Mothering › Forums › Parenting › Talk to me about life in a large family...
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Talk to me about life in a large family...

post #1 of 72
Thread Starter 
Lately I'm obsessed with understanding what it's like to have a large family. FWIW, "large" to my family is anything over 3 kids. In fact, no one has over 2, that I know of - ok, well, my grandpa has 3 siblings, but I really know nothing about them. My grandma has none, my other grandma had one that was 10 years older and my other grandfather I never knew. My dad was an only child, my mom was one of two, and both my mom and her sister had two kids. That's it for my family.

So, anyway... we're considering TTC the third, but I'd love to have more than that. It scares me, though, honestly. My two are about 50% happily playing and 50% fighting I think that's pretty normal for siblings, in my experience, but I can't imagine how that works when you have 6 or 8 kids (or more!). I have a friend who is one of 11 or so? and I asked her what her parents about arguing and sibling rivalry, and she said there WASN'T ANY (or much)!! I am fascinated, but I can't figure out how that works?

Anyway, I'd love to hear about the good and bad of having a huge family. How do you keep the peace (or do you?)... are kids just fighting all the time? Do they not fight, much? To put things in perspective, I like consensual living, but am not really there, yet, but I'd like to be able to do as much as I can consensually... is this even possible with a big family? (yeah, I know a lot of people think it's not really possible with a small family...)

I dunno... I'd love to hear whatever you've got to say about it

Thanks!
post #2 of 72
Thread Starter 
Maybe everyone w/a big family's too busy to post? :
post #3 of 72
I don't have a large family - but I've seen your banned title before, is Obama really your cousin??
post #4 of 72
I'm the oldest of four kids....I always wanted to have TONS of kids...just get a big farm house and have as many as my body saw fit to comfortably have...but after ACTUALLY having our first baby...I'm realizing that with our lifestyle and personalities, two is where it's at for us. I'm not even sad about it, you know? I feel totally at peace when I think that two will be it for me....just because of HOW "not it" any more than that would be.


Now, that being said...again, I was the oldest of four kids. We. Did. Not. Argue. Period. We didn't bicker, we didn't tattle, etc....none of that. Now, I think that was partly because we had an INSANE mother and it wouldn't have been tolerated....but I honestly think that it was mainly because we were so close. We always played dress up, make beleive all of that together. Everywhere we went, it was the four of us....we hardly EVER played seperately in the neighborhood and because there were so many of us, we never had any trouble with neighbor kids, etc. It was always the older three...then, when I was 11 and my smallest sister was born, she joined us. Before she could even walk, she became our play buddy, and when we set out for the day to play, she was right with us, in the wagon, sitting like a little lump, staring up at us and loving every moment.

We were fiercely protective of one another and never tolerated anyone giving us guff. We were never in situations where we felt uncomfortable and would wander sometimes very far from home. There were always enough of us that we could really play fun games....we would spend endless hours in forts in the trees...and even got into "trouble" a bit....one person playing "look out" while two others climbed the tall wall of the orchard, to gather up delicious fruits, etc in a hobo-style knapsack.

Lots of fond memories....we were ALWAYS together....we had wonderful communication with each other, still do, and worked out most disputes among ourselves...when you have that many people, you can take a dispute to another kid...say, if my younger sister (16 mos younger than me) and my younger brother (just about five years younger than me) had a dispute, they could ask me what I thought...and I would tell them what was fair. The youngest of us (11 years younger than me) didn't participate as much with this..but definitely brought good energy to the table. There was just very very little in the way of conflict, that ever took place in front of my mother or which was brought to an adults attention. We just didn't have a lot of problems and, when we did, they were things like "I carried it up the big hill, can you carry it down" - and if there was a disagreement, then the third big kid of us, would say "no, it's not fair, yeah, you carried it up, but then we found this cool box...so he's gonna carry the box down the big hill, you and I can carry this" - there was a lot of cooperation. I actually think it played a big part in our being able, as adults, to cope well in team situations, to communicate well and get along with ANYONE.

