Bisexual while married... - Page 2

[Mama.Pajama]

Originally Posted by MagnusMoss

This is VERY unfair to your husband. If you honestly don't care what kind of genitals your partner has, you should be happy with your husband. A long term relationship means picking one "flavour" anyway.

I don't think it's unfair. I have never had an intimate experience with a woman before, so that part of my libido has never been unlocked. I do not insist that it is indeed necessary for me to experience this in order for me to thrive as a human being- I merely pose the question, "What if..." After all, we only have this one life to live, and it would be a shame to not live it to its widest and richest potential (and then some).

Originally Posted by MagnusMoss

A husand that married you and had a kid with you expecting a real marriage may not be happy with a "partnership". This is a vry cruel "bait and switch". It would be different if he knew what he was getting going in to this. The idea of sex as a way to further your development as a human being is narcissitic and infantile.

I don't know of any infants who are interested in expressing their sexuality... Perhaps you meant "immature?"
My husband is an extremely intelligent and headstrong human being- it seems that you are getting the idea that he's just agreeing to my desires to hang on to me. This couldn't be farther than the truth- upon first mentioning my bisexuality to him (quite awhile ago), he fervently encouraged me to explore, i.e. pursue an "encounter," for my own sexually expressive benefit. Then, I adamantly declined- I was all too familiar with the pain of "cheating" from my own family history... But now that I think about it, it wasn't the "cheating," i.e. the physical relationship between my father and another, it was the violent, anti-communicative, destructive, distrusting, malicious relationship between my parents. The "cheating" was a mere blip on the radar compared to these things- but it was easy for us all to have "one thing" to demonize my father for and lay on the blame for our family's dysfunction. What I am saying is that my own feelings about "cheating" were misplaced, as I was playing out the roles of my own parents in my mind for my husband and I: doing so dooms any committed relationship.

Originally Posted by MagnusMoss

If you want to experiment, I would suggest a "menage a trois" or finding a bi women interested in both you and your husband, and "share" her. You say you are uncomfortable with this? That is precisly why this is a good (or at least marginally less bad) idea. You dating a women WILL make your husband uncomfortable, and at the very least you should "share the pain". From what you say, I suspect if you had a "one on one" relationship with a women, you would become emotionally attached. That would destroy your marriage. A "menage a trois" would at least inhibit that from happening, and make sure your husband gets SOMETHING out of this. You can't expect him to placidly smile and stay with you while you cheat on him. Even those who say they are OK with that are often not.

I understand that you are presuming that what I was intending by posting this was to essentially "ask permission" to "cheat" on my husband with women. This isn't the case. It sounds like your ideal of marriage is very mainstream and your perception of people who reject that ideal is one of presumption and misunderstanding. The moment you let go of the equation of love=ownership, you will transcend the default mode of American morality.

Originally Posted by MagnusMoss

Please, whatever you do, try to THINK about how others around you feel. Not how you think they should feel or how the "poly community" says they should feel. Try to use what you know about men in general and them in particular. Think about your husband and son, and try to run "scenarios" about how this will turn out. Talk to your husband. I find women who get too lost in introspection loose the ability to see how others feel. (Women complain about men being insensitive...but you talked about your feeling that you aren't that interested in men with your husband? And you didn't think about how this would affect him emotionally? And he was OK with it? And you didn't thank god for your luck, and for that understanding man?

You wouldn't believe how open my husband has been to me. After a couple of years of marriage, he told me he doesn't believe in marriage and that no one should eternally chain themselves to another human being, since we are by nature constantly evolving organisms. This was hard to take- to hear the person you had "eternally chained" yourself, not to mention had a child with, say he doesn't value matrimony is extremely hard to swallow. But after honestly exploring my feelings, I realized that I was simply hanging on to an archetype- I needed to embrace our relationship as an individual relationship bound by our own individual standards and expectations rather than hold us up to some puritanical, out-of-touch ideal.

By the way, we are Atheists, so we can thank ourselves.

[aubreymalee]

I am not sure what is right for you and your husband, but I can tell you what has worked for us. We have only had three-somes with another woman. This has given us a chance to have the open communication that is necessary for any of this to work. There is also less jealousy I think, because everyone is present. We like this, it is fun. I get more emotionally involved with people (just my nature) but that seems to work out for us.

