My BFF is 30 weeks pregnant with her second, a boy. At the beginning, she was very closed to listening to reasons not to circ, but somehow I managed to push the conversation through, and she started researching it. She's now 'against circumcision, but not as strongly as you! I'm probably going to do it because DH wants to, he thinks if we leave him intact he'll be traumatized by teasing'. I'm 99% sure that she hasn't talked to him about it, because some of the things he said to me last time he was over about circ. (I'm horrid at telling stories so this will be disjointed, sorry). My BFF thinks all the reasons for circing are 'stupid', by the way, which is why I'm pretty sure she hasn't talked to him, cos she can counter all the normal arguments for circ quite easily. She even does it when it comes out in public, she's a better intactavist than I am, and she's not as anti-circ as I am!
Anyway, like I said, initially she wouldn't talk about it at all, I brought up anesthesia as a way to push the argument ('well at least make sure your doctor uses adequate and safe anesthesia') and that opened the door a crack. After a little reading she was very willing to talk to me about it. Finally she decided she was going to not do it at the hospital, cos the doctor wouldn't let her be there to bf him after, but then found out the soonest she could have it done outpatient would be 3 months with general anesthesia. She's talking to her doctor about a way to work around that, but I think she'll end up just having it done at the hospital even if they won't let her in the room. Anyway, her husband was talking about that to me and said 'The doctor even said he couldn't be there for his own son's circ, I'm not sure why she wants to be there, it's not like anything's gonna go wrong' and I looked at him in shock and said 'Circumcision has a 30% complication rate!' and he said 'What? Like, in the US?' and I said 'Yeah, I think it's 30% generally' and he said 'That can't be right, I've seen a ton of guys naked and never seen anything weird' (he's in the army, showers and such). I said 'You know, a lot of complications you can't see til they're erect. My second son's father's circ was too tight, and the skin from his scrotum would get pulled onto his penis when he was erect, and that caused him a lot of pain during intercourse. He also had a lot of sensation loss.' That, of course, was when my dad came in and started talking to him (he didn't realize we were in a conversation I guess) so I didn't get to talk to him further about this. Of course I didn't get a chance to say something like 'And besides, if someone had a horribly botched circ I doubt they'd be really comfortable getting naked in a semi-public setting anyway!'
Anyway, I think if I could talk to her husband about it, give him some information and get him to research, he might be willing to entertain the idea of not doing it, since his wife doesn't want to. But I need info NOW, and in small, factual, easily digestible and researchable bits. Small statements of facts, preferably by doctors or at least medical professionals. Not something to fully educate him, but to get him on the path, even if he doesn't walk it. PLEASE PLEASE do not tell me 'I couldn't be best friends with someone who would do that to their child.' I can, ok? She's been there for me through a lot of horrible stuff and supported me 100%. She puts up with my obnoxiousness on a daily basis and she is a wonderful person. She cut my baby's cord. Anyway, I think the best information would be to counter the hygeine/health myths, something about complication rate (including death), something about the decline of RIC in the US, and if anyone can think of anything good to add? He's coming to work on my house this week so I need to have it done by then, if possible. I was thinking I could just say something along the lines of "You know, there's no reason to circumcise your son as an infant without a medical problem, here's some information on it. I have two intact boys, they don't look weird, no problems with hygiene and they've never had an infection. It was great that I never had to worry about changing dressings on an open wound at the same time as a messy blow-out diaper, and I never had to worry about them being in pain while recovering from genital surgery in the first few weeks of their life." and then handing him some papers on it.
Any help much appreciated
.
Anyway, like I said, initially she wouldn't talk about it at all, I brought up anesthesia as a way to push the argument ('well at least make sure your doctor uses adequate and safe anesthesia') and that opened the door a crack. After a little reading she was very willing to talk to me about it. Finally she decided she was going to not do it at the hospital, cos the doctor wouldn't let her be there to bf him after, but then found out the soonest she could have it done outpatient would be 3 months with general anesthesia. She's talking to her doctor about a way to work around that, but I think she'll end up just having it done at the hospital even if they won't let her in the room. Anyway, her husband was talking about that to me and said 'The doctor even said he couldn't be there for his own son's circ, I'm not sure why she wants to be there, it's not like anything's gonna go wrong' and I looked at him in shock and said 'Circumcision has a 30% complication rate!' and he said 'What? Like, in the US?' and I said 'Yeah, I think it's 30% generally' and he said 'That can't be right, I've seen a ton of guys naked and never seen anything weird' (he's in the army, showers and such). I said 'You know, a lot of complications you can't see til they're erect. My second son's father's circ was too tight, and the skin from his scrotum would get pulled onto his penis when he was erect, and that caused him a lot of pain during intercourse. He also had a lot of sensation loss.' That, of course, was when my dad came in and started talking to him (he didn't realize we were in a conversation I guess) so I didn't get to talk to him further about this. Of course I didn't get a chance to say something like 'And besides, if someone had a horribly botched circ I doubt they'd be really comfortable getting naked in a semi-public setting anyway!'
Anyway, I think if I could talk to her husband about it, give him some information and get him to research, he might be willing to entertain the idea of not doing it, since his wife doesn't want to. But I need info NOW, and in small, factual, easily digestible and researchable bits. Small statements of facts, preferably by doctors or at least medical professionals. Not something to fully educate him, but to get him on the path, even if he doesn't walk it. PLEASE PLEASE do not tell me 'I couldn't be best friends with someone who would do that to their child.' I can, ok? She's been there for me through a lot of horrible stuff and supported me 100%. She puts up with my obnoxiousness on a daily basis and she is a wonderful person. She cut my baby's cord. Anyway, I think the best information would be to counter the hygeine/health myths, something about complication rate (including death), something about the decline of RIC in the US, and if anyone can think of anything good to add? He's coming to work on my house this week so I need to have it done by then, if possible. I was thinking I could just say something along the lines of "You know, there's no reason to circumcise your son as an infant without a medical problem, here's some information on it. I have two intact boys, they don't look weird, no problems with hygiene and they've never had an infection. It was great that I never had to worry about changing dressings on an open wound at the same time as a messy blow-out diaper, and I never had to worry about them being in pain while recovering from genital surgery in the first few weeks of their life." and then handing him some papers on it.
Any help much appreciated
.