That and....we always shared. When I meet people, who cannot share....it mystifies me. We shared EVERYTHING. We shared rooms, space, food, treats, candy, toy items....there was nothing that was especially for one kid. It makes you a so much more flexible adult, when you are used to having the moods, needs, convenience and feelings of other people incorporated into all decision making. It's a real difference. Like...my husband, there were three kids in the family, but they lived very seperate lives. THey didn't play together, they weren't a "pack" like my siblings. He never had to share, always got what he wanted, always had his own room, etc....he is a totally different adult than I....just less flexible and it is rooted at his "me centric" life growing up, I think. He just never had to compromise, etc....so, yeah, while I sometimes as a kid wished I had my own stuff, got to eat a whole candy bar by myself, or whatever else....I wouldn't trade anything for the commradery that I shared with my siblings or the flexible adult I have become as a result of having to be a flexible kid.

So...those are my thoughts on coming from many.....I think that you can raise a spoiled, bickering group of kids...whether you have three...or thirteen! It's all in the TYPE of large family you have. If your kids work together, play together and experience life together...they will form different attachements than if they are encouraged in being "seperate" in their lives. I just think it's a matter of it being easier, when you only have two or three, to live those seperate lives, persue completely different interests, etc...whereas, from a practical standpoint, a kid who is one among 4, 6, or more...is naturally going to have to cooperate more, share more, etc....

I hope you end up with the perfect number for you.....congratultions on thinking about another!! How exciting!
post #5 of 72
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RunnerDuck View Post
I don't have a large family - but I've seen your banned title before, is Obama really your cousin??
LOL! no, it was an april fools joke on FB. (I wish... I'd love to chat w/him sometime, he seems really interesting)
post #6 of 72
Thread Starter 
AverysMomma - That was lovely.

With my kids now, I've tried to not make anything belong to one person, but it's hard now that they're getting slightly older (3 1/2 and 2)... I think that there's a lot of value in sharing everything. Honestly, they've been fighting a lot less lately, I think, maybe it's because they're getting older. I've been working w/ DD (and ds, too, but I think he's a little young and doesn't have great language skills, yet) on coming up with solutions that work for everything, and just recently it's been really starting to work.

Your post gives me hope that they might work out.
post #7 of 72
I grew up in a family of 5 kids. I think the idea that there is no sibling rivalry is...unlikely. I was the baby, by a lot, and it was a great position to be in: I was too little to have any rivalry with the older kids, they had fun "mommying" me, and my parents had given up on a lot of rules by that point.

Between two of my sisters, who were very close in age and shared a room, there was a lot of rivalry (although, when it came to others, they were very protective of each other). One made sure she got a lot of attention by acting out, the other was shy, reserved, a "peace-maker"--the typical "middle child" role. The oldest (a brother) was great with me, but very tough on--and sometimes too physical with--my older sisters.

We did a lot of things as a family, and I remember enjoying having the big group around. We spent most holidays, vacations, etc. with my aunt and uncle and there four kids, so there was always lots of excitement, etc. For the kids in the middle, I know there was often a feeling of being "lost" in all the hubbub, a feeling that I didn't really face as the baby.

Honestly, I think so much depends on family dynamics, personalities, and parenting style, that I think it's impossible to say what life with a big family is like. All big families are different, just like all small families.

For what it's worth, I have an only child by choice.
post #8 of 72
We have four, which doesn't seem big to us because we are in the midst, sort of like having our noses stuck against the painting; it's hard to tell the actually scope.

Ours are still very young and having witnessed the interactions of children in families with one or two children, there are definitely some qualitative differences. I don't know how much is attributable to family size, parenting, personality, and of course the overall dynamic of the people in my particular family- and I'm not sure how anyone could determine this.

So, with that caveat, I'll share what I've noticed.

In our family, there is very little sibling 'rivalry.' It happens, but it is not insidious or an underlying relational aspect of the children's lives. When it happens, it's overt and has a beginning and an end, as in,

"I want to show mummie first!"
"NO! I want to show mummie first!"
"NOOO!!! IIIIIII want to show mummy first!!!"

