How to "honor" an abusive parent?

[Drewsmom]

I'm asking this in the Spirituality forum b/c I want a response from a religious perspective.

I want to be able to honor my parents (I am 36 yrs old and have my own family now) but my difficulty is that I come from an abusive family, emotionally and verbally. My Father I am able to be around for short times (we only see each other every few years anyway), I'm able to talk to him on the phone also b/c he can maintain a certain sort of civility. He's hard to actually relate to or pull any meaningful conversation out of but that's alright for now.

However, (and my parents are divorced) my Mother continues to be verbally and emotionally abusive and it is getting worse. She lives in another state quite far away and I've chosen not to visit after being attacked several years ago and having no option to leave (her verbal attack happened on the first day of 7 of my visit). It was absolutely awful and I felt as vulnerable as I did as a child. She tends to behave better when my dh is around which he wasn't so I vowed never to visit again or if I did to have my dh with me. However, when on the phone yesterday she started to talk very belittling again. It wasn't even near what it has been or could have been for her but after being married and out of the situation for years as well as having in-laws who are extremely grounded and good people I can see how awful her behavior is. She is not willing to see at all any part and any attempt at civil conversation to talk through the problem is not even an option.

I have seriously considered cutting all ties but the odd thing is that through these experiences I remember things that I've blacked out from my childhood memory or behaviors in myself toward my own children that I'm trying to work through and overcome. How sad is that, that my mother is the example of what I strive not to be in almost every way? I wish I could say opposite and I strive to be the kind of mother that my children can admire and trust and know that loves them unconditionally.

So my question again is, how do I "honor" my mother without subjecting myself to her abuse? Do I keep it to email?

[Ruthla]

I don't think you're obligated to subject yourself to abuse. Do what you have to do to keep yourself and your children safe. That may mean only seeing her a few times a year. That might mean only talking to her on the phone but not seeing her. That might mean email contact only, or it might mean completely cutting off all contact with her.

But you don't have to talk badly about her to your children or other relatives or any mutual friends. You can forgive her in your heart- recognize that she's abusive because of her own weaknesses and failings, and pity her. You can pray for her. All those things are honoring her, and all without risk to yourself.

[DahliaRW]

I think in any situation you have to do what is best for your family. It is not good or God-honoring for your children to see your mother belittle you (nor to be belittled by her themselves). I see nothing dishonorable in not maintaining frequent communications with a parent who is a bad influence on children or your self-esteem. Now, being civil when they do try to communicate is one thing, putting them down behind their back, etc would be dishoring, kwim? And I'd see nothing wrong with, if she starts being abusive on the phone, you saying "I'm sorry, mom, but I cannot talk to you if you are going to be verbally abusive towards me. I'm happy to resume our conversation when we can both keep things positive".

Ooops, posted at the same time as Ruthla, but I like her suggestion fo prayer. VERY good point.

[cappuccinosmom]

I do not believe honoring means subjecting yourself to abuse.

I do think that if you can learn to deflect her abuse, you may be able to stay in contact with her.

My mom did this:
Her mother was abusive and neglectful (alternating ) through her childhood, and remained verbally abusive until close to the end of her life. She was *nasty* to my mother, and to most people around her. For a while we did have very little contact with her, but then she got sick, and my parents decided together that they would offer to have her move into a care home in our town, so that mom could care for her mother, and be near her, but not have to be *too* close, or have no escape route. Over the years she had learned how to graciously but firmly reject abuse, and even to end conversations if necessary. There were a few times my grandmother tried it out on us kids, but we were teens at the time, and with our attitudes and our mom standing up for us, grandma didn't have a chance.

I have a great deal of admiration for my mother. It was a big sacrifice for her to honor and care for a woman who had hurt her all her life. But after several years of consistent love from our family, grandma started to soften and by the time she was actually dying, she was a different woman altogether. I never would have imagined her dying peacefully and beautifully, but she did, and it was in large part due to my mom's dedication.

I am not saying that this is what you should do, or that it would work in your situation. Just wanted to give a more unusual perspective--cutting off doesn't always have to happen.

But I do think on a general level, the way you honor your parents, no matter how they behaved, is to be as an adult the best person and the best parent you know how to be, and to strive to improve yourself and be the kind of parent you wish you had. Your mother might not feel "honored" by that, but having a daughter who is an excellent person and an excellent mother is an honor whether she wants to see it that way or not.

[holyhelianthus]

Drewsmom~ I have been wondering the same thing lately as DH and I have decided to cut my mom out of our lives.