We're now in the process of working out my having a girlfriend. I'm not sure how it will work out. DH, Other Woman, Her Husband, and I are just letting things go as they will. I know what I want, but if someone has a problem with me jumping her bones, then we won't. Every single person in this has veto power and their opinion will be respected. I have enough drama in my life without asking for more.

(But, I really want to jump her bones, a whole lot!)

[bjorker]

I haven't read this whole thread, but wanted to suggest to the OP to run a search in this sub-forum. There's been multiple threads on this subject in the past that you may find helpful.

FWIW, I relate with everything that you wrote in your original post.

[tatangel19]

Originally Posted by Mama.Pajama

I had a big wordy post, but my internet just saved you all from having to read it.

In short, my husband and I have had a marital epiphany- we officially reject the American puritanical model of marriage, i.e. a binding contract between 2 heterosexual, monogamous people with inflexible "rules". We recognize that following this model (and basing our expectations of our partners on it) is the crux of the failure of almost (or more than, depending on the study you cite) half of the marriages in our country. The puritanical ideal does not serve human beings, who are by nature constantly changing and evolving organisms. We must not have inflexibility- we must have flexibility, as in any relationship. We must not place unreasonable expectations on each other. Why is the marriage the only place where otherwise open-minded people suddenly close up? It's the taboo-zone that almost all of us unknowingly subscribe to- we all agree that marriage means one thing, and that we can't interpret it on an individual level, like it rightly should be!

Anyway, we have decided that we are reinventing the wheel in our own marriage by absolving the "rules" of society, and following our own path together, come what may.

In response to PPs, I will definitely check out the poly thread.
I will say that I don't feel comfortable with having an intimate relationship between more than 2 people (one of the 2 being me), but I am open to the possibility of having one with an additional person. But just that fact that I'm open to it doesn't guarantee it'll happen, since the last thing I'll be doing is pursuing a new relationship. I suppose it's more like "if it falls in my lap", you know?

Thank you everyone for the responses.
I'd love to hear from a married woman in an "open" relationship!

I am a married woman in an open relationship!!!

[udonandbroth]

I haven't read all of the replies but just wanted to say that I am in a similar situation as Mama Pajama except I have done a lot of exploring with both genders and it's conflicting. We're hanging out in the straight world and everyone assumes we're straight and for me, at least, it's weird because that's not how I Identify myself but at the same time it's so easy to not come out (esp. to school playground moms and neighbors and stuff, like they really don't need to know that about me) I'm out to all close friends and of course, dh, But yeah, it's easy to feel isolated when most other bi's decide to hang out in the straight world. So I can sympathize because like, for example I'll check out girls on the beach (and guys) but I'll never say anything to my husband because we've usually got the kids with us. He's cool with it, though. One thing that has helped me to feel ok about my 'deviant' jk side is to read bi fiction and nonfiction (Living Two Lives, for one) and I am a huge fan of Savage Love, Dan Savage's sex/relationship advice column. He's gay, a father and just so matter of fact, insightful and sex-positive. HTH

[Mama.Pajama]

Originally Posted by tatangel19

I am a married woman in an open relationship!!!

Well awesome! Lol
How does it work for you?

Originally Posted by udonandbroth

I haven't read all of the replies but just wanted to say that I am in a similar situation as Mama Pajama except I have done a lot of exploring with both genders and it's conflicting. We're hanging out in the straight world and everyone assumes we're straight and for me, at least, it's weird because that's not how I Identify myself but at the same time it's so easy to not come out (esp. to school playground moms and neighbors and stuff, like they really don't need to know that about me) I'm out to all close friends and of course, dh, But yeah, it's easy to feel isolated when most other bi's decide to hang out in the straight world. So I can sympathize because like, for example I'll check out girls on the beach (and guys) but I'll never say anything to my husband because we've usually got the kids with us. He's cool with it, though. One thing that has helped me to feel ok about my 'deviant' jk side is to read bi fiction and nonfiction (Living Two Lives, for one) and I am a huge fan of Savage Love, Dan Savage's sex/relationship advice column. He's gay, a father and just so matter of fact, insightful and sex-positive. HTH

I will definitely try to check out Living Two Lives and Google Dan Savage.. I think I actually just read a book that had an essay of his in it maybe? It was called One Big Happy Family .