Then maybe a scuffle, and then once the 'showing' is done, the rivalry stops.

With my brother and I growing up, the rivalry was our manner of relation when in the presence or anticipation of our parents. I have seen this to be fairly common with families with two children, although my own upbringing was a very neglectful one and I don't know to what extent actually nurturing each child would alleviate the underlying desperation for attention. Maybe mums with two can give more insight into this dynamic in a healthy home.

I do not have nearly as much involvement in their play (than the mums I've seen with one or two) and they are years ahead of their age-peers in social development, showing maturity and empathy expected of children twice their ages. I often think that social milestones are determined according to small families because I cannot fathom how a child with many siblings could even survive without developing empathy, negotiating skills, non-violent responses, etc... in tandem with learning self-feeding and object manipulation.

These are such natural developments in a big family; nobody here is directly 'taught' empathy or even manners because it becomes exceedingly obvious to each child what the accepted social expectations are when they are reinforced exponentially each day with so many people.

My friend wanted to teach my children manners the other day because she's teaching her daycare children during their 'manners time' (I don't know why she likes to experiment with my children.... I was perplexed and told her that our children figure out before they even speak that kind speech is preferable to demanding and that the words associated with manners come pretty naturally when they are a normal part of our language- not separated as 'manners words.'

Obviously there is some differing parental philosophy here, but my own ideas about much of what I thought would be a normal part of mothering have been changed by the very different dynamic in having four as opposed to one or two children- where teaching certain things that we don't may actually be necessary. I hadn't accounted for how much they would teach one another, or how much learning would happen as a result of just being as many as we are, for instance.

Two of our boys were taught by their brothers how to use the toilet (or squatty potty as it is for us), and they teach one another all day, delighting in the opportunities to share what they know and can do with one another.

It is not like having two children, doubled in chores and work. It is completely different, imo.

It is also very loud at our house. There is constant chatter and the sound of feet hitting the floor. It's summer though and in winter, they hole up with us and spend copious amounts of time with books and drawing, so there are long periods of relative quiet during that time. Spring and summer are much livelier in that sense than at any one else's house (who has fewer children, that is).

Mostly each new baby has brought something with him to us and made a new dynamic emerge from the relationships we've developed with them. I thought that when we had new babies, they would sort of be incorporated into the whole, but that hasn't been the case at all. Each one has indelibly changed the whole and in wonderful ways we couldn't have anticipated before they came.

By FAR the majority of difficulty I have experienced as a mother has been due to a lack of support for me. I would not find my days nearly as taxing if I had a reliable break and time for work that I find personally meaningful in self-expression (aside from mothering), which is something that after six years is finally coming together.

I have not required for myself what I have assured for everyone else in my family and it has taken this long and my extreme poor health (now recovering very well) to convince my dh of my need. In any case, he now gets it and he is my only source of support. The other thing I hadn't anticipated was how quickly we were dropped by friends and family at each successive pg announcement according to their level of tolerance. That was sincerely shocking.

Overall, though, this experience has taught me more about myself and others than I would have guessed and I have become a much stronger woman than I ever was before, even while my physical weakness plagued me for years after my c/s's.

Many people say to me that they couldn't do what we're doing- having four children- but we couldn't do anything else. My dh used to say after each baby that he couldn't imagine having X children, and I remind him that before he had 1,2,3, and 4, he couldn't imagine that either. There's nothing to plan in a way. Once you're doing it, you're doing it. I answer the question "how do you do it?" with "I just do." I don't know how. How do you love one person? How do you love ten? You make a choice and act on it. I can't think of anything simpler- or more complex in its simplicity!

I think it takes or induces a level of strength and confidence to live as we do that I wouldn't have had it not been required of me in having many children. In many ways, we are like the old pioneers- going it all alone, as a family. In other ways, others benefit immensely from their interactions with our children and in seeing our family in action, others who were previously baffled by the desire for children or many children, have changed their attitudes about it (several families who were unreceptive to the idea of having more than two, having seen how four functions, have now decided to try for four children themselves). Anyone who sees us personally doesn't ask how we do it; we're like a school of fish, all swimming in cooperation around and with one another in a mostly graceful way, not hindering, but allowing for the progress and growth of one another while still moving forward ourselves.

