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Where won't you shop/do business and why? - Page 4

post #61 of 211
Rather than boycotting specifically, I mostly just try to make responsible choices. So, instead I try to patronize places that do have good practices, etc. Two glaring exceptions are Nestle and P&G though. Those two companies are pure evil, and I absolutely boycott them.
post #62 of 211
if i can get things locally i do but we have very few stores near us. all the stores near us are small family owned though which is nice. we can drive about 45 minutes to an hour to go to stores with more selection or we can order stuff and since no one in this family likes being in the car for very long we order a lot of stuff. when possible i like to order form small family owned companies. the main big company i order from is amazon and generally the tings i order from amazon.com are not things i can get from small family owned companies. overall i try not to get to stressed about it though. i used to have so much guilt over not doing enough and finally i had to be a little more gentle with myself and forgive myself for not being perfect.
post #63 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by kiara7 View Post
No Wal-Mart here. While Target might have some of the same oversees practices, at least they treat their domestic employees right.
I believe that is up for debate.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...1225409AAj2Caf
http://www.vault.com/companies/compa...type=workplace
http://www.complaintsboard.com/compl...ng-c88868.html

I can't find the specific article I read, as it was years ago, but Target treats their employees pretty much the same way Wal-mart does.

Target is Wal-mart with a prettier package. People who object to Wal-mart really can't shop at Target with a clear conscience, imo, because they are the same place.

Personally, I don't think either of them are the real problem, because it is our government that allows big business to operate this way. As long as American companies are able to get products by having them produced with slave labor or near slave labor and get their employees given state sponsored health care benefits with no financial penalties, they will.

Is it wrong? Maybe, but if our government allows them to profit in this way, what's to stop them? There are hardly any retail establishments that don't have MIC merchandise in them, and any large corporation is working the system in any way they can. These guys just happen to be among the worst ( or best) at it, depending upon your point of view. Unfortunately, they are playing by the rules our Federal and State government has given them.

If you don't like the rules, you should be letting your legislators know about it, because the boycotts aren't really hurting Wal-mart. And Target is laughing all the way to the bank as well.
post #64 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigeyes View Post
I believe that is up for debate.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...1225409AAj2Caf
http://www.vault.com/companies/compa...type=workplace
http://www.complaintsboard.com/compl...ng-c88868.html

I can't find the specific article I read, as it was years ago, but Target treats their employees pretty much the same way Wal-mart does.

Target is Wal-mart with a prettier package. People who object to Wal-mart really can't shop at Target with a clear conscience, imo, because they are the same place.

Personally, I don't think either of them are the real problem, because it is our government that allows big business to operate this way. As long as American companies are able to get products by having them produced with slave labor or near slave labor and get their employees given state sponsored health care benefits with no financial penalties, they will.

Is it wrong? Maybe, but if our government allows them to profit in this way, what's to stop them? There are hardly any retail establishments that don't have MIC merchandise in them, and any large corporation is working the system in any way they can. These guys just happen to be among the worst ( or best) at it, depending upon your point of view. Unfortunately, they are playing by the rules our Federal and State government has given them.

If you don't like the rules, you should be letting your legislators know about it, because the boycotts aren't really hurting Wal-mart. And Target is laughing all the way to the bank as well.
I get what you're saying. If we dig down enough I'm sure we can find something wrong with every single company out there. In my personal experience, Target employees I knew were paid a decent wage, were never locked in the store, received decent benefits, etc. Not the same with WM, again, in my personal experience with people who worked for them.
post #65 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by kiara7 View Post
I get what you're saying. If we dig down enough I'm sure we can find something wrong with every single company out there. In my personal experience, Target employees I knew were paid a decent wage, were never locked in the store, received decent benefits, etc. Not the same with WM, again, in my personal experience with people who worked for them.
This may be regional or vary by store. My MIL has worked for them for at least 10 years and is now at a management level. She is paid well, gets full bennies, and overall is satisfied with the deal she has going there. Certainly there are frustrations, and I know it bothers her when she can't get the week off that she wants, but that's normal most places. Does that mean they don't have poor practices overall? Of course not. Just saying that I don't think it's necessarily one size fits all for every store.
post #66 of 211
I wanted to add that I really try not to buy name brand anything. The only way I will is if it is proven to be better. Like, I buy Kikkoman teryaki cause it's the best (to me). I never buy Kellog's anything b/c of circ issues too. But it was the other kellogg who was pro circ and is probably flipping in his grave over how good corn flakes taste. I won't buy Ameda pumps, again circ issues. I plan to never give birth in hospitals b/c of the same and the way my son and I were treated. In fact, I really don't want a midwife b/c of the way the last one just ditched us.

