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Is this common? - Page 6

post #101 of 160
Quote:
Now I live in a city with a smaller number of Mexicans and I live on the "white" side of town. Mexicans here are assimilated into the American culture which I'm trying to do myself. When the subject came up at work a couple people agreed so I wondered if it was common. Where I come from kids aren't dropped off for "me" time. I was taken care of after school and summers by my grandparents but mom picked me up right after work. I went everywhere Dr appointments, haircuts, shopping, worksites with my grandparents.
OP, I've been following this thread but didn't really attempt to comment because I didn't know what type of culture or cultural thing you were referring to...but now it makes much more sense.

I can only speak from my own experience and perhaps that of my parents, but I have seen a lot of resistance to the presence of kids in a wide variety of places. I live in a big city, so maybe it is different in more rural areas, but generally, parents are discouraged from bringing their kids to the doctor's or dentist's office, hair cutting places, certain restaurants, etc. Not saying that there are rules posted outside the offices, just saying that I have that perception. I'm not particularly excited about having my child in the doctor's office while I'm having a GYN exam, and the last time I was at the dentist, I was in so much pain that there was no way I could have watched my child whilst getting an extraction. People who work in many doctor's offices and the like tend to get annoyed in having to watch someone else's kid while they are doing their own job. I can understand that to an extent...it's not what they are paid to do.

When I do see people bring their kids to doctor's offices, etc., they are almost always accompanied by a spouse or a grandparent or a friend...someone who can watch the children during the exam or meeting. I have zero family in this city, so if DH can't assist with these issues, I have to find someone else. This is rare, as I try to do everything like this during my work hours. My parents have their own lives, and their attitude is that they raised their kids and now they can do what they want to do. Nothing wrong with that, but the concept of extended family, grandparents, etc. is almost non-existant in my life. That makes me pretty sad.

Now knowing a teeny, tiny little bit more about where you are coming from culturally-wise, I assume that a lot of emphasis is placed on extended family. And, I think that perhaps in Mexican culture and other non-US-type cultures, kids are more valued as part of the community. All you have to do is go on other non-MDC forums (parental and non-parental) and hear the complaining and whining about other peoples' kids. There is an overwhelming sense of self-entitlement in this society...as in...get your kid out of my face! It's like, if someone can hear a crying baby over the music on their I-Pod, then you've invaded their imagined "constitutional right" to space and silence in public settings. I'm saying this tongue and cheek (partially) but living around a lot of people day in and day out has led me to a lot of such conclusions!
post #102 of 160
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Originally Posted by not now View Post
Huh, didn't know my question would spiral into a "discussion." I hate when this happens on MDC, people accusing others of not understanding where they are coming from bla, bla, bla. Accusations of judgement. This is also why I don't post often, I love the message of the community as a whole but man things get out of hand sometimes.

Call me jugemental if you will I couldn't care less. I know my intentions, it was an honest question.
Communication is a two-way street. If you (general sense) don't want a discussion, better to not start it. If not one, but, several posters comment on my OP, *I* would step back and think if I could have worded my post in a more clear manner. Now that you have included more details we have a clearer picture of where you are coming from and how child-care was a shared responsibility.
post #103 of 160
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the last time I was at the dentist, I was in so much pain that there was no way I could have watched my child whilst getting an extraction.
My favorite was the time I had my 3 year old and 18month old at the dentist (couldn't get a sitter) and at one point the 18m ds spilled the cheerios and ended up lying at the foot of the dentist chair on my legs However, the dentist and the staff were very gracious and helpful, and I got mine and my child's teeth checked and cleaned. However, for the following cavities I made sure my husband could stay home with them...
post #104 of 160
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Originally Posted by RunnerDuck View Post
I've always wondered if anyone else looked at "Am I that weird?" or "Is this really common?" type threads and saw the actual statement as being, "Behold the ways in which I am both a superior mother yet utterly modest because I am not even aware of it, even though I really am!"

I guess now I know.

.


Even if this isn't one of those threads, there sure are plenty of them!
post #105 of 160
I think taking a "day off" is common and ok. My mom would always take me every where. She does in home daycare, so she was always home. I work from home and take my son everywhere. But usually once a week or once every other week I let my mom watch him so she can have some grandma time and he can play with the other kids, which he really loves. I don't think parents need to be there 24/7. I think its perfectly fine for the grandparents or maybe aunts/uncles have some time with the kids too. I have and will never use a babysitter, like the teenage kids. I always use my parents or my in laws.
post #106 of 160
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Originally Posted by jeminijad View Post


Even if this isn't one of those threads, there sure are plenty of them!
I found that comment a lot less funny than you did and pretty rude.
post #107 of 160
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Originally Posted by seawind View Post
Communication is a two-way street. If you (general sense) don't want a discussion, better to not start it. If not one, but, several posters comment on my OP, *I* would step back and think if I could have worded my post in a more clear manner. Now that you have included more details we have a clearer picture of where you are coming from and how child-care was a shared responsibility.
But this wasn't a discussion it was a "discussion"- you know when people bash and say they are discussing. Hence the quotations.