I wrote on the trampoline safety thread about how our boys are so accustomed to being together and moving around and with one another that four of them can be jumping and tumbling on the trampoline without any incident. They are like a circus act , or a dance troupe. They move as though they are extensions of one another and anticipate one another fluidly.

I always make a note when in this sort of discussion that my children are not particularly 'easy' or 'compliant.' At least three of the four have strong tendencies toward ADD I just say they have it because it is so obvious) while being advanced in every usually measured cognitive, social, physical and intellectual area of development.

Being that both dh and I have ADD as well, we function with presuppositions that many others do not have and that influences the ease of our functioning as a family. If we tried to fit a 'mold', we would all wilt. Key to our health has been to work with the actual dynamic we have rather than what might be expected of us, like a structured life of any sort. Home-based learning is essential to us as is a very fluid un-schedule to our days. Rigidity doesn't serve any of us and so we make allowances for when that might be imposed and plan to incorporate the rigid thing into a fluid day without being constrained to it (appointments for instance).

I thought I should include that because however we function and for whatever reason our family life is healthy, our particular way of finding solutions for our particular needs is pre-eminant.

That said, if you want to have three or four or ten (I'm assuming since I only have four) children, you'll figure out what to do when it's time. I don;t know how else anyone could.
post #9 of 72
Thread Starter 
Preggie - that was really interesting. That was kind of what I was envisioning... like maybe having more people around, the older ones kind of help the younger ones to some extent. Did you see a difference with "having to teach" your older ones manners, etc. and your younger ones just picking it up? Both my kids sort of picked up manners easily because that's how we talked to them (I assume), but my younger one seems to be more interested in the potty without our suggestion than our older one was....
post #10 of 72
Such a timely post! We are debating a 4th child and so this question has been on our minds.

I am the 4th of 5 kids (4 girls, 1 boy) and I LOVED growing up in a big family. We are all close in age and were/are very close (we are all in our 30s now). Every birthday was already a party and there was always something going on, someone to play with. We were slightly insular since we moved quite a bit and I always felt like my sisters were my closest friends. My family was almost a cliche of large, fun families -- we'd put on CCR and dance while we did dishes and we played board games as a family on the weekendS. We fought, too - but not a lot. It's a lot more complicated now that we are older, but I really appreciate having siblings to share responsibility for our parents (my dad has Alzheimer's and my mom has her own problems)...I can't imagine shouldering all their issues alone or splitting them with one sibling.

While I think it awesome to grow up in a large family, it's obviously a lot harder on the parents. Money was very tight, our house was chaotic (clean, but cluttered and loud) and my parents didn't spend an evening without kids for like 14 years. They always say they loved having a lot of kids, though, and they are still married, although they get on each other's nerves constantly

Now that I'm a parent, I appreciate peace and quiet and a clean, uncluttered house. I like to get out once in awhile with my DH. And I don't want to have to drive a giant, extended-cab van to fit the whole family.

So we're still undecided. I feel like 4 kids puts you into larger family territory...so our three kid family still feels neat and tidy.
post #11 of 72
I am also the oldest of 4 and we're pretty close in age. Right now we're 30, 28, 26, and 23. My sister and I are older and the younger two are my brothers.

I loved growing up in my family and would totally love to have 4 or 5 kids (DH is an only and is reluctant)

We had our moments of bickering sure, but overall I'd say sibling rivalry wasn't a problem. My parents emphasized the family as a unit. When one of us does something well then it's a good thing for all of us. And when someone in the family fails or has a hard time then the family is there to help them out and cushion the blow. My parents also made sure things didn't get blown out of proportion. For example, I can remember when I was 11 or 12 it was always an argument about who got to sit in the front seat of the car (not so much problem these days ) so my mom assigned each of us a day and we got to sit up front all day. Problem averted. Also my brothers tended to bicker more in close confines so both in the car and at the dinner table our normal seats put each of the boys next to one of the girls so the boys were separated.

