Are You Afraid of The Plague?

[lauradbg]

Are you afraid of the plague? Did you know that it's still around?

When I went to school in Santa Fe, N.M., many years ago, we were warned not to touch stray dogs because they may have fleas and they may be harbingers of The Plague--no, really, I kid you not.

THE PLAGUE!!! You know--the disease that took out about a third of Europe.

They don't have a vaccine for it and it's not much of an issue here. But, it was a scary disease hundreds of years ago.

What if they developed a vaccine for it?

[nwmamas]

There were always a couple of cases making the rounds when I lived in Arizona. It was not near us. It was only affecting hikers who were up in the mountains with flea-bitten rats and dogs. It wasn't even fear-mongered when mentioned on the news -- just mentioned for novelty. It's easily treatable with antibiotics. A couple of people nearly died however, because, well, they don't really test for plague right up front, yk? Once it was found, I believe everyone who had it was fine.

[Romana]

I know it's around . . . some of the state or national parks put up signs with squirrels on the saying to be careful, PLAGUE, talk to your doctor if you feel ill, etc.

I'm not afraid of it because it's treatable with antibiotics.

[battymama]

no, why would i be? i dont go around being afraid of diseases, you would quickly go insane if you did that.

[stik]

Nope! I keep track of annual plague cases in my state and in the US because I teach history, and I like to point out that the disease is still around so we can talk about how conditions have changed. But I bathe, and I don't share my living space with flea-infested rodents (nor do I pick up and snuggle such creatures when I find them in the wild) and the disease is treatable with antibiotics. So I don't worry.

Given the low rate of human transmission since the 19th century, I think the process of developing and testing a vaccine would probably cause many more cases of human plague than it could ever conceivably prevent.

[nathansmum]

Wow, didn't know that! But now that I do, doesn't change anything lol. To me it just falls into the category of any other sort of disease that one could end up with.

[calpurnia]

when i was a kid, there was a high profile outbreak of bubonic plague in india, & i was scared of getting it then (i think we had been learning about eyam at school at the time). but now? no.

[grisandole]

I lived in AZ...on a reservation and wasn't afraid. It isn't as deadly as it is portrayed. IIRC a woman living in Los Angeles got it a few years back (rats in the building) and was fine.

So, vax or no vax, not worried about it at all

[amnesiac]

For me, my level of concern about things really depends on likelihood of exposure. If there were a situation where there was a pneumonic plague (because "the plague" really means a couple of different things) outbreak then I would be concerned. But this isn't likely to be a naturally occurring event in the US currently. So I don't think vaccine development is really warranted.

[lauradbg]

I guess all of these "Are You Afraid of..." posts have been to point out that there are real diseases out there that used to kill thousands upon thousands of people, that are still around--the Bubonic Plague, Scarlet Fever, Typhoid Fever (not here, but in other countries now and it did used to be here)--but, because we don't vaccinate for them, there is no fear or even awareness of them.

The effin' plague is in this country for gosh sakes and people are rushing out getting chicken pox vaccines and Prevnar to try to prevent ear infections...

I just think it all points to how wildly the language is spun by pharma, CDC, etc. concerning disease and wellness in this country.

If there was a plague vaccine, people would be reminded of how it decimated Europe and could easily again... except it can't. But, that's what we would be told.

Instead, we are told that chicken pox can have severe complications and you better go get vaccinated so you don't die.

[stik]

"The effin' plague" is endemic among *prairie dogs*. There are fewer than five human cases in the US each year. Hate on the mainstream media and the pharmaceutical industry all you like, but there actually is a good reason they don't get wound up about the plague and it's *not* because there's no vaccine for it. It's because we're not prairie dogs.

Also, there's more than one type of plague in the world. The one that decimated Europe was the bubonic plague. I understand the one that causes under 5 human cases a year in the US is a different one.

ETA: It's more than a little disingenuous to "guess" at the purpose of a series of threads that you started yourself.

[Baby_Vol]

Originally Posted by lauradbg

I guess all of these "Are You Afraid of..." posts have been to point out that there are real diseases out there that used to kill thousands upon thousands of people, that are still around--the Bubonic Plague, Scarlet Fever, Typhoid Fever (not here, but in other countries now and it did used to be here)--but, because we don't vaccinate for them, there is no fear or even awareness of them.

The effin' plague is in this country for gosh sakes and people are rushing out getting chicken pox vaccines and Prevnar to try to prevent ear infections...

I just think it all points to how wildly the language is spun by pharma, CDC, etc. concerning disease and wellness in this country.

If there was a plague vaccine, people would be reminded of how it decimated Europe and could easily again... except it can't. But, that's what we would be told.

Instead, we are told that chicken pox can have severe complications and you better go get vaccinated so you don't die.

I totally agree.

It's all about money.

When I was a kid, the biggest fear about chicken pox amongst the mainstream crowd was "will it cause a scar?!?" That was it! We were VERY mainstream, and all my Mom was worried about was if I would scratch and get a permanent scar.

Now, due to the vax, people are all terrified and reminded of the worst case scenario ...and we get horror stories.

[kiara7]

Originally Posted by Baby_Vol

I totally agree.

It's all about money.

When I was a kid, the biggest fear about chicken pox amongst the mainstream crowd was "will it cause a scar?!?" That was it! We were VERY mainstream, and all my Mom was worried about was if I would scratch and get a permanent scar.

Now, due to the vax, people are all terrified and reminded of the worst case scenario ...and we get horror stories.