Thanks for clarifying, OP!
post #108 of 160
It seems this thread has taken a bit of a turn, but I've been thinking about it since I first read it the other day, and when I logged on it was on the front page. So I decided to post late in the game

When I was little, my mom didn't leave us until I was 4 years old, mainly because she couldn't afford a sitter and had no trustworthy free babysitting. Because we had no family or close friends until I was much older, I had major anxiety that my mom would die and I'd be left with no one, or worse - my alcoholic father. I was sick every single day for portions of my young life, until I finally met a youth group leader who I really clicked with. I felt like I finally had a safety net beyond my mom.

Not saying all kids would respond that way, but I hated feeling like all my eggs were in one basket. I didn't want my kids to feel that way. I'm a SAHM, and my kids spend just about every Wednesday evening at my mom's house, and usually one other chunk of time with another grandparent or church friend (all four grandparents are remarried and live close, so that's four sets). They love their time there, and I love that they have so many people who they can depend on. I also LOVE the time to get things done or just to chill. Our extensive and reliable support network is an enormous blessing and I use it often!

*I did always want to keep my babies with me when they were 6 months and under (or so), so I did. When I felt like I wanted to leave them, I did. I'm a better mama for it, believe me!
post #109 of 160
Quote:
But this wasn't a discussion it was a "discussion"- you know when people bash and say they are discussing. Hence the quotations.

Thanks for clarifying, OP!
I don't think there was any bashing. Defensiveness, maybe, as previous posters mentioned, but not bashing. I think what started as an innocent question, evolved into huge assumptions (on both sides of the issue). Like: "yes, it is common...because [insert view]" and "well, if it is common it is because of [insert view] and there's nothing wrong with that!". I do think the original post was very unclear and I was very hesitant to make any comment because honestly, I wasn't able to ascertain if the culture referred to was the culture of AP, the culture arising out of conservative religious practices, culture relating to a specific ethnic upbringing, etc. People often use the term "culture" to describe a wide variety of practices and moral leanings or to take a moral high ground, so I certainly understand if people felt a little prickled.

Point is, the OP clarified and now we can all bring our thoughts and experiences to the table without feeling the need to defend them and validate our own choices.
post #110 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by not now View Post
Where I come from kids aren't dropped off for "me" time. I was taken care of after school and summers by my grandparents but mom picked me up right after work. I went everywhere Dr appointments, haircuts, shopping, worksites with my grandparents.
So....

in Mexican culture, are grandparents supported by their children? Are they generally very old by the time they become grandparents? Or are they able to retire early?

I'm asking seriously, because I know an awful lot of grandparents who are employed full-time. None of my kids' grandparents would have been able to do after-school and summer care for my children. My kids are teenagers and my mom still has a mortgage to pay.
post #111 of 160
well I'm one of the ones who got defensive, because the whole tone seemed to me to be "well I love my children and love spending time with them, so I never leave them with anyone, not even their father, because no one can love them the way I do".

Implication being that anyone who doesn't do that doesn't love their children or love spending time with them.

And words like "dumping" or "more than necessary" or "too much" don't help. I mean who gets to decide if some other mother is spending "too much" time away from her children?

I guess the reason I feel defensive is that I think that an entire side of the argument is discounted - that children are perfectly capable of being happy and content without their mothers' constant presence. (and it doesn't mean that they don't love their mothers or didn't bond properly with them).

My oldest is a teenager and old enough to watch her younger siblings. They are thrilled to death to NOT have to come with me on errands and appointments.

Leaving them at home while I return something to a store, or get my driver's license renewed, or see the dentist, isn't depriving them of my presence and love, it's doing them a big favor. They would much, much rather be at home than sitting on a hard plastic chair at the DMV.

That these errands are easier for me to do without them is a bonus.
post #112 of 160
A lot of what was being said about "too much" etc was just that- about those who do it excessively. Yes it is a good idea to have a break but that doesn't mean it can't be overdone. I think some posters were just scratching their heads at parents who over do it and then there were those who were simply stating they do not and don't understand it- no harm in that. There are plenty of things I don't get and it in no way means I am looking down my nose and those who do it.

Yesterday we moved and my 3 littles went to a friends for a few hours and I was having a mixture of "thank goodness they are gone because this would be impossible with them here!" and "ok they can come home now" Anywho I thought of this thread and I thought of it for a specific reason- my mother lived not a 3 minute walk from us at our old place yet she would not lift a finger to help with the move or the kids (one of the reasons we have decided to cut her out). So we had to get help from church. I can see where this might look odd from the outside- my mom is RIGHT THERE and yet I have another woman taking my kids and others helping. To people close to their family this is odd as I have been told to me it is normal because my mom has always been like this. So I guess from the other side I can see the OPs confusion. I wonder how common it is for granmothers to help out with their grandkids. I scratch my head at it all the time. Do people really do that? Must be nice!
post #113 of 160
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Originally Posted by churndash View Post
well I'm one of the ones who got defensive, because the whole tone seemed to me to be "well I love my children and love spending time with them, so I never leave them with anyone, not even their father, because no one can love them the way I do".

