My dog pees everywhere

[melamama]

Ok, not everywhere but it seems like it.

He is a lab and nearly 7y and has always been this way more or less. It's like he just doesn't get the difference between inside and outside.
We've done most everything we could come across to modify this behavior. He is all the way over on the submissive scale and pretty anxious as well. He can't handle thunderstorms, but also can't handle the sound of my children (happy or otherwise)--who he has known his entire life. I've tried different Bach mixtures as well as RR.

(we're not new to dogs people either, dh and I both grew up with several, and had a dog before this one, all of them were trained and never were like this) As a puppy we trained him, took him to trainer, sent him away for training also.

We used to live in a house with more property, and we solved the problem primarily by keeping him outside most of the day (it was a great yard and he was very happy to be outside). Now we live in a different state with a much smaller yard, that he doesn't like to be in (he will bark constantly--separate but similarly unfixable problem).

It's also not that I'm not taking him out enough, I can take him for a big walk with lots of peeing, bring him home and it's like he keeps a special reserve just for this.

I'm especially at my wits end because it's thunderstorm season here, and yesterday there were storms moving through the entire day. Right now I put him in the bathroom with the fan on, but sometimes I miss hearing them first. It's the multiple pees all over the carpet (rented house with white wtw) that is getting to me.

Thoughts or suggestions?

[rhubarbarin]

This is the worst. Labs are big dogs - that's a lot of pee. Have you ruled out medical issues? There are several things that cause incontinence and medication can help. It does sound though like he just never 'got' house training.

Some ideas:

Clean all his pee areas with multiple applications of Nature's Miracle.

Work on crate training him, if he isn't already. Keep him crated when he's not supervised.

As much as possible when you are home, keep him on a lead at your side, take him out frequently and make a fuss when he pees inside. With observation sometimes you can pick up on his signals before he goes.

Pick a potty area in the yard, take him out on his leash every time. When he goes, give a command (I use 'go pee') and then reward copiously with praise and treats. You can usually train dogs to pee on command pretty fast if you are consistent.

Keep him diapered when he's not in his crate or on lead at your side. These work great.

[melamama]

I do all the things you suggest (we go through lots of Nature's miracle). He is also the first dog we have ever had (or known) who will willingly and repeatedly pee in his crate. Just like peeing everywhere else, he never makes any signal that he needs to go, and never seems to care (our last lab would have been incredibly embarrassed if he had an accident in the house, and never in the crate).

Thanks for the link. Maybe we just need to keep him diapered. I will take him again to the vet to check on this though.

[rhubarbarin]

Originally Posted by melamama

I do all the things you suggest (we go through lots of Nature's miracle). He is also the first dog we have ever had (or known) who will willingly and repeatedly pee in his crate. Just like peeing everywhere else, he never makes any signal that he needs to go, and never seems to care (our last lab would have been incredibly embarrassed if he had an accident in the house, and never in the crate).

Thanks for the link. Maybe we just need to keep him diapered. I will take him again to the vet to check on this though.

Yeah, this sounds kinda unusual. I know a lot of people who swear by diapers and I use them sometimes on my dog who has peeing issues. The only thing is that many dogs will tear them off if you don't watch them, so it's not fail-safe.

Keep this thread updated, there has to be SOME way to make your life a bit easier.

[Sailor]

Is he neutered? Sometimes that makes a difference.

The crate issue is interesting. Was he always like this? How old was he when you got him?

The reason I ask is because dogs are naturally clean animals. As puppies, even, they will not soil the area they sleep in. They'll go elsewhere. Unless, they have NO choice and are forced to soil the area where they sleep. This sort of "teaches" them to be dirty dogs, for lack of a better word. Maybe the people who had him before you allowed him to pee in his crate or sleep area.

The bad news is that this is VERY difficult to train out. Especially, if it's been happening for so long.

The good news is that no dog (extenuating and rare circumstances excluded) is untrainable.

As the previous poster mentioned - have you tried leashing him to you all day long? I know this is a pain to do, but if you could leash him to you all day long, and correct when he peed inside, and praise/treat when he did it outside - after a few weeks he may get it. The crate isn't an option if he pees in it, so you'd literally have to leash him to you as much as possible - all day, if possible. Which I realize is not exactly realistic.

Some dogs pee in submission, also. Which may or may not be a factor depending on how/when he's doing it.

[melamama]

Originally Posted by Sailor

Is he neutered? Sometimes that makes a difference.

The crate issue is interesting. Was he always like this? How old was he when you got him?

The reason I ask is because dogs are naturally clean animals. As puppies, even, they will not soil the area they sleep in. They'll go elsewhere. Unless, they have NO choice and are forced to soil the area where they sleep. This sort of "teaches" them to be dirty dogs, for lack of a better word. Maybe the people who had him before you allowed him to pee in his crate or sleep area.

The bad news is that this is VERY difficult to train out. Especially, if it's been happening for so long.

The good news is that no dog (extenuating and rare circumstances excluded) is untrainable.

As the previous poster mentioned - have you tried leashing him to you all day long? I know this is a pain to do, but if you could leash him to you all day long, and correct when he peed inside, and praise/treat when he did it outside - after a few weeks he may get it. The crate isn't an option if he pees in it, so you'd literally have to leash him to you as much as possible - all day, if possible. Which I realize is not exactly realistic.

Some dogs pee in submission, also. Which may or may not be a factor depending on how/when he's doing it.

He is neutered, and we got him when he was 7 weeks old--sent from the breeder. He is extremely submissive though.

I had always believed that dogs wouldn't soil where they slept, but he really doesn't care-- doesn't whine or make a peep before he pees anywhere--in the crate, in the middle of the floor, etc.

We have leashed him to us during training times in the past. Once he's not leashed he reverts to old behaviors. I understand that he shouldn't be untrainable but we have done so much training with this dog, not only on our own but with professional trainers. It really is like he has a deficit. I think I just have to check out the diapers, or corral him to washable areas in the house.

[Sol_y_Paz]

First thing is first, check for UTI at the vet. That can be fixed.
Second, this resource will help
http://wisedogblog.com/blog1.php/2009/02/01/fastpotty

[Sailor]

That's a conundrum, then. Maybe there is something "off" about that area of his behavior. In rare cases, there are dogs who can't be trained out of a certain behavior due to a mental imbalance/issue. It sounds like you've tried everything in these 7 years.

Is he easily trained in other areas: sit, stay, lie down, heel, etc.? If it's just this one area, and you've tried it all .... I've got nothing. Sorry.

I guess the corralling is your best bet. I'm sure this must be very frustrating.

[greenmagick]

I know of some puppy mill dogs that are like this. They were forced to stay in a cage full of pee/poop and they totally lost they instiinct to stay out of it.

[melamama]

Originally Posted by greenmagick

I know of some puppy mill dogs that are like this. They were forced to stay in a cage full of pee/poop and they totally lost they instiinct to stay out of it.

This is not him.

But when I think of his parents, they are all field trial dogs, and they are really outside dogs. They have a great life and a lot of fun, but the dogs' kennel is outdoors and they spend most of their time outdoors. I'm starting to feel like he was just never prepared to be a house dog. When we had more space we were able to keep him outside much of the day, then at night he'd sleep on the floor next to our bed. Now that he has to be inside more often than not, it's like he's just short circuited.

At this point I just want to find someone with a ranch.