There is a lot of factors in why we did this but our children starting coming to us telling us about her behavior and I realized I cannot raise them like this! It hurts their spirit.

Sometimes the best way to honor our parents is to walk away. I know the more we were subjected to her the more we lashed out at her for how she acted towards us. It was an awful spirit every time she was around.

[~Boudicca~]

Originally Posted by Ruthla

I don't think you're obligated to subject yourself to abuse. Do what you have to do to keep yourself and your children safe. That may mean only seeing her a few times a year. That might mean only talking to her on the phone but not seeing her. That might mean email contact only, or it might mean completely cutting off all contact with her.

But you don't have to talk badly about her to your children or other relatives or any mutual friends. You can forgive her in your heart- recognize that she's abusive because of her own weaknesses and failings, and pity her. You can pray for her. All those things are honoring her, and all without risk to yourself.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. You don't have to subject yourself to this. Limit your contact, if there is going to be any at all. I am going through the same thing with my dad right now.

And I know exactly where you are coming from, having grown up the same way. And my problem is that I am finding that my parenting is being affected very much by the fact that I feel like it is ingrained in me to be like my parents. Sort of like I know how I don't want to parent but I don't know how to parent?

Spiritually, I couldn't tell you what to do as I am in the middle of a conflict of that sort right now. What I have been doing is just practicing yoga and then praying, to no one in particular, like a shout out to the universe for some damn help on this journey. It can feel pretty lonely being a mom who has all this pain inside but not really have anyone to relate to on the particulars of that subject (parenting while overcoming childhood abuse).

[lovebug]

I think there are many ways you can 'honor' you mother without subjecting yourself to her abuse. i agree with PPs... i would limit contact and (depending on your whole relationship) i might even email her to explain why you will be limiting your contact. this worked well for a dear frind of mine. i helped her write her mother a letter. when my friends mother treats her with abuse she reminds her of the letter and ends the conversation. for her it works well :

s mama i am so sorry you have to endure this!

[pjs]

I too struggled with keeping this commandment. I was told by a spiritual advisor that in no way, shape or form, is it honoring the parent to allow them to continue to abuse you. Abusing someone does not get you to heaven, and allowing the abuse to continue hurts their salvation, so in a way I was OBLIGATED to stop the abuse to eventually help their soul.

I was also advised that I must acknowledge this loss, because even if they were never the parent they should have been, you have still lost the "dream/hope" of something. I was also encouraged to find a way to replace that loss- like by a "surrogate" parental relationship with an older person. We did successfully cut out the toxic and abusive parents from our lives, which have never been happier, more confident and more fulfilling. Haven't yet found someone to replace that role in our lives, but for now we're happy that we're not being dragged down by the abuse and toxicity.

ETA- I was also advised by my spiritual advisor that I needed to work diligently to be able to forgive them for what they had done to me and my family. I was resistant and couldn't see myself honoring them with my forgiveness. BUT, the reason I couldn't see myself forgiving them is because they were still in my life, hurting me and my family over and over and over again. Once I cut them out, I was able to heal and have eventually found myself in a place where I can and for the most part, have forgiven them. That doesn't mean I'd ever welcome them back into my life, but for the time they were in my life, I forgive them for the abuse and pray that they may someday heal.

[Drewsmom]

Originally Posted by pjs

I too struggled with keeping this commandment. I was told by a spiritual advisor that in no way, shape or form, is it honoring the parent to allow them to continue to abuse you. Abusing someone does not get you to heaven, and allowing the abuse to continue hurts their salvation, so in a way I was OBLIGATED to stop the abuse to eventually help their soul.

Wow, I had never thought of it this way before. The biggest thing I struggle with is after growing up like this hearing it all of the time feeling like I'm being too harsh on my Mom. She can be nice at times and even loving it's just that there's some switch in her head that when she feels even remotely attacked she goes on the attack mode herself and is vicious and ruthless.

That is absolutely amazing Capuccino's Mom to hear about your Mom's story. That is something that I would strive for if possible. My sister who was always the despised on in our family growing up by both parents has become that care taker for my Mom in recent years after I fell out of favor by marrying a man my Mom didn't approve of. She's helped my Mom through some illness and I admire her ability to do so as well as be compassionate with her. Her only downfall unlike your Mom is that she won't speak up when my Mom gets abusive with her and draw appropriate boundaries. I admire your Mom so much to hear the love and respect in your voice for her and knowing that she did in her own way honor her mother and help teach her in the process and helped her become a better person. That is really heartening to hear, thanks for sharing it.

