My grandson is getting cired tomorrow =( - Page 3

[perspective]

Originally Posted by pammysue

I'm so sorry.



Well, then who should make the final decision? The courts, maternal grandparents, paternal grandparents?

Of course it's a mother's final decision regardless of her age.

The reason I said it was screwed up was not because young mothers have parental rights. What I meant is that we have a system that says its legally and morally O.K. to circ male minors because their parents knows whats best. Yet not only is a 14 year old girl old enough to make decisions about her own body, she is also old enough to decide if her son should be circumcised, while her 14 year old boyfriend is not legally seen responsible enough to make the same kind of decisions about his own body! Thats whats screwed up.
It makes me feel sick because if we have such basic legal prejudice built up against boys then it just shows how much more of a legal mess that is in store to build up more rights for boys.
(not to mention fathers should have equal parental rights as mothers, so it should be "of course Mom". It should be BOTH.)

Also, the OP stated it is important to her to have a good relationship with her DGS's mother and grandparents. I can't see how taking them to court would help that. And on what grounds?

At this point there is no reason to go to court, but as long as the boy was still intact there certainly was. Going to court at that point she would be fighting to not only protect the rights of her newborn grandson, but ALSO for the wishes of her son as a father, and new parent. If that caused her DIL and her mother to be upset, well then thats their fault for stomping on the wishes of the males in the OP's family.

But I agree at this point, its best to try to heal as many emotional wounds as possible, especially considering the physical ones never can be.

[anony]

This experience will hopefully result in positives. If your son does have kids down the road as an adult, he will be able to make sure his wife or significant other understands circ'ing is not an option. If his current girlfriend and him stay together, it will be a real deal breaker though. In this case, it seemed out of his hands. But that will also result in facing hard answers if his first son, depending on how close the relationship is, wonders why some brother(s) or cousin(s) were left intact and he will learn his mother's side of the family pressured into having him done.

I can only imagine how hard that would be to deal with if it occurred to me, but it's just another reminder of how myths continue to perpetuate. If one is deadset against circumcising their child, no matter how old they are, and they have the decision made out of their hands it's a pretty horrible thing and I imagine heartbreaking. But it sounds like the OP is taking it hard too, which is understandable when you know the facts and see it happen anyway.

[A&A]

Fyrestorm is right...........there is an "equal protection" clause in the Constitution. But we just need someone to take it to the Supreme Court, and for the S.C. to see it the same way.

[georgia]

Please let's try and keep the thread focused on supporting the OP. The topic of equal protection and Supreme Court issues would best go in Activism.

Thanks

[jlovesl]

Well nothing can be done about the circ. now. But the thing I'm concerned about is why on earth is a 14 year old having sex and babies????? Why was this child not taught about safe sex or for his age no sex at all???????Maybe a sex ed course before all this would have prevented this whole discussion?

[Krystal323]

Originally Posted by jlovesl

Well nothing can be done about the circ. now. But the thing I'm concerned about is why on earth is a 14 year old having sex and babies????? Why was this child not taught about safe sex or for his age no sex at all???????Maybe a sex ed course before all this would have prevented this whole discussion?

Sorry to call you out, but this is not helpful. I've known the OP for years, and she is an amazing, dedicated mama who has always done the very best she can for her son and all her children.

I don't even have a teenager of my own, but I am not so naive to assume that a sex ed course or even teaching about safe sex/abstinence is the key in deterring teens from sex.



Jessica, I'm so, so sorry. I wish I could be there for you guys right now

[JessicaTX]

Well, you know what happens when you assume =)

He actually had sex ed classes, and we'd talked many times about sex, and the importance of waiting for the right person. I told him that sex creates an intense emotional bond, and you want that bond to be with someone with simliar values to your own, and at the very least a prospective future wife. We covered all the bases with diseases that he could get and pregnancies that could happen, but he's got an overload of hormones that he doesn't know how to control. At my house there were rules in place to avoid situations where sex would even be possible, at her house..the rules were different, and he let me think otherwise.

I'm sure this isn't the first incident we're going to disagree with over the raising of my grandson, and i'm not quite sure how to go about making sure my son has a voice in it. He's very much wanting to be a good father, and I don't want to mess up the relationship between our two families and jeopardize that. The mom here is a very typical 15 year old girl. I'm pretty sure she'll withhold any baby visitation for any perceived hurts, real or imagined. So how does one go about establishing paternity and visitation rights without trampling on the mother's feelings? The issue started out as circumcision one, but it's quickly spreading to a myriad of other parenting choices.