Sometimes I just find myself really ambivalent about my situation, probably because I am unsure of what "expectations" my husband has. Before, it seemed as if everything was clear. Now, I'm not so sure... It's me feeling guilty for wanting to love more than one person, I think. There's just no way for me, personally, to explore without risking falling in love. I'm just too emotional! My perfect scenario is to have my husband and to have a girlfriend... and it may be unrealistic. All I do know is that there is a part of me that really desires more than DH, as a man, can provide. Not "instead," but "more"... I want to be dually fulfilled. And may I be burned at the stake for feeling so.

[NoliMum]

Originally Posted by Mama.Pajama

All I do know is that there is a part of me that really desires more than DH, as a man, can provide. Not "instead," but "more"... I want to be dually fulfilled. And may I be burned at the stake for feeling so.

I think this is a common problem for many, regardless of gender or sexuality. I think monogamy is an option, but just an option. Among many others.

Think of all the classic literature written about this subject. Wasn't this the basis of Wuthering Heights? Or maybe I'm thinking of a different novel.... but seriously. Just think of how many "torn between two" love stories that have been written. You are not the only person to have ever felt this way, and certainly not the only person to feel guilty about it!!

[Sharlla]

Originally Posted by zonapellucida

Have you though of a menage a trois?

DP and I are a big fan I can also have girlfriends but haven't met anyone lately that I like.

[Mama.Pajama]

Originally Posted by NoliMum

I think this is a common problem for many, regardless of gender or sexuality. I think monogamy is an option, but just an option. Among many others.

Think of all the classic literature written about this subject. Wasn't this the basis of Wuthering Heights? Or maybe I'm thinking of a different novel.... but seriously. Just think of how many "torn between two" love stories that have been written. You are not the only person to have ever felt this way, and certainly not the only person to feel guilty about it!!

I don't have an overwhelming desire to be with other men. Honestly, my level of desire for another man could barely register- it's virtually non-existent. I notice women, though. It's weird. I think it's probably exacerbated by the non-existence of intimate experience with women. But as of this moment, it is my best friend whom I want, and for a long time have (on & off) wanted. It's love with a woman that I want in addition to DH... So it's no so much "torn between two" if you can understand.

[NoliMum]

Originally Posted by Mama.Pajama

I don't have an overwhelming desire to be with other men. Honestly, my level of desire for another man could barely register- it's virtually non-existent. I notice women, though. It's weird. I think it's probably exacerbated by the non-existence of intimate experience with women. But as of this moment, it is my best friend whom I want, and for a long time have (on & off) wanted. It's love with a woman that I want in addition to DH... So it's no so much "torn between two" if you can understand.

No no no, that's not what I meant at all. I know that you are not interested in other men. I read your whole thread. What I mean is that it's normal to have the capacity to love more than one person, and unfortunately our culture has forced us into choosing only one, causing every party undue amounts of pain. That is the theme throughout literature- men, women, whatever- that I'm talking about. Why do we continue to torture ourselves in this way, using "love" and "ownership" interchangeably, so that once you declare your love for one person, it isn't allowed to be shared with anyone else?

That's where the "torn between two" comes in- culture is forcing us to tear ourselves apart.

[udonandbroth]

I have noticed that sometimes I am really into girls then other times I'm boy crazy. Then other times I just don't think about either. It's funny how sexuality can be so fluid, esp. for women. One thing I have also noticed is that as I get older my own needs and desires become more clear. I love getting older.. know thyself and all.

We haven't had menage a trios but we're both interested in the idea (also interested in a friend but I'm pretty sure she doesn't bend that way). So the search continues.

[Mama.Pajama]

Originally Posted by NoliMum

What I mean is that it's normal to have the capacity to love more than one person, and unfortunately our culture has forced us into choosing only one, causing every party undue amounts of pain. That is the theme throughout literature- men, women, whatever- that I'm talking about. Why do we continue to torture ourselves in this way, using "love" and "ownership" interchangeably, so that once you declare your love for one person, it isn't allowed to be shared with anyone else?

That's where the "torn between two" comes in- culture is forcing us to tear ourselves apart.

