parenting, to each their own or up for debate? - Page 4

[2pinks]

Unless there is "real" neglect I mind my own business. I don't like people giving me parenting advice so I don't do it to others.

I will correct any misinformation that is out there, especially irt breastfeeding and car seat safety.

[1littlebit]

lol i should have put car seat safety too! thats a minor thing for some people and a huge issue for others. i think there is more misinformation out there about carseat safety then any other parenting issue combined.. and that one is sort of a biggie.

[SunshineJ]

I tend to mind my own business. Oh before I had kids I *knew* exactly what was right and how to parent. And I was sure in those beliefs until I had 2 children that broke darn near every rule and provided proof to just about every exception out there! For example breastfeeding only? Sounds great until no one knows your child is tongue tied before 19 months and he can't nurse and will starve unless you feed him formula. Add in a major infection from the c/s incision with non-bf friendly meds (because he's already on formula, who goes back to bf?) and yeah, that didn't happen. Not to mention a medical condition that would've landed me in the hospital if DH couldn't have taken some of the feeding turns when ds was literally awake every hour and a half for the first 7 weeks hysterical with hunger! But thanks to those who saw fit to harrass and condemn me for months later!

If I'm specifically asked I'll provide my perspective but you know, I don't know what people are going through, what their situation is, what issues they may or may not be facing and what impact my unsolicited judgement will have on them. And unless their child is in iminent danger, it's none of my business.

[transylvania_mom]

I think all these subjects can be discussed in a respectful manner and everyone could benefit from it. Maybe except CIO and spanking, which I see as being abusive and for which I don't see any arguments.

But I would have appreciated if someone approached me while I was wearing ds (I didn't know how to use my sling and gave up very quickly); I would also appreciate a good discussion on vaccinations (ds is fully vaccinated and although I've read some articles and Dr Sears's book, I would still have him vaccinated, but I'd listen to a different opinion with an open mind).

Oh, and also I had no idea that I could have kept ds RF longer than one year, I thought I was required to turn his carseat FF.

And I'd also like to think that I had some positive influence on my cousins and friends who had babies and breastfed them for one year each. So not all parenting advice is negative. If I don't like it, I don't follow it. Once I was complaining about my 1 y/o terrible sleep habits and I had a playgroup supervisor tell me to CIO, I just replied, sorry, this is not an option for us, and the discussion remained civil.

[battymama]

The only 2 i put where cio and spanking as these are abusive. However i dont berate or judge others i try and lead by example I think if i am gentle and loving and respectful to both other adults and children and my own child then it will hopefully rub off

[4inMyHeart3inArms]

If I were a mom who had her car seat in wrong I know I personally would like for someone to point it out to me and help me get it right. I don't mind when people share opinions on aything really, I just only take the advice if its going to be safer for my child. If someone things I should hit my child of course Im not going to take their advice because I refuse to intentionally abuse my child in any way for any purpose.

[1littlebit]

i see people all the time who don't have their car seats in correctly or aren't using them at all... i always wonder if they know.. but disagree or they just don't realize. i am not a huge fan of the "its only a few minutes we don't need a car seat" thing and i know some people are... so i don't usually say anything b/c i worry they will just blow me off.

[1littlebit]

people always tell me to turn DS around.. apparently there is no need for him to be RF and he would be better if he were FF and not so squished ... ok?

[benj]

I get enough crap from other people as it is, it's much easier just to mind my own business. Lazy/indifferent maybe, but I don't need it.

[1littlebit]

Originally Posted by benj

I get enough crap from other people as it is, it's much easier just to mind my own business. Lazy/indifferent maybe, but I don't need it.

i'm sorry people drive you nuts. you could do what i do and wear headphones whenever possible (books on tape.. ) or try and look surly.

don't combine the headphones and the surliness though or people will apparently think you are a criminal. <--- this is courtesy of my best friends little brother.. and mine for all intents and purposes. he's probably wrong though. people think he's a criminal b/c its true... the only time headphones have anything to do with it is when they find a stolen pair stuffed down his pants.

i don't comment when i know people are just going to argue, or when they obviously think they are right. sometimes i ask them if they just want to spout their own advice or if they intend to listen to my response. i have very little patience for people who want to talk to me but don't want to listen when i disagree with them.