[proudmomof4]

From what you are describing it sounds like you've done a lot to raise a responsible young man - but people in general and maybe teenagers especially make mistakes and wrong choices.
The whole situation must be a lot to handle. Is there any place you could get professional help and support, maybe "Planned Parenthood"? (I am not American, so I don't really know how the system works.)

[Equuskia]

Originally Posted by JessicaTX

Well, you know what happens when you assume =)

He actually had sex ed classes, and we'd talked many times about sex, and the importance of waiting for the right person. I told him that sex creates an intense emotional bond, and you want that bond to be with someone with simliar values to your own, and at the very least a prospective future wife. We covered all the bases with diseases that he could get and pregnancies that could happen, but he's got an overload of hormones that he doesn't know how to control. At my house there were rules in place to avoid situations where sex would even be possible, at her house..the rules were different, and he let me think otherwise.

I'm sure this isn't the first incident we're going to disagree with over the raising of my grandson, and i'm not quite sure how to go about making sure my son has a voice in it. He's very much wanting to be a good father, and I don't want to mess up the relationship between our two families and jeopardize that. The mom here is a very typical 15 year old girl. I'm pretty sure she'll withhold any baby visitation for any perceived hurts, real or imagined. So how does one go about establishing paternity and visitation rights without trampling on the mother's feelings? The issue started out as circumcision one, but it's quickly spreading to a myriad of other parenting choices.

To establish paternity, he would need to go to court. The court may order a DNA test if she denies he's the father. Is he on the birth certificate or not? If he is, then he would need to go to court to establish visitation and custody. If not, then the court has to declare him the legal father, and there, they will assign him custody and visitation rights. This is something better done sooner than later, because the last thing you need is her saying, "Well he never cared before...he never visited..." etc.

I'm really sorry you're going through this and your grandson had to suffer over someone's ignorance. I really recommend you retain a good family lawyer so he can have rights to the child. He should have been able to refuse the circ in the hospital, but that's water under the bridge now unfortunately.

[jlovesl]

Well I'm sure the responsibilities of a baby will help with the question of maybe a condom next time.I would even purchase them for him if I had to. Kids will do it regardless of what a parent says(this I understand). But if he's supplied with the means maybe he will use them next time. It's too bad it has happened. As for her and her mother with holding rights to your son, can easily be fix by a lawyer. If he is providing for that baby then she has no legs to stand on when it comes to visitation. But I would speak to a lawyer soon to set up visitation days right away. It may be harder to get the days he wants if shes breast feeding but that needs to end sometime.I think there is a case where a woman was breastfeeding her 5 year old out of spite to keep the father from weekend visits. Judge ruled her to have to pump so Dad could have time with his child.

I would really hate to see it be you to raise this baby when he is with your son. Your job gets to be the spoiling Grandma and your son needs to learn how to raise a child. He made the mistake, now he has to learn how to deal with the day to day hardships of being a parent. Not saying it's all bad but every parent has one of those days. And I'm not saying you can never help him out(everyone needs advice from time to time) but make sure he does majority. The last thing you want him to think is every time he has a accident Mommy will look after it for me.

I think both him and her will have to figure out their other parenting choices. Maybe get a little help along the way. IMO, you need to step back on how they raise the baby. Unless it is something that may harm the baby. This is their child not yours.

[Marsupialmom]

I agree take her to court now. She will get over it. It also protects your son 4 - 18 years from now if she decideds she wants child support. He won't have to pay back child support. Also if she gets social services and puts his name down a few years down the road it can be very financially consumming for him/you.

If he is on the birth certificate it will be a lot easier-- but honestly I hope he isn't on it. If he isn't dad (and it happens) he can walk away. If he is not get a lawyer and demand a paternity test.

Have your son keep all reciepts and log everything. Any and all time he tried to contact. Behaviors good and bad of mom and maternial grandma.

When he does get vistiation guide him don't take over. This might mean walking a way when it is hardest. Don't jump to quick to be a baby sitter for the "fun" stuff -- school/work yes but things like dating, prom, and other stuff he has a bigger commement.

[georgia]

I'm sorry, but I am closing this thread to new posts as it is no longer about circumcision.

to you, Jessica!