I wanted to say that we went to Babies r us to get lo a swim diaper. Well, I found NO ONE on the sales floor. I didn't find what we were looking for. Not till the cashier showed us. There aren't any phones or pager buttons. Then, to top it off. LO walked off from us. He's 17 mo. I know we should have been watching better. When I went to the service desk to initiate the Code Adam, the manager person looked at me like I was stupid. I said "My baby's gone." It was almost as if she had no clue what to do. Didn't offer to look with me, didn't ask what he was wearing. Anyway, a few moments passed and she called it over the intercom. Meanwhile, I'm racing around looking for him. (He was sitting down and refused to go to the employee that found him. Good kid!!!) I'm just ticked off. Target responds WAY faster than she did.
post #67 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigeyes View Post
If you don't like the rules, you should be letting your legislators know about it, because the boycotts aren't really hurting Wal-mart. And Target is laughing all the way to the bank as well.
ITA!!!

My biggest beef with the film, The High Cost of Low Prices, is its inference that boycotting Wal-Mart and stopping it from coming to communities would somehow erase the problem. But come on. Is it better to pluck each weed as it sprouts or apply a good mulch? The problem is a systemic one, and until we address it systemically, it won't go away.

That said, I still cannot shop at Wal-Mart. It's a matter of personal conscience. But I won't fool myself that they're somehow suffering without my business. I'm glad for this thread because it's forced me to be accountable for shopping at Target :, which I've resolved to stop doing.
post #68 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by Treece View Post
I wanted to say that we went to Babies r us to get lo a swim diaper. Well, I found NO ONE on the sales floor. I didn't find what we were looking for. Not till the cashier showed us. There aren't any phones or pager buttons. Then, to top it off. LO walked off from us. He's 17 mo. I know we should have been watching better. When I went to the service desk to initiate the Code Adam, the manager person looked at me like I was stupid. I said "My baby's gone." It was almost as if she had no clue what to do. Didn't offer to look with me, didn't ask what he was wearing. Anyway, a few moments passed and she called it over the intercom. Meanwhile, I'm racing around looking for him. (He was sitting down and refused to go to the employee that found him. Good kid!!!) I'm just ticked off. Target responds WAY faster than she did.
Now this is a store-by-store problem... I lost my son in a BRU once. I was looking at car seats. He must have been about the same age as yours because I was debating getting a marathon - which we ended up getting when he was 20 months. He was there - I was looking at the seat - I turned around and he wasn't there. They shut the store down QUICK and had me wait by the door in case anyone tried to leave with him.

I wanted to crawl into a hole and die of embarassement...

They did act quick though.
post #69 of 211
I don't shop at many of the businesses already mentioned. I DO buy all I can locally and as minimally processed as possible.

In my view, the bigger things become the harder it is to keep them human and decent. The writer Wendell Berry has thoughtful commentary on this topic. Physical distance and its attendant lack of relationship make truly responsible behavior almost impossible for us. In other words, my husband owns and runs our business and if/when we have employees, seeing them every day and getting to know them helps motivate him to treat them fairly. Not so with big companies.
post #70 of 211
:
post #71 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by RunnerDuck View Post
Now this is a store-by-store problem... I lost my son in a BRU once. I was looking at car seats. He must have been about the same age as yours because I was debating getting a marathon - which we ended up getting when he was 20 months. He was there - I was looking at the seat - I turned around and he wasn't there. They shut the store down QUICK and had me wait by the door in case anyone tried to leave with him.

I wanted to crawl into a hole and die of embarassement...