[Tigerchild]

Why do you feel the need to get into an "argument" or "debate" with anyone over parenting?

Honestly, when you feel a burning desire to get into an argument or debate with anyone over anything, generally you're not going to change anyone's mind because you are taking a combative, aggressive stance from the start.

When was the last time, honestly, that someone being aggressive and combative made you change your mind about something rather than make you just want to circle the wagons and tell them to shove off?

I don't find parenting a taboo subject in our culture. We have tons of magazines devoted to parenting. It's a constant subject on message boards and TV shows. Turn on any given news talk station, and you will hear a ton of people complaining about other people's parenting, and how if only we did things <insert philosophy of choice>, then everyone's kids would be smarter/nicer/ethical/blah blah blah.

I DO think that people become very defensive when talking about parenting because they are surrounded with a culture that attacks and berates and picks apart every single thing that you do in raising children. Parenting has become a huge one-upsmanship game, from the mommy wars to arguing if the good parents are really bad and the bad parents are really good.

Some people really don't like to debate. Generally those people don't like to talk about ANYTHING debatable, from politics to religion to parenting. Some of the people who love to talk about those things a lot probably should shut up occasionally when impassioned, lest they stick their foot in their mouth up to their butt cheek (I feel empowered to say that because I have stuck my foot in my mouth even further).

Parenting is not a "taboo" subject--but it IS one where most people really don't care to hear opinions/practices different from their own. In my opinion, there is a BIG difference.

[lovebug]

Originally Posted by 1littlebit

this one is hard for me too. i would definitely say something to someone trying to hit their kid in front of me... but mostly just that i don't think its necessary and if they insist on doing it to go elsewhere. i struggled with this b/c people say it to BFing mamas and i think its horrible.. but i decided that it is different b/c everyone eats and people should get over it. but no one should have to watch unnecessary violence.

my superficial reason if asked is b/c i think it is wrong and unnecessary. if pushed a bit further i will say that if you hit your spouse its domestic violence, if you hit your neighbor its assault, if you hit your dog it is animal cruelty but if you hit your kid its discipline. the first three you will get a fine at the very least and jail time at worst...a whole bunch of jail time for a repeat offender.

my reasons for why it is unnecessary and detrimental from a discipline point of view are more complex and i rarely go into it with people i am not close too. i have talked to close friends about it and talked most of them out of their pro spanking mindset (the first one if pg now so it was hypothetical before..which as it turns out it a lot easier) the ones whose parents hit them even beyond what could be considered *reasonable* spanking convinced the ones that i couldn't convince with pure logic. this all came up when i got pg...

i agree!

here is my view- if i was never shown MDC or the ideas that are here i would prob have done a lot of what is on the list. my mom and dad are very AP in a way however society is NOT that way and truly we learn more from that then our parents had i not ran into MDC and all you awesome mamas i would be as mainstream and the next!

so THANK GOT! because it all make so much sense!

[1littlebit]

Originally Posted by Tigerchild

Why do you feel the need to get into an "argument" or "debate" with anyone over parenting?

Honestly, when you feel a burning desire to get into an argument or debate with anyone over anything, generally you're not going to change anyone's mind because you are taking a combative, aggressive stance from the start.

When was the last time, honestly, that someone being aggressive and combative made you change your mind about something rather than make you just want to circle the wagons and tell them to shove off?

I don't find parenting a taboo subject in our culture. We have tons of magazines devoted to parenting. It's a constant subject on message boards and TV shows. Turn on any given news talk station, and you will hear a ton of people complaining about other people's parenting, and how if only we did things <insert philosophy of choice>, then everyone's kids would be smarter/nicer/ethical/blah blah blah.

I DO think that people become very defensive when talking about parenting because they are surrounded with a culture that attacks and berates and picks apart every single thing that you do in raising children. Parenting has become a huge one-upsmanship game, from the mommy wars to arguing if the good parents are really bad and the bad parents are really good.

