Substituting Agave Nectar

[AnoriensMom]

I am getting ready to try some beverage recipes from NT, like ginger ale and orangina, but I do not have any Rapdura.

Can I subsitute agave nectar for part or all of the sugar, or will that affect the fermentation?

I am also curious as to why agave nectar isn't featured more in her recipes.


thanks!

[stilllearning85]

I heard Sally Fallon talk a few weeks ago and she is totally against agave. She claims that is made in a very similar fashion to corn-syrup, and has many of the same effects in your body. That could be why she doesn't use it.

[LauraN]

Agave syrup is a high-fructose syrup that functions very similarly to high-fructose corn syrup. It is not recommended as a substitute for sugar in traditional foods circles. Honey is just about the only whole food sweetener there is.

Here's an article written from a raw-foods perspective but it walks through all the reasons why agave is not all it's been marketed to be: http://www.living-foods.com/articles/agave.html.

ETA: I haven't tried making ginger beer yet, but I know that honey is not suggested for use in kombucha.

[snowbunny]

No. Agave nectar, despite being marketed as a natural sweetener, is a very modern sweetener and it is produced through a very intense process that converts the natural sugars into high fructose. It is not a traditional sweetener by any stretch of the imagination.

[Ruthla]

You can substitute cheap refined white sugar in the fermented beverage recipes. It might not be as healthy, but it "works" in terms of feeding the good germs you're trying to grow. Honey is naturally anti-bacterial and doesn't work well with lacto-fermentation.

[mama2leila]

I would use honey or brown rice syrup. Like PPs have said, agave is just fructose. Brown rice syrup is maltose, which is a disaccharide and easier for humans to handle. Though honey is best, IMO.

[icy02]

In addition to honey or brown rice syrup you can use organic maple syrup or maple sugar. As a chef in a organic restaurant I used maple sugar all the time in my desserts. It has great flavor and is ok in moderation. Sallon Fallon actaually reccomended in the article that speaks agains agave nectar. You will probably have to find it on the internet b/c I have never seen it in my whole nautural grocery.

[tolovemercy]

while we're on the topic--could anyone explain the difference in processing between maple syrup and agave? i've never used agave (and don't plan to!!), but when discussing it with a friend, found myself rather ill-equipped to argue against it when he said it was processed similarly to maple syrup.

[PaulaJoAnne]

Originally Posted by tolovemercy

while we're on the topic--could anyone explain the difference in processing between maple syrup and agave? i've never used agave (and don't plan to!!), but when discussing it with a friend, found myself rather ill-equipped to argue against it when he said it was processed similarly to maple syrup.

To put it simply, real maple syrup is reduction of maple water.
It is gently cooked until it is 1/10 of its volume. Agave goes through the same chemical processing that hfcs does.

[snowbunny]

Originally Posted by tolovemercy

while we're on the topic--could anyone explain the difference in processing between maple syrup and agave? i've never used agave (and don't plan to!!), but when discussing it with a friend, found myself rather ill-equipped to argue against it when he said it was processed similarly to maple syrup.

Maple Syrup is tapped from trees and boiled down. The sugar is boiled down further, and paddled to promote crystalization.

Agave nectar is first tapped from agave plants, the forced through a centrifuge into a holding tank and then back into the centrifuge over and over and over again until it achieves the right color. Then it's sent through a heated centrifuge until the desired temperature is reached. At that point manufacturers add a proprietary enzyme which converts the natural sugar into high fructose. Then it's sent through another centrifuge. Then it's sent through a filter. Then it's sent to a holding tank. Then it's sent to an evaporation chamber where it's concentrated--effectively doubling its sugar content. Keep in mind that this method was invented in the mid 1990s--hardly a traditional food.

The real and most notable difference is the enzymatic reaction that agave nectar undergoes that maple syrup does not. That enzymatic reaction makes it closer to HFCS than maple syrup. Keep in mind that most HFCS is about 55% high fructose, but agave nectar can be upwards of 90% high fructose!

[MamaRuga]

Darn! I had no idea about agave nectar being basically the same as hfcs. I am very allergic to honey (yes, even raw) can not handle any form of cane or beet sugars, etc, etc. Maple is ok but so expensive. Agave seemed like a nice alternative. I'm so sad....