Exactly! Before it was - will I get a scar? Now its - will I die?

[lauradbg]

Originally Posted by stik

"The effin' plague" is endemic among *prairie dogs*. There are fewer than five human cases in the US each year. Hate on the mainstream media and the pharmaceutical industry all you like, but there actually is a good reason they don't get wound up about the plague and it's *not* because there's no vaccine for it. It's because we're not prairie dogs.

Also, there's more than one type of plague in the world. The one that decimated Europe was the bubonic plague. I understand the one that causes under 5 human cases a year in the US is a different one.

ETA: It's more than a little disingenuous to "guess" at the purpose of a series of threads that you started yourself.

stik, your understanding on that is wrong. It is the bubonic plague.

It's not disingenuous to explain why I started the threads. Everyone who reads the threads knows I started them--my name's on them...

My point is that there is fear involved in the push for vaccination of what was typically harmless childhood diseases. That's what's disingenuous.

[stik]

I understand it's the same bacteria, and yes, I mis-stated, it is the bubonic plague, but it's not the same strain of y. pestis. I don't have a handy site to show you, which is a bummer, but I have consulted two epidemiologists on the issue (not because of you, because I spend some time teaching about the plague and I like to be thorough) and they agree that the plague we have now, in small numbers, is NOT the same plague that decimated Europe, even though it is caused by the same species of bacteria. Kind of like swine flu wasn't the same flu that caused flu season this fall, or the Great Flu of 1918.

I understand that you are trying to demonstrate that fear is involved in the push for vaccination, and I understand that you feel that fear is unwarranted. What I don't understand is what plague has to do with that. Are you trying to suggest that the push for vaccines would be less of a problem if we feared the plague more? Or if the media focused more attention on the tiny number of plague cases that occur in the US each year? Should we replace the pertussis vaccine with a vax for plague, since plague has a higher fatality rate? Or are you trying to say that since we don't fear the plague, we shouldn't fear VPDs either? If living in a state that has a few plague cases a year is fine with me and I'm not in a perpetual state of fear, is it hypocritical of me to vax my kids against pertussis?

[Marnica]

Originally Posted by stik

I understand it's the same bacteria, and yes, I mis-stated, it is the bubonic plague, but it's not the same strain of y. pestis. I don't have a handy site to show you, which is a bummer, but I have consulted two epidemiologists on the issue (not because of you, because I spend some time teaching about the plague and I like to be thorough) and they agree that the plague we have now, in small numbers, is NOT the same plague that decimated Europe, even though it is caused by the same species of bacteria. Kind of like swine flu wasn't the same flu that caused flu season this fall, or the Great Flu of 1918.

I understand that you are trying to demonstrate that fear is involved in the push for vaccination, and I understand that you feel that fear is unwarranted. What I don't understand is what plague has to do with that. Are you trying to suggest that the push for vaccines would be less of a problem if we feared the plague more? Or if the media focused more attention on the tiny number of plague cases that occur in the US each year? Should we replace the pertussis vaccine with a vax for plague, since plague has a higher fatality rate? Or are you trying to say that since we don't fear the plague, we shouldn't fear VPDs either? If living in a state that has a few plague cases a year is fine with me and I'm not in a perpetual state of fear, is it hypocritical of me to vax my kids against pertussis?

:

[*Erin*]

haven't read the replies, but no, i'm not. the other day, a tour guide at a local shopping place was telling us about the squirrels, and how they bite, even though they seem fairly tame-he said they carry the plague, and could feasably transmit it to a human that way.

[Sailor]

It never even crossed my mind to worry about it. I know it's around. But, so are other diseases. And even more of them are around in undeveloped countries, where I have often stayed, traveling in primitive conditions and trying the most native "cuisine" available. All without getting any of the "recommended" vaccines.

Amazingly, I survived. On the other hand, if you read all the stuff that could potentially happen to a traveler such as myself, you'd think it would be impossible to do what I do.

While I know disease (and the plague) is very real ... I protect myself by taking care of my health and immune system, naturally. I think that is the best defense.

[newmum35]

Originally Posted by stik

What I don't understand is what plague has to do with that. Are you trying to suggest that the push for vaccines would be less of a problem if we feared the plague more? Or if the media focused more attention on the tiny number of plague cases that occur in the US each year?

If the media focused attention on the small number of plague cases that occur in the US each year, AND there was a vaccine for it they were trying to push (thus, using fear to sell it), AND it was "mandated" on the school schedule... guess how many people would "opt out" of it? (not many, as they would all be too uneducated enough to do so- everyone would simply be vaccinated for it without really needing it, without asking questions, etc) ... This was her point; it wasn't hard to grasp.

I still have a hard time coming to grips with the fact that schools mandate such vaccines as Hep B, and chicken pox. With the former, unless the kids are having sex or doing drugs (using dirty needles) in school they're not going to be at risk. Thats the one that confuses me the most about school policy - didn't anyone stop to question this stupidity? I won't go into chicken pox or flu, but they also should be crossed off the list of "mandated" vaxes. In my opinion IF a school is going to mandate any vaccines at all, they should at least have 2 things in common: being highly contagious (hep B is NOT) AND serious, deadly, matter of life or death risk to school children! School policy probably began this way with smallpox way back when, but, unfortunately now has evolved to include disease you can only catch if sharing blood or having sex! Where have people's brains gone?!?

[Astrogirl]

LOL.

No.