We're certainly on the same page about this then. What a Utopia I dream of living in, where everyone rejects love=ownership equation. It's not some juvenile ideal relative to "free love;" it's simply accepting the fact that one person indeed has the capacity to love more than one person, without anyone getting hurt!

Originally Posted by udonandbroth

It's funny how sexuality can be so fluid, esp. for women.

I totally agree with this. It feels so natural for me to want my husband and my friend, even though the Official Rule Book of my collective mind wags a finger at my desires.

I just finished the book The Hours by Micheal Cunningham, wherein the character of Mrs. Brown (married with a 3 year old and expecting a second child) kisses her female friend and feels naturally at ease with her ability to desire and love both her husband and her friend; how her feelings are described really connected with my own feelings... Too bad it's not "okay" to feel this way about love and desire.

[missme]

I think it's amazing that you're exploring and communicating with your partner and yourself. The world is so big and amazing, and everyone's experience of it is different. Do what brings you joy and peace.

and p.s. I'm a single lesbian (gold star, no less!), so my story doesn't relate really, but...until i slept with a woman, i had a sense that I was missing something fundamental to my being. My first experience was like coming home...i felt like i had been born to make love to women... and it satisfied something really deep inside. Even if I never have another girlfriend (lol...i'm pessimistic) I know that I treasure that feeling.

[uzra_hashmi@rediff]

I discovered my full blown bi-sexuality only after marriage. In college I had a little more than 'attraction' towards a few girl friends but that remained confined to sending cards and giving flowers off and on and wrting poems about each other. But after marriage, in spite of a normal healthy life, return of the girl friends of college sparked the whole fire. She became a divorcee and started living single. I began seeing more and more of her that soon led to full fledged sex between us. Since then we have not looked back. Yet still, two more affairs with girl friends got developed at the same pitch and we are a close group of four. Two of us are married and have children too. We belong to different religious systems also. However, I have kept this aspect a secret from my DH as, I am sure, he would neither appreciate nor tolerate it. I am having three bio-children and sometimes wonder how long my bi-sexual affairs (actually the lesbian aspect of it) can continue. For the present, there does not seem to be any problem except the care in maintaining secrecy about the nature of relationships with the three girl friends.
Some have likened bi-sexuality that is the theme of this thread to poly relationship, which is not strictly true. Perhaps poly means much more openness and better understanding and there are different shades of the arrangements init involving numbers and ranging from close poly (limited fidelity) to fully open and flexible relationship. At home, I am the second wife of my husband and (being a Muslim) we three are living together as properly married wives and one husband. I never have had sexual relationship with my co-wife although we don't have any physical privacy from each other and have been in cross-nursing relationship involving children right from the beginning. Any disturbance in the arrangement at home will be devastating for the entire family.
Uzra

[Mama.Pajama]

Uzra, your perspective is incredibly interesting. The dynamic of the circumstances of your bisexuality while married to a man is different from my own, and I've gleaned a broader understanding of this by hearing from you.

I agree that poly has been equated with being a married bisexual in this thread, and not rightly so, because several women who posted weren't "out" to their husbands- it's a secret, because it has to be.
This is probably juvenile, but your secret relationships with these women sounds so... adventurous.
For you, is it difficult maintaining that secrecy?

[heket]

I'm bi, plain and simple. I dislike when it's dismissed.

Sorry, I'm not poly or group oriented. That not me. I like monogamy with with either sex. But I'm not into sharing. Either I'm with my hubby or with my girl. That's just how we roll.

What always kill me is the dismissal of being bisexual as if it's a phase or exploratory stage. Guess what? For some, it's not. Sometimes a person can be happy being the middle of the road, literally. Why is that any less than a hetro- or homo- sexual couple? Oh wait... because bi women don't know what they want. Or is it bi women decided when they married a man. Or could it be that they are just lesbians trapped in a hetro-, married relationship.

Whatever.

I'm bi. I have been. I married a man I dearly love. But that doesn't make my girlfriend any less of a being or my relationships anymore "confused." It's just the way things are.