[greenmamato2]

I think people have made some great suggestions. Perhaps the best way to honor her is to not allow her to embarrass herself by her behavior toward you in front of your children... allow them to keep a positive outlook on what family means.

The best way that I can think of to honor your parents is to be kind, to keep your relationship at a wide enough distance that it doesn't come to a bad situation, and if by some chance it does, you gently say "I love you, but I am hurt by your actions" and don't get into a back-and-forth battle over it (simple is good).

Sometimes the best way to love someone is to not enable their behavior. I'm not saying that you have... I'm just saying that its okay to distance yourself enough not to allow them to hurt you anymore.

hugs

[HarperRose]

Yes, the bible says honor your parents. But the God I know doesn't expect his ppl to subject themselves to abuse. Honoring them can be as simple as not talking badly about them, but it does NOT mean you have to associate with them!


I severely limit the contact I have w/ my parents. I don't live near them and I see them maybe once every few years. When I do visit them, I am respectful of their home (and they of mine, usually), but I don't let them berate or abuse me or my children. And my father, to this day, pays for his physical discipline of my son 5 yrs ago. My son is afraid of him even though they haven't even spoken since then. My father has apologized to me and asked me to extend his apology to my son. My son won't talk to him. He's only 9.

[earthzizu]

There is no honor in playing victim, unless you love being sacrificed.

[~Boudicca~]

Originally Posted by earthzizu

There is no honor in playing victim, unless you love being sacrificed.

:

[LionTigerBear]

I haven't read the responses yet, but can identify with this. In fact, OP, we may have "talked" about this before. Anyway, I am no longer in contact with my mom and stepfather (it's been a year now! Yayyy!) I honor my mother's memory by trying to think of her compassionately, although realistically and honestly, and trying to honor and acknowledge whatever good legacies I do have from her. I try to give her benefit of the doubt, that she may have been affected by mental illness and abuse herself, and not judge her soul even while I recognize that her actions were wrong and hurtful. I keep a list of the many things she did that broke my heart as a child, to remind me to always remember why I need this space away from her, because there is a part of me which is a glutton for her punishment, and I need to stay away from her so I can grow healthy and strong. Having her out of my life has been SO healing for me. It has really helped me to be a much better parent and I feel that I am finally growing up now that I am out of her sphere of influence.

The biggest thing about following that commandment, for me, is just love and respect-- thinking of her lovingly, even when I will not allow her to contact me, and respecting her and her memory. And I wonder if, in a way, this is more something God requires for my own good, rather than for hers. After all, it doesn't really matter to her at this point what I think of her, but holding onto all that anger in my heart can only cause me continuing harm.

[lilyka]

Sorry haven't read all the replies...

here is how I would handle it.

first of I would be respectful and polite but FIRM. this is a phone conversation. you are free to hang up and shut off the ringer. and if she were to begin talking trash tell her politely "I need to go mom. maybe we can talk later. I love you. goodby." and HANG UP. don't let her drag you in with "one more quick thing" just hang up. it is not rude. it is not dishonoring. you have to honor her. not her rude behavior. and by picking up the phone and not losing it with her you are going above and beyond anyway. and if you can not deal with her and issues with grace I would not feel bad about just skipping it. it is ok nbot to pick up if you don't feel up to it. and pray for her. it is not to late for her to become the person, friend and mother God would have her be. it is not too late for him to heal the hurts in her that cause her to be this way. to make her a new creation. and pray that God would show you ways to express his love to her. ways that will not hurt you.

[lolar2]

In my most expert, I-dated-an-archaeology-major-for-a-few-months-back-in-college tone: the "honor your parents" commandment specifically referred, historically, to supporting them in their old age. It doesn't have anything to do with frequency of contact, other than to check periodically to make sure that she is provided with enough money to live on and that she is able to access whatever medical-type care she needs. So if she has a job or retirement fund, some kind of health insurance, and she can drive or otherwise get transportation to medical appointments, you're doing OK from the point of view of the commandment.

[genifer]

Yeah, as far as not subjecting yourself to abuse, proverbs says not even to eat with an angry man (person, mom whatever) bc it has an effect on you, causes resentment. As far as the last post above mine, Ive never looked at it that way but it makes perfect sense. For me, Ive always wanted to still show my parents the love of God bc I dont think they understood it themselves, which contributed to the way they are/were with me. I live in another country from the one I grew up in and about 3000 miles away from my parents, didnt speak to them much for years but I did want to leave the door open for restoration to be possible, that the relationship could be salvaged. After 10 years the doors are finally opening, Im speaking via email to my dad on a regular basis (trying to anyway) and we are communicating. And prayer. It works, takes time usually but it works.