Implication being that anyone who doesn't do that doesn't love their children or love spending time with them.

And words like "dumping" or "more than necessary" or "too much" don't help. I mean who gets to decide if some other mother is spending "too much" time away from her children?

I guess the reason I feel defensive is that I think that an entire side of the argument is discounted - that children are perfectly capable of being happy and content without their mothers' constant presence. (and it doesn't mean that they don't love their mothers or didn't bond properly with them).

My oldest is a teenager and old enough to watch her younger siblings. They are thrilled to death to NOT have to come with me on errands and appointments.

Leaving them at home while I return something to a store, or get my driver's license renewed, or see the dentist, isn't depriving them of my presence and love, it's doing them a big favor. They would much, much rather be at home than sitting on a hard plastic chair at the DMV.

That these errands are easier for me to do without them is a bonus.
And I think tha no one on MDC could or would fault you for leaving the kids at home in that manner for those reasons.
post #114 of 160
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A lot of what was being said about "too much" etc was just that- about those who do it excessively
But "excessively" is a subjective term. That's why it is judgemental to say a mother leaves her child "too much". It's judging someone else's behavior based on what you find acceptable.

What you consider "too much" is not what every other mother would consider "too much".

There are mothers who would say that leaving your child one time is excessive.
post #115 of 160
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Originally Posted by magstphil View Post
A lot of what was being said about "too much" etc was just that- about those who do it excessively. Yes it is a good idea to have a break but that doesn't mean it can't be overdone.
I agree.

Quote:
Originally Posted by churndash View Post
But "excessively" is a subjective term. That's why it is judgemental to say a mother leaves her child "too much". It's judging someone else's behavior based on what you find acceptable.

What you consider "too much" is not what every other mother would consider "too much".
Obviously, people disagree on this, or there would be no discussion. Everyone would leave their children only for amounts of time that others also found acceptable, because everyone would agree on what that meant.

I will say that I do think there's such a thing as "too much" on this topic. When you take someone's child for 3 hours (long walk, playground, picnic), and less than five minutes after you come in the door with him, the mother is telling you that she "never" gets a break from her kid, and wishes someone would take him, so she could have some "me" time, I think that's excessive. (Apparently, she spent half the time he was gone on housework, and half playing cards with friends, neither of which counts as "me time", in her opinion.) I've seen many cases of this kind of thing from the mother in question, and I know her kids very well. They don't think their mother wants them around...because she doesn't. That's excessive. Even if she did want them around, they don't feel like she does, and she makes no effort to change that. (Can you imagine being so wrapped up in an online conversation that, when your 11 year old came home after 10 days and tried to tell you what he'd been doing, you brushed him off?)

IMO, that's excessive. I don't think I've ever met a parent who would disagree. At some point, it's definitely possible to leave your children too much...and if the kids are feeling unwanted, I'd say that point is, at the very least, being approached.
post #116 of 160
: to SB.

I seriously doubt any of the "too much" moms were meaning parents who leave their children to run errands or have some time alone.
post #117 of 160
The vibe I always get from these threads is that those "other" moms are enjoying themselves to much instead of martyring themselves in the currently fashionable way.
post #118 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by choli View Post
The vibe I always get from these threads is that those "other" moms are enjoying themselves to much instead of martyring themselves in the currently fashionable way.
All I can think reading this is "really"? I mean by this logic a mothr has no real role in child's life that can't be filled by someone else and I DO not believe that AT all.
post #119 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by choli View Post
The vibe I always get from these threads is that those "other" moms are enjoying themselves to much instead of martyring themselves in the currently fashionable way.
I can understand that, but...I do think some parents are away from their kids too much, and I'm no martyr. I joined a choir when ds2 was only 14 months old - and still nursing. That required being away from him for over two hours, at bedtime, one night a week. I don't think that's a big deal or that I'm a horrible mom or anything. Heck - I went back to work when ds1 was only 5 months old, and was away from him all day. So, it's not like I think a child is going to wither away if mom isn't around.

Mind you, it's easier for me than a lot of moms, because I really don't have many things I want to do that necessitate being away from my kids. My favourite recreational activity is reading, and I can do that on the couch while my kids play. If I really loved to go out dancing or clubbing or something, that would be a lot more difficult.
post #120 of 160
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Originally Posted by sisteeesmama View Post
All I can think reading this is "really"? I mean by this logic a mothr has no real role in child's life that can't be filled by someone else and I DO not believe that AT all.
That logic does not relate to what I said at all.

Some of my best memories from childhood were the times I spent with my godmother or godfather or other babysitters. I gained a lot from those interactions and I never missed my parents when I was with others, though I loved my parents very much. My kids gain a lot from interactions with other adults, and I don't feel that it is detrimental at all for kids to have attachments to people outside the immediate family. It's certainly better for kids than having a burned out resentful mother.
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