[writteninkursive]

Hi! I just wanted to add my two cents here, since my situation (if you can call it that) is a lot like yours, only without the worry.
I don't consider myself bisexual, although I don't really consider anyone "straight". I'm of the opinion that any human being can derive sexual pleasure from any other human being of any gender. I think it's only societal that we have put terms to sexuality and made guidelines and such.
I don't have a desire to have a "relationship", per se, with another woman. Just sex. I find girls sexually attractive and the majority of my fantasies involve other females. The most I've done sexually with another girl is kissing and some mild breastplay.
I've been really honest with myself and those I love (not including my parents and that part of my family, because it really doesn't matter what they think) about my sexuality. I see nothing wrong with finding people attractive - male or female!
My DP and I have discussed our sexuality long before we were ever together. We were good friends and the subject came up, and we've addressed it many times. He finds himself to be completely straight (although he can admit that he could probably derive pleasure from another guy in the right circumstance and he has fantasies that involve a threesome with me and another male). I have told him in no uncertain terms that at some point in my life, I will probably need to experiment sexually with a female. He is not against the idea, if it's something I want to do. I don't want to do it without him present, (because I think part of the arousal for me may be him being turned on by it!) but I would enjoy it if he were to watch. His participation as more than an observer would be gradual, as I'm not sure how my feelings would be in that situation.
I live a very experience-oriented life, and I can hardly see myself growing old and dying only ever experiencing sexuality with a man! I love men, don't get me wrong. If I had to choose a guy or girl, I would undoubtedly choose a man. I enjoy relationships with men. But I don't have to choose! : And having an understanding DP who I've been very honest with about everything makes it all that much easier!
The question for me was always, what constitutes one as bisexual? I don't desire the relationship. I just want the sexual fulfillment. So I count myself firmly in the bi-curious/non-relationship bisexual category. Lol.
I don't think there's any need at all to give up your marriage or even worry about that because of these feelings! I think more communication between your husband and yourself is in order, and I bet you anything he won't be threatened. He thinks it's "hot"... probably because it is, and I think it's pretty natural too! Maybe having him watch you and another girl would be enough to satisfy you without going all hardcore relationship-with-other-couples, and without being threatening to you or him?
To the poster who is gay and can't have biological kids because of that... it sucks that you're so unhappy, but I find your post to be way out of line. Clearly you are bitter with the choices you've made. That is no reason to demean someone else who made a choice you wish you had made. It's never too late to get out of the relationship you don't want and try a different one - with someone of a different gender than you, if you want!

[Mama.Pajama]

heket, what you said about being bisexual but not poly is interesting. I can see myself the way you are, namely because when I think about me being "poly," I can't see beyond just adding a girlfriend to my life. Just one girlfriend. If you don't consider yourself poly even though you are in a relationship with two people, and your relationships are monogamous with each, what would one call that? Biamorous? I can relate to the way your desire functions though, as if there are two reservoirs, one for male-oriented desire and one for female, and they are normally independent of one another, i.e. even when in a fulfilling relationship with a man, the desire for a woman remains. It must be nice to have both reservoirs filled and not wanting. You are living the dream, heket.

writteninkursive, I appreciate your input. I agree with the opinion you posed about the gay poster who cannot have children- it sounded like she was venting bitterness.

Previously I felt similarly to you, in that I thought my feelings were simply sexual, but as I have gotten closer to engaging, I have discovered that I am incapable of separating sex from emotions. In me, they are intrinsically linked, sex and love- one wouldn't happen without at least a risk of the other. So I suppose that adds a more complex dimension to my desire. The idea of juggling two loves at once seems overwhelming to me, even though I clearly possess the capacity.

We have talked flippantly about having a threesome, but honestly, we aren't the types to hunt for a willing candidate. So basically, if it (or she) fell in our laps, I think we'd both be open to the experience. Just not sure how I'd feel about him penetrating another girl, or kissing, for that matter... If I think about it, it sounds hot, but when I really think about it, I don't know. Sometimes I just feel like I want a monogamous relationship with each gender, like heket. But if this isn't realistic in my own marriage, so be it. I will survive... But I will still fantasize about women, dammit.

[serenekitten]

Originally Posted by Mama.Pajama

If you don't consider yourself poly even though you are in a relationship with two people, and your relationships are monogamous with each, what would one call that?

I still call that poly. But maybe I'm just weird.

[ErikaG]

Originally Posted by serenekitten

I still call that poly. But maybe I'm just weird.

I would too, but I think I'd go with polyfidelitous rather than polyamorous.