Why do people let their OB's "play god"??

[fawnanddoe]

Not in any of these forums, but I read a lot of things about women whose doctors won't "let them" go past their due date or 41 weeks, or they get induced early for no medical reason. I feel like more and more women are just letting these things happen and they aren't questioning it and don't realize the risks involved or that their OB might not always be right.
I've also been noticing a lot of "if the baby is too big" things, and they are talking about 8 or 9 lbs. So that is a reason for a c-section!? Has no one ever given birth vaginally to a 9 pound baby? My god. It's just infuriating!

[GoldmanBaby09]

I feel the same frustration, and I just don't get it, either. There are so many women who seem to take no personal responsibility for their bodies, their babies, or their births. I guess it is easier in some ways to just wash your hands of it and let some one else hold the bag, but that is nothing I am interested in doing. I can't imagine relinquishing what is supposed to be one of the most miraculous experiences in my life to someone who is potentially a stranger (who knows who might be on call for their delivery?!).

[dogmom327]

It's simply easier. Doing the research and taking control is hard work. I don't think most people are up to it. Plus our society puts an incredible amount of pressure on pregnant women to just do as the doctor says and insinuates that doing anything else is irresponsible and is risking the life of the baby. I feel sorry for these women.

[rjruiz_415]

Originally Posted by fawnanddoe

Not in any of these forums, but I read a lot of things about women whose doctors won't "let them" go past their due date or 41 weeks, or they get induced early for no medical reason. I feel like more and more women are just letting these things happen and they aren't questioning it and don't realize the risks involved or that their OB might not always be right.
I've also been noticing a lot of "if the baby is too big" things, and they are talking about 8 or 9 lbs. So that is a reason for a c-section!? Has no one ever given birth vaginally to a 9 pound baby? My god. It's just infuriating!

because most people do not really think for themselves and believe that doctors know all... I do not understand it at all. I suppose they really do think Doctors are super people who know everything. Most women really do not see the benefit or purpose of researching things for them selves. Many women also have the mentality of *well so-and-so did it and her baby is fine, so it is okay...* This is a huge pet peeve of mine...

[treetop]

Try having a VBAC! It is infuriating to battle all the OB/Hospital rules but try having a natural VBAC! That totally takes for another spin! Having a strong birthplan and learning to say the word "NO!" is sooo important. So is researching what is best for you and the babe so that you have some ground to stand on. Sigh...don't get me started!

[Quindin]

That's why I began looking for a place like MDC - I got tired of all the "my doctor won't let me" elsewhere.

It was a midwife who encouraged me to feel empowered and responsible for my own health and body. Before then, I too used to think that doctors knew everything.

[DahliaRW]

I find that OBs really don't educate their patients on all the risks and stuff like a midwife does (there are exceptions, of course). I learned WAY more from my mw with my 2nd pregnancy then I ever knew with my OB and my first. And OBs present things like they are not options, where as a mw will present the pros/cons and let you decide. I also think that women get tired of being pregnant and would rather induce then respect their baby's timeline. Or it's more convenient for them.

And I had a 10lb 10oz baby vaginally, so I think the big baby thing is a whole load of crap! It's an excuse to schedule because it's more convenient for the OB.

Now there are valid reasons to induce or do a c/s (pre-e, previos c/s with vertical scar or complications that do increase moms risk for rupture (not a traditional c/s though), baby in distress, mom's health, etc). But those are few and far between.

[georgiegirl1974]

I think a lot of women agree to be induced before they are in labor (and before 41.5 weeks) because by that point, most women are so physically and mentally exhausted from the pregnancy, induction seems like an easy exit strategy. Most women don't know about the risks associated with induction.

I will admit, when I was pg with DD, I begged to be induced at my 40 week appointment. Fortunately, my OB told me my cervix wasn't ripe for induction. (I ended up going into labor on my own the next day.) This time I'm better informed and I would't agree to be induced unless it was medically necessary (pre-e).

[vegasgrl]

Originally Posted by dogmom327

Plus our society puts an incredible amount of pressure on pregnant women to just do as the doctor says and insinuates that doing anything else is irresponsible and is risking the life of the baby.

This.

