pneumococcal risks

[Lollicup]

What is more risky?

1. Getting Prevnar
a. Getting some mild to sever reactions.
b. Stereotype replacement
c. The 20% chance of the vaccine not working. (The CDC states that since the introduction of Prevnar, the rate of invansive pneumococcal has been reduced to 80%.

2. Not getting Prevnar
a. Developing invasive pneumococcal.
b. My DD is no 19 months and is past the high risk age (Prevnar is not recommend after 2 years in healthy children.
c. Strengthening my DD's immune system with homeopathy, vitamins and healthy food. Avoiding playgroups, church nurseries, Chuck E Cheese's, etc.


MY QUESTION IS:

A. How many kids who get Prevnar are protected at a higher rate (80% as indicated by the CDC), VS:

B. The number of kids who get a stereo replacement.

Isn't it wise to say that 80% are protected by the vaccine, were as, how many percentage actually have steroetype replacement going on? Also, how many kids who didn't get Prevnar would contract serious invasive disease?

Let's look at the numbers and facts. I'm am factual.

[Lollicup]

What is more risky?

1. Getting Prevnar
a. Getting some mild to sever reactions.
b. Stereotype replacement
c. The 20% chance of the vaccine not working. (The CDC states that since the introduction of Prevnar, the rate of invansive pneumococcal has been reduced to 80%.

2. Not getting Prevnar
a. Developing invasive pneumococcal.
b. My DD is no 19 months and is past the high risk age (Prevnar is not recommend after 2 years in healthy children.
c. Strengthening my DD's immune system with homeopathy, vitamins and healthy food. Avoiding playgroups, church nurseries, Chuck E Cheese's, etc.


MY QUESTION IS:

A. How many kids who get Prevnar are protected at a higher rate (80% as indicated by the CDC), VS:

B. The number of kids who get a stereo replacement.

Isn't it wise to say that 80% are protected by the vaccine, were as, how many percentage actually have steroetype replacement going on? Also, how many kids who didn't get Prevnar would contract serious invasive disease?

Let's look at the numbers and facts. I'm am factual.

Question What kinds of infections are included in pneumococcal disease?
A:You have probably heard of several of these infections, such as bacterial meningitis (an infection of the covering of the brain and spinal cord) and bacteremia (an infection in the blood).

Prior to the availability of Prevnar®, Streptococcus pneumoniae was the most common cause of bacterial meningitis in the United States. The annual incidence of pneumococcal meningitis in children between 1 to 23 months of age was approximately 7 cases per 100,000 persons. Pneumococcal meningitis in childhood has been associated with 8% mortality and may result in neurological problems (25%

[Jugs]

This isn't something you're going to get concrete numbers for because its not a notifiable disease. Have you looked over this link:

http://insidevaccines.com/wordpress/.../pneumococcal/

c. The 20% chance of the vaccine not working. (The CDC states that since the introduction of Prevnar, the rate of invansive pneumococcal has been reduced to 80%.

Do you have a link for that? Are they claiming an 80% reduction in all serotypes or just the vaccine serotypes?

[lauradbg]

You should also look at what the relative risk is of getting it in the first place. If sick, what's the chance of developing it?

Beyond that look at absolute risk--how many kids get it at all out of the population of this country.

The CDC may talk about an 80% reduction in invasive pneumococcal infections, but a reduction from what to what. What was the chance of getting it originally? If 100 people got it and now it's down to 20 people but that's out of a country of 300,000,000, it would be crazy to worry about the slight absolute risk.

How many kids used to get this? What were the circumstances of their contracting the disease? How did they weather it?

Did you ever hear of any of your classmates getting it? Or, your parents or grandparents?

Numbers can be thrown around all sorts of ways, but find out what the relative and absolute risks are for contracting this.

[ammiga]

Also weigh:

- the fact that your dd had a previous vax reaction
- you kept her healthy for 19 months... don't you think you can do it for 5 more?
- what will you do when they start saying everyone under 3 should have it?
- what are the long term effects of the vax that haven't been studied? do you think you are better equipped to handle the vpd or a permanent autoimmune disease?

[japonica]

I think the CDC numbers have to be checked. They must be claiming an 80% reduction in those strains covered by the vaccine. But if you read the studies and articles about the increase in strains not covered by the vaccine, then what is the net benefit? Plus, are they more likely to get one of the strains not covered by the vax? And what about staph (once you eliminate pneumoccocal carriage then you create a space for staph aureus).

Also, I'd find it informative to check the stats on pneumococcal infection pre- and post-Hib vaccination. One scientist (I don't have the link now but I did previously cite it) did comment that in his opinion, the rise in pneumococcal infections was directly related to the widespread use of the Hib vax.

B. The number of kids who get a stereo replacement.

It's actually serotype replacement...but thanks for my smile of the day. I have an image of my 4 year old getting a new stereo. Hee hee.

[Sileree]

I can tell you are having a hard time with this decision since you have started (I think) at least 4 or 5 threads on this subject.

That the vaccine has dropped disease incidence by 80% does not mean that the vaccine will be 80% effective in preventing disease for your child. I hope you understand the difference now. They were talking about the overall population.

This is how common the disease is based on MMWR reports:

Incidence*
Cases in children in 2005 due to serotypes in the vaccine
- Ages <1 = 2.7 per 100,000 or 7 cases total
- 1 = 1.6 per 100,000, 4 cases
- 2 = 1.2 per 100,000, 3 cases
- 3 = 1.2 per 100,000, 3 cases
- 4 = 0.7 per 100,000, 2 cases
- Total ages <5 = 1.7 per 100,000, 19 cases

*Cases only reported from one county in California, Conneticut, 20 counties in Georgia, six counties in Maryland, seven counties in Minnesota, seven counties in New York, three counties in Oregon and 4 in Tennessee. The total population aged <5 years under surveillance in 2005 was 1.26 million.

[Lollicup]

Originally Posted by japonica

I think the CDC numbers have to be checked. They must be claiming an 80% reduction in those strains covered by the vaccine. But if you read the studies and articles about the increase in strains not covered by the vaccine, then what is the net benefit? Plus, are they more likely to get one of the strains not covered by the vax? And what about staph (once you eliminate pneumoccocal carriage then you create a space for staph aureus).

Also, I'd find it informative to check the stats on pneumococcal infection pre- and post-Hib vaccination. One scientist (I don't have the link now but I did previously cite it) did comment that in his opinion, the rise in pneumococcal infections was directly related to the widespread use of the Hib vax.


It's actually serotype replacement...but thanks for my smile of the day. I have an image of my 4 year old getting a new stereo. Hee hee.

Ah, it was very late at night and I did a spell check and probably should have noticed!

[emma1325]

Lolli,

I strongly suspect you are struggling with this so much because you are having a hard time believing so many doctors would recommend something that could be harmful/not worth the risks. Is this the case? Do you feel pressured to get this vaccine because you can't nail down the specific reason why you shouldn't?

Do you feel your child is at higher risk than other children for some reason? I'm not sure why you would feel that without this vaccine, you would have to avoid places like church nurseries and chuck-e-cheese's. You seem hung up on the unknowns of the world for your baby, but not so much on the unknowns of the vaccine. Have you researched the individual ingredients, and do you feel comfortable injecting these into your child's body? If so, then I suggest taking her and getting the vaccine. If not, forget it and protect your child by feeding her good foods and letting her get plenty of fresh air, sunshine and exercise.