[milagras]

Originally Posted by earthzizu

There is no honor in playing victim, unless you love being sacrificed.

To a point, I get this. I know where this is coming from.

Some of us - whether we admit it or not - play the victim. It gets us sympathy...attention. But it's no good. It's not helpful or positive.

I know abuse, though verbal in nature. Sometimes, the only thing you can do is to cut those ties. At least until you can heal and/or come up with the best way to deal with the parent/sibling/relative/friend.

You can forgive, but this doesn't mean you condone what's happened.

I have pondered cutting ties with family...it's a tough road. I wish you peace...and answers.

[holyhelianthus]

Originally Posted by milagras

Some of us - whether we admit it or not - play the victim. It gets us sympathy...attention. But it's no good. It's not helpful or positive.

Neither is lumping all abuse victims into the "playing the victim" category.

What it comes down to is it doesn't need to be said. The amount of abuse victims that are just milking it are so few and far between that when we stop the real discussion in order to account for them it is extremely counter productive can just be hurtful. Play the victim? We are victims. And it has gotten really old that people have such a hard time acknowledging that we are victims and that we do have needs. It's taboo in our society of "just suck it up". It's hard enough for an abuse victim to acknowledge it themselves which is a very big problem. So why do we insist on bringing it back into the arena constantly? It's like if your child were to fall and break their leg and be crying in pain you were to stand over them and say "that looks like it hurts but are you sure you're not just trying to milk me for sympathy?" Sometimes people do need sympathy, though. There is nothing wrong with that. There is nothing wrong with taking that child and holding them close.

[VisionaryMom]

Originally Posted by magstphil

What it comes down to is it doesn't need to be said. The amount of abuse victims that are just milking it are so few and far between that when we stop the real discussion in order to account for them it is extremely counter productive can just be hurtful. Play the victim? We are victims. And it has gotten really old that people have such a hard time acknowledging that we are victims and that we do have needs. It's taboo in our society of "just suck it up". It's hard enough for an abuse victim to acknowledge it themselves which is a very big problem. So why do we insist on bringing it back into the arena constantly? It's like if your child were to fall and break their leg and be crying in pain you were to stand over them and say "that looks like it hurts but are you sure you're not just trying to milk me for sympathy?" Sometimes people do need sympathy, though. There is nothing wrong with that. There is nothing wrong with taking that child and holding them close.

Thank you.



I struggle with this issue with my own parents. My dad was rarely around. I didn't know him until my early 20s. I'm 29 now, and he has terminal cancer. I speak to him fairly regularly. Though he's not at the end of his life in that his cancer isn't aggressive, and he could live with it for years, I think knowing that he's not likely to live until old age has changed my perspective. I cut him off if he starts trying to give me excuses for why he wasn't around. I simply can't handle it. I try to keep our conversations light - updates on the kids, comments on news stories, and that works for us.

As for my mother...she's a different animal altogether. If I'm not feeling well or up to dealing with her, I ignore the phone. She eventually will start guilt-tripping me through voicemails. I either let DH listen to them, or I just delete them. Like you, they can transport me back to being a child.

I've tried on my own to think about my mother's own life, which hasn't been pleasant, and why she did some of the horrible things she did. It helps to step back and think about her as a person, rather than my mother. If I met her and heard her story, I would feel sympathy for her; it's because I lived with her that I don't. I've faced the consequences of her life, so I do try to dissociate myself from that.

In the end, I've learned to keep her at arm's length about a lot of topics. She and my husband don't care for each other, so I rarely discuss him with her. I'm careful what I say about my children. The last time I was home she said that "DS is like you. I never liked or understood you from the time you were 2, and he acts just like you." Indeed, he does. I know how much it hurt to know my own mother didn't like me, though, so I don't talk to her about DS much other than funny stories, and I certainly don't allow him to be subjected to her.

I also feel that I learned how *not* to parent from my childhood. It's not just my mom; there really are no good parents in my family. I'm from a family of abusers - emotional, physical, and sexual. In many ways, it's frustrating because I have no legitimate benchmark for how I'm doing. I don't feel I have an example to use, so I'm just going it alone.