Also, I think doctors seriously abuse their authority and power over women. It's illegal for most professionals to do that - a teacher can't have sex with a student, a police officer isn't supposed to bully someone, etc. You're not allowed to use your position of power to influence those submissive to you, you know? It's actually punishable by law.

And yet we let doctors do this over and over again. Inductions so OBs can go on vacation. Scheduled c/s to avoid 3am births. And lots of women don't even know they have options - they just assume the doctor, the one in the power position, is right. I honestly wouldn't have had a clue had I not stumbled upon MDC.

It makes me sick really. I'd love to be the Erin Brokovich of birthing; file a class action suit against providers on behalf of all birthing women. But gah, I'm having a baby on my own this fall so it's prolly not gonna happen.

[lindsayjean]

Ugh, I just read a story in a stupid gossip magazine about Andy Firestone (I think he was a Bachelor?)'s wife who in the interview said she had to have a c-section because her baby was too big. Then I looked to see how big her baby was... 8lbs even! Smaller than my first who came out perfectly fine! That's not big to me at all!!

My sis in law got induced BEFORE her due date so her OB wouldn't have to be in the hospital for Christmas. Ugh.

[fawnanddoe]

I agree that most OB's do not list the pros and cons for their patients. Sometimes I will watch A Baby Story (I don't know why, that show always makes me mad) and they nurse or doctor is always saying something like "Ok, we have to start you on pitocin, it will speed up labor. Then we will put your order in for an epi", they don't even give them the pitocin as an OPTION, it's always 'this is what we are going to do'. I imagine that's what it is like with inductions and everything of the sort too.
I find it really sad that women don't research their options these days. Since everyone else is doing it, it must be right. Right?

[annettemarie]

I don't think it's as simple as saying one person does the research, so they make the right choice, and another person is lazy and so they do whatever the doctor tells them. There's an incredible amount of pressure in pregnancy and childbirth, not just from the doctor, but from society, family, other mamas, friends, even strangers chime in. And moms-to-be, especially first-timers, are often exhausted, hormonal, bewildered. They want the very best for their babies, and these options are presented as the very best choice. For every publication out there that says natural childbirth is the way to go, there's another one (or six) telling them otherwise.

Instead of judging other mothers as ignorant or assuming they didn't care enough, I like to think that every woman is coming at the childbirth experience believing she is doing the best for her child. Maybe they come to different conclusions than I do.

And maybe some moms don't research. Maybe they do just accept blindly what the doctors tell them. But I think to change that, there needs to be systemic change in our culture. It can't be laid at one woman's feet.

My two cents in, I'm going to move this into the general pregnancy forum since it's not a DDC-specific topic. That way you can get input from some other mamas as well.

[learnlovebe]

While it's easy to do, it's not just the doctors who are to blame here. It's the whole industry- the hospitals, doctors, and the insurance companies. Doctors have so much liability I would be scared to be a doctor today. So people are so sue-happy, the whole profession has to make sure their behinds are covered.

Having a scheduled c-cection during office hours, with the regular staff (anestheisologist, ob, etc) already there is less risky than an emergency, middle-of-the-night c-cection---especially in a smaller hospital.

Which is also why- especially in smaller hospitals- vbacs are out of the question. Because there is a risk- no matter how small- insurance companies/heath care administrators/whomever don't even want to take the chance. Scheduling a c-section is just easier.

AND...it's about making money. A woman can't be allowed to labor too long- she's tying up a bed that could go to the next paying customer already. Get them in, get the baby out, get on to the next one. That's how (amongst other things) they make their money. Who cares if what could be amazing moments between a mother and child are lost every day???

I think a big question is...WHY aren't more women taking charge of their health care? WHY DO they just let things (interventions) happen without questioning? And...WHAT can we do to help more women think?

[jimblejamble]

I can't respond to this thread without getting really worked up so I'll just lurk and eat my popcorn. :

[fawnanddoe]

Originally Posted by learnlovebe

While it's easy to do, it's not just the doctors who are to blame here. It's the whole industry- the hospitals, doctors, and the insurance companies. Doctors have so much liability I would be scared to be a doctor today. So people are so sue-happy, the whole profession has to make sure their behinds are covered.