Some people really don't like to debate. Generally those people don't like to talk about ANYTHING debatable, from politics to religion to parenting. Some of the people who love to talk about those things a lot probably should shut up occasionally when impassioned, lest they stick their foot in their mouth up to their butt cheek (I feel empowered to say that because I have stuck my foot in my mouth even further).

Parenting is not a "taboo" subject--but it IS one where most people really don't care to hear opinions/practices different from their own. In my opinion, there is a BIG difference.

i don't think anyone thinks being aggressive is a good idea. and it is def. taboo to have an opinion on parenting. we are supposed to accept what others do without comment. fine for most things but spanking and Circ are hard to stomach

plus as i said up thread i wish someone had said something more then "theres no right choice and its up to you" when i was struggling with bfing .. no one wanted to be politically incorrect and actually have an opinion.. but i could have used some information, opinions, and support.

and i think that if someone feels it is necessary to comment on my parenting choices they should not be allowed to say "to each his own" when i disagree with them. if they don't want to hear anything but agreement then don't give me advice or comment on my parenting b/c i will tell you the truth whether you agree with it or not.

[benj]

Originally Posted by 1littlebit

i'm sorry people drive you nuts. you could do what i do and wear headphones whenever possible (books on tape.. ) or try and look surly.

don't combine the headphones and the surliness though or people will apparently think you are a criminal. <--- this is courtesy of my best friends little brother.. and mine for all intents and purposes. he's probably wrong though. people think he's a criminal b/c its true... the only time headphones have anything to do with it is when they find a stolen pair stuffed down his pants.

i don't comment when i know people are just going to argue, or when they obviously think they are right. sometimes i ask them if they just want to spout their own advice or if they intend to listen to my response. i have very little patience for people who want to talk to me but don't want to listen when i disagree with them.

Haha, I could always do that. I just have so many strikes against me that it really wouldn't be ideal for me to be giving advice. If they'll ask me something, I'll answer...but I don't go out of my way. I'm not sure how people expect others to respond to a hypercritical, condescending comment...so I doubt their interest is actually in trying to be helpful.

[Tigerchild]

Originally Posted by 1littlebit

plus as i said up thread i wish someone had said something more then "theres no right choice and its up to you" when i was struggling with bfing .. no one wanted to be politically incorrect and actually have an opinion.. but i could have used some information, opinions, and support.

Saying that there's no right choice and it's up to you IS an opinion. And someone could have just as easily told you, "Breastfeeding is low class and gross and inferior, you should just give it up."

That's the problem with claiming that people should offer more challenges to other's parenting. It doesn't mean that they're going to be challenges from the "right" side.

Information, opinons, and support don't have to be mutually exclusive, but in my experience information and support vs. opinions often are.

When someone asks me if they should get a sling or a stroller, and I say, "You know, it's really up to you and your kid's preference", I am NOT being politically correct. That is my opinion. When someone asks, for a very high oral needs older baby if it's "okay" if they try a pacifier, when I say, "Hey, it's up to you," that is my sincerely held opinion, because I think pacifiers (so long as they don't interfere with breastfeeding) are neutral.

Some of us who hold the belief (VERY STRONGLY in my case) that the vast majority of parenting does NOT have One Right Way and thus it's important to direct people to follow the needs of their family and not mine. That is not a "PC" belief, in fact you will get crap from both sides if you hold that belief (though hey, no matter what "side" you're on, you're going to get crap as a parent, I'm not sure that anyone catches more or less than anyone else).

You're dismissing the above as a non-opinion, when in fact it IS an opinon.

That's why I feel that a lot of times framing parenting discussions as "challenging" and "debating" is a waste of time because it tends to draw people to think of two oppositional stances (which isn't the case in parenting), and it becomes very easy for people to dismiss people in the grey/more neutral areas as being non-opinionated or "PC" when that's not the case at all.