[AnoriensMom]

I am so upset. I bought some agave nectar after hearing that it was this great low-glycemic sweetner. And, admittedly, never looked any further into it than that.

So, thanks for the info and the article link.

....First soy milk, whole grains, low fat diets, and now agave nectar....I keep getting duped. I was thinking it would be great to eat only foods that have not been the subject of paid advertising.

[snowbunny]

Originally Posted by AnoriensMom

I am so upset. I bought some agave nectar after hearing that it was this great low-glycemic sweetner. And, admittedly, never looked any further into it than that.

I know what you mean! I thought it was supposed to be great and then I did a little more research. By the way, the reason why it's low-glycemic is that it's metabolized directly by the liver so blood sugar won't really spike, but I'd venture to say having it metabolized directly by the liver is probably even worse!

[bluebell]

Originally Posted by snowbunny

Maple Syrup is tapped from trees and boiled down. The sugar is boiled down further, and paddled to promote crystalization.

Agave nectar is first tapped from agave plants, the forced through a centrifuge into a holding tank and then back into the centrifuge over and over and over again until it achieves the right color. Then it's sent through a heated centrifuge until the desired temperature is reached. At that point manufacturers add a proprietary enzyme which converts the natural sugar into high fructose. Then it's sent through another centrifuge. Then it's sent through a filter. Then it's sent to a holding tank. Then it's sent to an evaporation chamber where it's concentrated--effectively doubling its sugar content. Keep in mind that this method was invented in the mid 1990s--hardly a traditional food.

The real and most notable difference is the enzymatic reaction that agave nectar undergoes that maple syrup does not. That enzymatic reaction makes it closer to HFCS than maple syrup. Keep in mind that most HFCS is about 55% high fructose, but agave nectar can be upwards of 90% high fructose!

snowbunny thanks for posting this, its very interesting reading. i bought some all raw ice cream for dd made with agave syrup and she went crazy after eating it. it totally affected her behaviour and she craved it constantly afterwards. she still talks about it now.

so why do all the raw chocolate gurus and rawfooders say agave is raw? the raw chocolate here in the uk is all made with it and this is made by 100% raw fooders. is it possible to get truly raw agave? or are they bending the truth here. i'm now curious because they are selling this chocolate as a health product.

[icy02]

here is all the info on agave nectar and HFCS in an article by Sally Fallon

http://www.westonaprice.org/modernfood/HFCSAgave.pdf

[snowbunny]

Originally Posted by bluebell

so why do all the raw chocolate gurus and rawfooders say agave is raw? the raw chocolate here in the uk is all made with it and this is made by 100% raw fooders. is it possible to get truly raw agave? or are they bending the truth here. i'm now curious because they are selling this chocolate as a health product.

Raw agave nectar is heated below a certain point, so it can be still considered "raw." I'd still venture to say that a lot of raw foodies wouldn't consider it raw if they truly knew how it is processed aside from the heating aspect.

[bluebell]

Originally Posted by snowbunny

Raw agave nectar is heated below a certain point, so it can be still considered "raw." I'd still venture to say that a lot of raw foodies wouldn't consider it raw if they truly knew how it is processed aside from the heating aspect.

yes thats very interesting, so even if its 'raw' its still highly processed. i'm very suspicious of it now. especially of the way dd reacted to it and that was supposed to be organic and 'raw'.

[Ruthla]

Originally Posted by AnoriensMom

I am so upset. I bought some agave nectar after hearing that it was this great low-glycemic sweetner. And, admittedly, never looked any further into it than that.

I would recomend using up what you've already bought, then don't buy it again. Highly processed as it is, it IS still food and I see no reason to waste food.

I do recomend, however, using it in very small amounts to minimize the strain on your liver. A teaspoon per day in a cup of tea shouldn't be harmful, but I wouldn't consume huge amounts of ice cream made with the stuff.

And any food, no matter how highly processed, is going to be easier on your body than a "natural wholesome" food you're allergic to. For those with multiple food allergies, if agave is the only sweetener you can have without a reaction, it might be your safest bet, even if it's not natural or traditional. Sometimes we need to make compromises.