They were also very good about letting us know that they loved each of us unconditionally. There was never a question in any of our minds that we were loved and wanted and there was no need to compete for our parents love and attention.

We are still close. My sister and I are best friends. I have honestly never had a friend closer to me than my sister. And she and my brother are currently roomates. They love living with each other and she is sad that he'll be moving out at the end of the summer to go to grad school in another state.
post #12 of 72
I wanted to add that it seems to be common that at two people want to stop having children. This makes sense to me. I found that to be bar none the hardest transition and the most work. Friends who have two children seem run ragged to me, because that's a common situation with two- to keep up the attention and make double what was done with one. It doesn't continue that way, ime. For us, three was a seamless transition and four was too.

Two children seems to be the time when many parents say, "WOW! I'm not adding to THIS!!!" But I think having four is waaaaaay easier than two. Even some of my friends who see how our family functions agree that it seems easier to have four than two.

One friend works in a daycare and brings her children so it will be easier to spend their days together. For her, six or eight is easier than two. Granted she's done with the group at 5pm, but she says that when she gets home, it's still way harder to care for two than six or eight and she'd rather have them all for 24 hrs.

At this point, I wouldn't bat an eye at having a fifth. I'm also not one of those women for whom child-rearing is personally fulfilling. It drains me, actually, and I need a creative outlet, separate from mothering, to be healthy. Having a big family just seems to me to be part of my life cycle, and not separate at all, so if there are more people who will join us, then that's how it will be.
post #13 of 72
Avery's Mama, I loved reading your post! Thanks for sharing. Other than the insane mother part it seems like you had an experience similar to what I see happening with our boys. They are very tight.
post #14 of 72
Quote:
It is not like having two children, doubled in chores and work. It is completely different, imo.
wanted to second that. I have eight children, and it is so completely different that I couldn't possible explain concisely how it's different.

The third was the hardest for ME to add, but not because of the children, because *I* didn't know that you didn't have to split attention, that I could just take it as it comes. With one, they get all your attention, because you don't know that kids need to have time alone just to figure stuff out. And with two, it's easy to split, half and half. But with three it's a different dynamic, and that was when I finally learned that my kids could figure things out on their own. They really do learn by what you model, not just in your own actions, but in your REactions to them.

I don't moderate children's squabbles, because 1) I couldn't possibly know all the intimate details in the interaction, 2) they don't really want me to fix it, they want me to empathize, and 3) people have the right to disagree. After all, they had no choice to live together, AND they are still figuring out how the world works, and then we expect them always to get along and be friends? That's insane! I do expect that people not get physically hurt.

I never taught manners to any of my kids, beyond expecting it. I have told them that saying please makes any person more happy to help, and saying thank you makes me more happy to help next time. our house isn't cluttered because everyone is expected to keep their stuff in their space if they aren't using it. It's not loud because it's expected that we take turns talking and use our inside voices (my biggest thing, because dh is from a big family and they ALL YELL OVER EACH OTHER. And turn the TV up louder. Then talk over the TV.

I love having a big family. I love watching the kids interact. They aren't on me all the time, they have each other. And I guess because we homeschool no one ever feels pressed for time with me. It happens all day. We have date nights with each kid alone, and dh and I have a date at least once a month (we got two last month because oldest DS wanted to babysit for dh's birthday) :
post #15 of 72
Quote:
Originally Posted by Juvysen View Post
Preggie - that was really interesting. That was kind of what I was envisioning... like maybe having more people around, the older ones kind of help the younger ones to some extent. Did you see a difference with "having to teach" your older ones manners, etc. and your younger ones just picking it up? Both my kids sort of picked up manners easily because that's how we talked to them (I assume), but my younger one seems to be more interested in the potty without our suggestion than our older one was....
No, it was the same as you. We just speak kindly and always have, so they do too. Of course not perfectly, but such that when an unkind interaction takes place, it stands out and we or they address it. There really isn't any teaching, just us being together and learning together. Certainly nothing like 'manners time' or 'use your manners words' has ever happened here.