They did act quick though.
It was aweful those few moments. But I bet you're right. And it could have just been the Manager on Duty. There were hardly any visible employees. So, I really don't know. But I won't be shopping at THAT one again. It scares me to think what could have happened. But he was sitting there enjoying the excitement. lol
post #72 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigeyes View Post
I believe that is up for debate.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...1225409AAj2Caf
http://www.vault.com/companies/compa...type=workplace
http://www.complaintsboard.com/compl...ng-c88868.html

I can't find the specific article I read, as it was years ago, but Target treats their employees pretty much the same way Wal-mart does.

Target is Wal-mart with a prettier package. People who object to Wal-mart really can't shop at Target with a clear conscience, imo, because they are the same place.

Personally, I don't think either of them are the real problem, because it is our government that allows big business to operate this way. As long as American companies are able to get products by having them produced with slave labor or near slave labor and get their employees given state sponsored health care benefits with no financial penalties, they will.

Is it wrong? Maybe, but if our government allows them to profit in this way, what's to stop them? There are hardly any retail establishments that don't have MIC merchandise in them, and any large corporation is working the system in any way they can. These guys just happen to be among the worst ( or best) at it, depending upon your point of view. Unfortunately, they are playing by the rules our Federal and State government has given them.

If you don't like the rules, you should be letting your legislators know about it, because the boycotts aren't really hurting Wal-mart. And Target is laughing all the way to the bank as well.
Thanks for all this information and I agree with your points.

The thing is for me (and I really need to put this into practice better by not shopping at these places even as rarely as I do and by contacting my reps. I am ashamed we don't do this as both DH and I worked at WM for 2 years) is that where I do not deny Target treats it's employees better than Wal Mart they still don't treat them well. I just don't think we should compare businesses to WM and excuse their practices because at least they aren't as bad as Wal Mart, ykwim?
post #73 of 211
I was thinking about this the other day. The US is a consumer nation. We don't make much here, we just have everything brought in from other countries.

Clothing is made elsewhere, electronics are made elsewhere, cars are made elsewhere, and if we do make something here, we get the parts from somewhere else....we need to start making things ourselves or figure out something we do better than everyone else because we keep shipping all our manufacturing off to other, cheaper places and giving our money to everyone else.

Gee, I wonder why our economy is bad?

We used to be good at farming, and the government paid farmers to not grow food!
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...070100962.html

Things are so screwed up, and our government has allowed it, imo, at every turn. The American people allowed it, because we never protest when these things are OK'd, we're so busy blaming Wal-mart we don't see what's really going on.

Big business could not do these things if big government didn't make the rules that allowed them to do it in the first place. They get big tax breaks for putting welfare mothers back to work, even though those welfare mothers all require state sponsored health insurance that costs the taxpayers. They get huge tax breaks because the government writes the tax code.

Who allowed this? We did.

So who is villian? Wal-mart? The government? Or us?
post #74 of 211
I don't think we have Target here (Canada). I'm glad we don't.

I avoid Walmart at all costs. I just don't like the place. Especially the new 'super centers'. WHY do we need a store that huge that sells EVERYTHING? The ads for another grocery store where they have bus service taking people around are hilarious - love them. The only time I'll enter a Walmart is if armageddon happens and I need to loot some supplies to live on as I vacate the city.

I also never ever will shop at Superstore for much the same reasons, although that may in part be due to being forced to shop there for a job I had when I was pregnant with my oldest, and every time I walked in the front door of the place I got a raging headache.

I am very sad to read that Burts Bees and Toms of Maine sold out

There's certain places I will never step foot in again because of personal reasons, like the little local tailor shop I had a pair of pants fixed in 2 weeks ago. Today the same zipper broke - when I had a good look at it I'm sure they didn't replace it like they were supposed to, they just left the faulty zipper in it and did it up and charged me $18 for it.

