What type of discipline is this?

[Cekimon]

I've never officially read any books on discipline.... I've skimmed these boards from time to time and I'm wondering.... When you tell a pre-school age child (2.9-4 years) "If you do it again, you will ...." and then fill in the blank with a consequence such as .... get a timeout, lose a privilege, have something taken away... What style of discipline is that and what are the drawbacks to this being the primary form of discipline? It seems like with everything else..... there are advantages and disadvantages to various parenting styles. I find myself doing this a lot with DS. If he acts out in a negative way... pushing sister, taking a toy out of her hands while she's playing with it.. so on... I will say that he needs to stop right away and warn him what the consequence will be if he does it again. The consequence varies on what he did and where we are. I reserve time out for serious stuff or if a time out is needed for me to catch my breath (temper!) and cool down myself. I was also doing the counting to 3 and you have to stop or follow my direction by the time I count to 3 but I stopped doing that because he was anticipating it and would start counting on his own. It seems like I over did that. I don't have major issues with DS... right now our biggest issue is that he talks back and says "NO" when we ask him to put away his shoes or do something simple that he previously did happily. I just don't want to come down on him too hard but I don't want him to walk all over us either.... He's turning 3 and getting SO smart. He's super sweet and I want to keep him that way long as possible.

[momma_unlimited]

Hmm, I'm not really sure what "type" of discipline that is.. but I have found that a lot depends on my intentions and tone of voice. "If you do this.. then this..." can sometimes be a natural consequence (If you don't put your shoes on, you will not be able to play outside) but is *often* a threat. My son picked up on threats and started threatening me "If you don't snuggle me, I will not go to sleep!" and I realized how horribly unattractive threats are within loving relationships. It really seems quite manipulative if you think about it, right?

Ultimately I prefer to think I am helping my child govern his own will, not imposing my will upon him. In that light, I have found that something like the above shoe warning (if you don't put your shoes on you can't play outside) can be avoided altogether if you approach it differently... for example, "Let's put our shoes on" or "You may put your shoes on now if you want to play outside" or "Would you like some help putting your shoes on or do you want to do it all by yourself?" And even, if you know it is a sore subject, just singing a silly song about it and putting the shoes on for him. Yeah, he *can* do it himself- but sometimes it's not worth forcing the issue and I feel like if I don't make a big deal out of it, in the end, neither will he.

The "if you do it again" thing... still kinda sounds rather threatening. Plus, saying "If you do xyz" gives your child a mental picture of DOING xyz. It almost makes them more focused on it.

On the flip side, a positive instruction (i.e., instead of "don't slam the door", say "please close the door gently") gives them the mental image they need to wrap their will around. Saying "not" to do something to an action oriented little person then requires them to have to change course and stop themself- as if they have reached a dead end- rather than giving them an open window if a door shuts- which a positive instruction will do.

I have found that when my son starts saying "no" to me when I give instructions, I can take it as a sign to back off a little (maybe I've been too bossy lately and he's feeling overwhelmed) or I can ask him how we can work together as a family and get along (he usually has great ideas!). I do always address the fact that he said "No" to an instruction because I think it is rather rude- but first I make sure I didn't phrase it as a question. If I asked "will you please?" or ended a statement with an ",ok?" then in actuality, I have given him permission to answer yes or no and getting mad at him for saying no is not appropriate. It is misleading to phrase an instruction as a question. Hope this helps... these are the communication tips that work in our family on a daily basis.

As far as keeping him sweet... as long as *you* are sweet to him, and expose him to beauty, truth, and goodness- and minimize his exposure to their opposites- I'm sure you will have a sweet little boy!

[MittensKittens]

The "if you don't hold my hand nicely while we are at the mall, you won't get any icecream" type comments would probably be referred to as threat based discipline. Whereas "if you hold my hand nicely, I wil buy you an icecream" is obviously bribery . I have done both, but try to find natural consequences instead. Like "If you aren't able to hold my hand while we are in the store, I'll have to put you in the cart to keep you safe".

[4inMyHeart3inArms]

Well put MittensKittens.

[octobermom]

Originally Posted by MittensKittens

The "if you don't hold my hand nicely while we are at the mall, you won't get any icecream" type comments would probably be referred to as threat based discipline. Whereas "if you hold my hand nicely, I wil buy you an icecream" is obviously bribery . I have done both, but try to find natural consequences instead. Like "If you aren't able to hold my hand while we are in the store, I'll have to put you in the cart to keep you safe".

I agree though sometimes a logical conquence can be firm. I have no issues informing my now 6.5 year old that if I have to chase her because shes not walking with me or holding my hand mommy going to be too tired to stop for icecream latter. This is honest (and I wont say it if it wasn't). Threating/bribing with icecream to get complience though is punitive..

Deanna

[dulce de leche]

One other point is that, as much as possible, it is better to be proactive about teaching and practicing appropriate behavior instead of just react to behavior that you don't like. Play games and talk about the actions that you want to see, so that it is more natural to do that (be polite in restaurants, take turns with his sisters, whatever).

Also, if you can see things deteriorating, and can spot a cause (he's hungry, angry, lonely, tired, bored), dealing with that can often head off any problems.

[EnviroBecca]

I find it's usually more effective to give a consequence without warning. Then, after letting him experience the consequence for a while, sometimes I give a second chance. I know it seems like you ought to warn him of the consequence to "be fair", but that actually takes away from the naturalness of the consequence; "Doing X leads to Y," is a lot easier to understand than, "Doing X enough times to upset Mom +1 leads to Y." And like Momma Unlimited said, "If you do X again..." puts the focus on doing X so that it is hard to resist!

At times when you do warn him of a consequence, try to use "when...then" phrasing instead of "if...then". For example, instead of, "If you don't put away your shoes, then I won't read you a story," say, "When you've put away your shoes, then I will read you a story." The cool thing about this technique is that it makes it so easy to use positive phrasing instead of negative!

Also, there's this Becky Bailey technique (I wrote about it, among other things, here) that works really well sometimes: "You wanted X, so you did Y. You may not do Y. Instead, when you want X, do Z. Try that now." For example, "You wanted to play with the octopus, so you grabbed it from your sister. You may not grab toys. Instead, when you want a toy she is using, say, 'I want a turn with the octopus, please.' Try that now."