Having a scheduled c-cection during office hours, with the regular staff (anestheisologist, ob, etc) already there is less risky than an emergency, middle-of-the-night c-cection---especially in a smaller hospital.

Which is also why- especially in smaller hospitals- vbacs are out of the question. Because there is a risk- no matter how small- insurance companies/heath care administrators/whomever don't even want to take the chance. Scheduling a c-section is just easier.

AND...it's about making money. A woman can't be allowed to labor too long- she's tying up a bed that could go to the next paying customer already. Get them in, get the baby out, get on to the next one. That's how (amongst other things) they make their money. Who cares if what could be amazing moments between a mother and child are lost every day???

I think a big question is...WHY aren't more women taking charge of their health care? WHY DO they just let things (interventions) happen without questioning? And...WHAT can we do to help more women think?

Yes, I agree with you. Money plays a huge role in everything. Pharma and insurance companies also play a huge role in the medical world. This is why I have to pay a bunch of money out of pocket to go to a freestanding birth center, because it's not associated with a hospital and therefore not deemed "safe".

I am constantly trying to get the word out there to women that they have options, because unfortunately a lot of people don't know that they do. A lot of people don't realize you can refuse a lot of things, and that's really sad!

[Ldavis24]

I'm glad someone else mentioned a Baby Story because I was talking about this in my DDC...
That show is soo unbelievable. Those women might as well be comatose for all the thought they put into their births.

I have to disagree that it isn't that women don't educate themselves, they just genuinely think they are doing the right thing...
Yes there can be incredible pressure from friends/family/society etc; however having switched from an OB to a MW at 27 weeks I was able to see firsthand how blindly most women in the OB office would just nod their heads at whatever their doc says. I would chat with them in the waiting room and "doc says I'm going to be induced on this day and it's so exciting!!" "Oh, is something the matter?" "No what do you mean?"

They really just don't get it. I do believe that if women really educated themselves on the subject they wouldn't be so keen to flop on a bed get hooked up to monitors and have that baby yanked out of them while being screamed at to push with their legs in stirrups...How many women would be willing to push in that way if they knew how substantially it increased the risk of a serious tear or the fact that it doesn't help the baby descend at all?

[dmariev]

Originally Posted by treetop

Try having a VBAC! It is infuriating to battle all the OB/Hospital rules but try having a natural VBAC! That totally takes for another spin! Having a strong birthplan and learning to say the word "NO!" is sooo important. So is researching what is best for you and the babe so that you have some ground to stand on. Sigh...don't get me started!

Oh I'm right there with you!! My OB said "we don't do vbacs" to which I replied "oh, that's nice, cause I don't do repeat c-sections" He doesn't like me too much heeheehee

[umbrella]

but I read a lot of things about women whose doctors won't "let them" go past their due date or 41 weeks

Well, for some of this stuff, there really can be a power struggle at play, and if you don't want to make your waves too big, sometimes you have fewer options. If you talk with your doctor, and make clear that their professional opinion doesn't matter to you, then that's not going to be your doctor. They can say no. If your doctor says that in their opinion, it's not worth the risk to go past 41 weeks, and if you try to push that by more than a day or two, by outright refusing to submit, then that doctor can refuse to care for you, and you're left with whoever will.

[fawnanddoe]

Originally Posted by umbrella

Well, for some of this stuff, there really can be a power struggle at play, and if you don't want to make your waves too big, sometimes you have fewer options. If you talk with your doctor, and make clear that their professional opinion doesn't matter to you, then that's not going to be your doctor. They can say no. If your doctor says that in their opinion, it's not worth the risk to go past 41 weeks, and if you try to push that by more than a day or two, by outright refusing to submit, then that doctor can refuse to care for you, and you're left with whoever will.

WHO definitions of a NORMAL pregnancy (37-42wks) by that definition "abnormal" only occurs when you hit 42+1, and I don't think that past 42 weeks is abnormal, there are a lot of mamas who gave birth later than that and their babies were not "overdue". I don't think that by telling them you refuse an induction at 41 weeks is grounds for your dismissal as a patient (and I think it's absurd that doctors can fire patients anyway since they are technically our employees).

[fawnanddoe]

But also that 41 week thing isn't even about making waves. a lot of women don't even realize "normal" gestation goes up to 42 weeks.