[1littlebit]

it really wasnt either of their opinions.. it was my mom and my aunt and both of them BF for well over a year. they just didn't want to pressure me.

but as i also said in the OP i think there are tons of right answers which is why it is difficult with things like breast feeding, babywearing etc. you never know someone's situation.

but i just can't see how spanking can be construed as right.... circ i have a harder time with b/c i try to respect religious differences.. plus i still can't imagine how it could come up.

i think your reading the challenge thing a bit differently then i meant it. i have to question myself in order to think things through.. i have to try and argue the other side to see if my reasoning stands. thats just me though.

why should i let someone give me ridiculous parenting advice and then just smile and nod. if someone is going to tell me i should spank my kid i expect them to be able to tell me why. same for anything else. if someone tells me we have to CIO i don't think it is that bad to ask them why i should do that.

[1littlebit]

i guess there are people who just randomly give advice.. i was picturing some looney tune with a pamphlet and multiple choice parenting quiz... but i guess technically thats what it is when people comment on ds and then give me a 30 minute lecture on how i'm to young but since you can't change the past i should start solids no later then 3 mos, and wean at that time b/c a man needs something thats just for him mostly i ignore them b/c they are often older ladies who really do mean well.

when i am out with ds and it is another mother with similar aged kids it annoys me. she can tell me what she does for a week and i won't do anything but smile... and then she will tell me what i should do or try and if i disagree she says to each their own? well if that were the case she should not have spent the last hour detailing her parenting philosophy and then telling me i should really try it.

if someone asks about ds's sleeping or something and then tells me he needs to sleep in a crib and/or CIO i don't see why i shouldn't be able to respond... its not like they just smiled and nodded why on earth should i?

[schoolmom07]

First of all, I love that 1littlebit has even brought this about! I am a debater and believe that much could be changed if more of us came out but...actions would also have to follow! Anyhoo, I am one who will most assuradly voice my opinions, sometimes with cause and sometimes without proper research. For instance, hubbie had to go to ER (after a visit to Urgent Care yesterday). Every drunk in the county must have been there! One actually got out of a car, pulling his pants up (way too late as I saw what God had given him--UGGG!), and walked in while dd is sitting there playing her Nintendo. He walks in front of us and the back of his pants had HUGE holes in them! You could see the other half of what God had given him! I was angry! So I said something to his friend (after walking DD out of the ER so she would not see this fellow). I asked if he were the one who had just dropped off the other guy and he said yes. So I asked could you not have made sure he got some clothes on that would have covered him? He said "he cut his foot really badly swimming and if we would have had time, I would have". So I asked, "He was swimming without a suit because he certainly doesn't have one on now nor does he have on underwear"! I was pretty angry that people don't mind drinking or drugging to the point they no longer care about themselves or anyone else around them. My daughter could have possibly seen all the male parts of a grown man (she didn't thank God) just because he did not care enough about himself to justify putting on clothes or being decent in any way! Well, I don't want to have my daughter remembering some strange man naked, just because we were seeking legitimate help to take care of her dad who has septic bursitis and was running a temp of 104! BTW, he has to have his knee opened up tomorrow to drain it...EWWW and OMG he is braver than me! He is in alot of pain and they are aggressivly treating with antibiotics but doc says they have to open it up and shoot the meds right into it! Sorry I know off subject.

[1littlebit]

your post sounds like mine when i post after 11pm ... and im with ya on the nakedness.. its a bit unpleasant.. but i promise it wont scar her! me and my brother saw an nice old man butt naked on a nude beach... obviously more appropriate but still not exactly pleasant.

and the knee.... yikes!

i think those of us who are naturally prone to debating have a hard time listening to someone's thirty minute sermon on the evils of co sleeping and why no one should BF past 6 months and then have that person say 'to each their own' when someone disagrees... if you didn't want my opinion don't share yours.

[Marylizah]

Having been on the receiving end of ENDLESS unsolicited, well-meaning and totally infuriating advice and opinions since the birth of my son three years ago, I vote :

BUTT THE F*** OUT.

Unless asked directly for advice or if a subject comes up in conversation.

I am sicksicksick to death of the interference of well-meaning people (see my thread in Personal Growth for a recent example). I refuse to become like them. Also, as DS gets older I see less and less the point of judging people based on a very short interaction with them (ie the parents in the grocery store or at the zoo or whatever). There just isn't enough data, and it's too easy to get worked up into a smug, self-satisfied state. No one is perfect and most of us are truly doing the best we can in the moment.