Our oldest potty-learned at 18 months and then 2 weeks later decided he didn't care for it. Then ds2 told us at 25 months that he wanted to use the toilet from then on and he just walked in, took off his diaper, and did. At that point, ds1 decided to do so as well, since his younger brother did. The learning and encouragement goes in every direction. Our older boys have all learned new things from the youngest and this has always been the case, since we had a second baby. Of course, the older ones help the younger ones too. Learning and 'teaching by example' really does go in every direction here.

post #16 of 72
Thread Starter 
Quote:
don't moderate children's squabbles, because 1) I couldn't possibly know all the intimate details in the interaction, 2) they don't really want me to fix it, they want me to empathize, and 3) people have the right to disagree. After all, they had no choice to live together, AND they are still figuring out how the world works, and then we expect them always to get along and be friends? That's insane! I do expect that people not get physically hurt.
The getting hurt has been my problem, so far I agree... I don't believe in interrupting unless someone's getting hurt, but my kids still are in the hitting/biting age range
post #17 of 72
Multimomma, now I want eight children! Dh s an only child so, this has been a stretching experience for him, moreso than me. I already knew how to share and he had no idea what sharing is (he thought that lending was the same thing ).

Having more than a couple does really bring to light the differences between people. I expect them to disagree some of the time and there are times when two of them will be in seeming constant disagreement, but with so many, these disagreements just cannot go beyond what is safe and reasonable. Squabbling is sort of self-limiting, I guess.

We also live in a one bedroom cabin- 24'x26' and all sleep in the same room, so that might factor into our perception of the necessity for peace.
post #18 of 72
My mom grew up in a family of 10 kids. I grew up in a family of 6 kids. My co-worker/friend grew up in a family of 12 kids. My dd has friends with 6 and 7 kids in the family, respectively.

This is what I know about large families: there is often a sense of deprivation in the children. Often the deprivation is monetary---not enough food to eat, not enough clothing, not enough space, etc. (One friend of dd's was extremely surprised when I offered her a second helping of a meal because I could tell she was still hungry. She had no concept of being able to ask for more than what was originally put on your plate.)

Sometimes the deprivation isn't about money, but time and energy. The parents are still just two people.

If you want a very honest, in-depth look at both the good and bad of a large family, read the book The Color of Water: A Black Man's Tribute to His White Mother.

Also, google "peak oil" and then decide if you still want a bunch of mouths to feed in the future.


PS. Personally, I think 5+ kids (not just 3) is a "large" family.
post #19 of 72
I don't know, there was just my sister and me and we fought all the time. Drove our parents crazy. So I don't think having less kids is any guarantee of less sibling rivalry. In fact, I think we would have done well to have had another kid or two to dilute things a bit.
post #20 of 72
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by A&A View Post
My mom grew up in a family of 10 kids. I grew up in a family of 6 kids. My co-worker/friend grew up in a family of 12 kids. My dd has friends with 6 and 7 kids in the family, respectively.

This is what I know about large families: there is often a sense of deprivation in the children. Often the deprivation is monetary---not enough food to eat, not enough clothing, not enough space, etc. (One friend of dd's was extremely surprised when I offered her a second helping of a meal because I could tell she was still hungry. She had no concept of being able to ask for more than what was originally put on your plate.)

Sometimes the deprivation isn't about money, but time and energy. The parents are still just two people.

If you want a very honest, in-depth look at both the good and bad of a large family, read the book The Color of Water: A Black Man's Tribute to His White Mother.

Also, google "peak oil" and then decide if you still want a bunch of mouths to feed in the future.


PS. Personally, I think 5+ kids (not just 3) is a "large" family.
Yeah, my husband isn't happy about the peak oil possiblities... but, uh, if there's no oil to make condoms/other birth control... aren't more kids likely to happen anyway?

In the grand scheme of things, I agree - 5+kids is "large", not 3. My point was only that in my extended family, there's no one with even three... so I'm moving into uncharted territory, so to speak, for me
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Parenting
Mothering › Forums › Parenting › Talk to me about life in a large family...