I will never shop at Value Village because they solicit donations under the guise of the Canadian Diabetes foundation over the phone, then sell them for a profit. Goodwill is WAY better - they are a true non profit. Plus their prices are much lower.
post #75 of 211
My town is getting a Target. The more I think about it, the more I do not like it. The city cleared some pretty green space to make Best Buy and Target. I think the land would be better off used as a CSA, but then again that would take away business from Wally World across the street. Not to mention the city will pave the way for big boxes to come while local business fail or scrape by.

I think in general people are way too dependent on boxes. In a way I think some people are kind of crippled by it. For example, I hear people complaining about the quality of the Walmart's food. Well, then maybe we should take our food supply into our own hands. And this is in a state stereotyped as being agricultural but too many people don't think to grow their own stuff. I've heard (haven't looked up the statistics yet) that the US grows less than half its food. Just crazy!!!
post #76 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigeyes View Post
I was thinking about this the other day. The US is a consumer nation. We don't make much here, we just have everything brought in from other countries.

Clothing is made elsewhere, electronics are made elsewhere, cars are made elsewhere, and if we do make something here, we get the parts from somewhere else....we need to start making things ourselves or figure out something we do better than everyone else because we keep shipping all our manufacturing off to other, cheaper places and giving our money to everyone else.

Gee, I wonder why our economy is bad?

We used to be good at farming, and the government paid farmers to not grow food!
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...070100962.html

Things are so screwed up, and our government has allowed it, imo, at every turn. The American people allowed it, because we never protest when these things are OK'd, we're so busy blaming Wal-mart we don't see what's really going on.

Big business could not do these things if big government didn't make the rules that allowed them to do it in the first place. They get big tax breaks for putting welfare mothers back to work, even though those welfare mothers all require state sponsored health insurance that costs the taxpayers. They get huge tax breaks because the government writes the tax code.

Who allowed this? We did.

So who is villian? Wal-mart? The government? Or us?
A lot of people think this is wonderful and why our country is so grand and just getting so much better.
post #77 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by onelilguysmommy View Post
A lot of people think this is wonderful and why our country is so grand and just getting so much better.
That's really sad.
post #78 of 211
I'm reading 'Confessions of an Ecosinner' right now and if you've never thought about the sources of your stuff, this is fantastic. The author traveled all over the world to figure out how things are made, like what 'fair trade' coffee really means. It means the farmers are still very poor, even with their guaranteed low wages with small plantations they slave away at and the middlemen make more money. One cotton teeshirt requires 1800 GALLONS of water to produce, and cotton is grown in dry, sunny regions with low rainfall (northern australia and India), rivers are diverted and drained dry to sustain these crops.

We Americans like the fact that we abolished slavery a hundred fifty years ago, like we're so progressive regarding human rights. But all we've done is outsource the slavery to other nations, so now we dont 'own' it. We contract it out. As consumers it's our obligation to look into where our stuff comes from and whether the system is something we want to support or not.

I try to buy less, 'try' being the operative word. I try to buy used when I can and like to hit consignment stores and Craigslist when I need something. I like to barter services as well. I do shop the big box stores now and then, but I try to balance it with more sustainable practices elsewhere.
post #79 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rebecca View Post
We Americans like the fact that we abolished slavery a hundred fifty years ago, like we're so progressive regarding human rights. But all we've done is outsource the slavery to other nations, so now we dont 'own' it. We contract it out. As consumers it's our obligation to look into where our stuff comes from and whether the system is something we want to support or not.
Amen.

I think I need to print out a lot of these posts and keep them where I can see them often.
post #80 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2xy View Post
I don't encounter it so much since we moved back north, but when we were in the southern part of the country, I often saw symbols such as crosses and the "ixoye" fish symbol on random business signs.

I figure that if a dentist feels the need to advertise his religion via the front door of his office, then he must have some reason for it. Either he wants to attract clients of a certain faith or repel clients of other faiths.
I live in Texas and see a lot of this. I, too, am turned off by restaurants and physicians feeling the need to post religious fish symbols next to their business signs. It seems to scream, "We are good, Christian people. Give us your business!" Since when has being a Christian or not being a Christian had anything to do with how food tastes or how good a pediatrician is at his/her job? : If I ever open up an interior design business, I'm going to put a big rainbow next to my sign because everyone knows that we gays are the creative types.
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