Toddler Trouble.....Vent(Long)

[Aliyahsmommy]

What a day! My 23 month old daughter has been staying up way too late in my opinion. We start out the night with her cuddling in our bed while we all watch TV. She rarely falls asleep during this. Then I try to put her in her room and lately she cries. I give her 5 minutes or so to see if she stops and if she doesn't then she goes right back in our bed and we try again 15-30 minutes later. Well this has led to her going to bed between 9:30-10pm and she wakes usually at 7am or so.
Well this morning she woke closer to 6:30am and seemed fine, but it wasn't 5 minutes later that she was screaming and crying and I knew she was still tired as it had come out of nowhere and for no reason. I waited and tried to give her time and kept talking to her, but she was not getting any calmer. She had also taken off her diaper as it was wet from the night. Finally I ended up having to force her to put a new diaper on and carry her up to my bed crying and fighting me and I put on cartoons and left the room.
I was frustrated and needed time to recuperate and I knew I wasn't going to be able to calm her down, she just needed to do so in her own time. I hated the fact that she was so upset and I was hoping she would fall back asleep. Well she was quiet within 5 minutes and so I left her for about 30 minutes and then went upstairs and she was watching TV and happy as can be.
Fast forward an hour later and it was time to leave. I filled a cup with water for her because we were going to the zoo and she wanted milk. Here comes another tantrum, a distraction, a smaller tantrum, and then I finally poured out the water and gave her milk. Suppose I could have given her milk the first time she asked to avoid this.
Then comes the zoo where she refuses to walk and throws a tantrum every time I try to put her down even for a second. Mind you I am 5 months pregnant and dying lol! She usually walks just fine at the zoo, but of course today was not any normal day. So then we are ready to leave and she wants to ride with my sister, but my sister has no room for her or car seat. Here comes another crying tantrum and us trying to explain to her. I had to pick her up and carry her into our car crying and fighting again. I put her in the backseat and let her have some time until she was ready to get into her car seat. After some discussion and minor negotiations she did get in and we buckled her.
Not long after comes her screaming and crying in the backseat and then throwing her binky and then crying because she no longer has it. I am driving so there was nothing I could do and no talking to her at this point. I had to turn the radio up and just drive. She fell asleep about 10 minutes later and then we arrived home where she woke up. I gave her the binky, but she didn't want that one and then came another tantrum. I again had to carry her up to her room and put her in bed crying and fighting me. Less than 5 minutes later and she was asleep.
It was just a rough day for both of us and I feel bad that I yelled a few times at her. I also feel bad that she was so cranky and was having so much turmoil today. I just needed to vent and I feel much better. So thank you to anyone who takes the time to read this

[Evergreen]

I think you know what she needs- more sleep! It won't solve everything but a majority of toddler tantrums are compounded by 1. hunger and 2. lack of sleep. Honestly, if it were me I'd try putting her down (in your bed) around 7 or 7:30 then when she is good and asleep moving her to either a toddler bed on the floor or her own room. My almost three year old sometimes sleeps with me, sometimes by herself but generally we start out with the two of us in one bed until she is asleep. Get into a routine. Bath, brush, book, bed is a good one- and don't deviate if at all possible. She might not go from 10:30 til 7:30 right away, but if you can gradually try to get her to bed at an earlier interval it will help. It did with my youngest. Sleep begets sleep. I never realized her refusal to sleep was actually exacerbated by the fact that I thought because she didn't want to sleep she didn't need as much sleep. She now goes to bed at 7:30 and sleeps until 5:30 with an hour of nurse/cuddle time before getting up as well as a two hour nap. She still isn't the happiest child but it's night and day from where she was.

[mom2grrls]

Along with an earlier bedtime, i'd skip the TV before bed. Does she normally nap?

[biennourri]

My sympathies. We have a 25 month old and many tantrums as well (sometimes on both sides, I have to admit). I agree with sleep begets sleep. It can be hard to figure out how to get them down, though. Elizabeth Pantley's No Cry Sleep Solution for toddlers makes a point that it's hard to put them down if they aren't actually sleepy. We just started letting our daugther play ball or dance or have some kind of energetic time after dinner and before her bath. It seems to have helped somewhat, though between molars coming in and it staying light until really late it is still a challenge.

Remember this too shall pass.

[RollerCoasterMama]

I had a whole lot fewer sleep issues with my DS (~30 months) once I quit trying to have him settle and fall asleep on his own. He was GREAT at it in the crib, never cried...just routine, kisses, lights out and he chatted to himself for a half hour and conked out. Once we were in a big boy bed, it got more complicated. As bedtime creeped towards 9:30 and behavior was suffering, I finally started doing some reading...and came to the decision that I didn't need to teach him to fall asleep on his own. I started laying down with him on his own bed until he fell asleep. It immediately bought us an extra hour of sleep. Recently, he's been asking to be alone for the last bit, though he sometimes still wants me with him until he falls asleep. So things have been gradually changing with his needs, but it's currently: routine, snuggle together on his bed or mine. If he settles and falls asleep, fine. If he wants to fall asleep by himself, that's fine. But I try to limit the back-and-forth. I'll respect the request, but not back and forth between beds, etc.

He's doing really well now! And if he finds he needs a little extra mama-time, he sweetly asks me "Mommy, do you want to come on the bed?" MUCH better!

So, read the book PP suggested. Be flexible, but also consider laying with your kiddo until they're asleep. Maybe that's what they need. I know it made our life SOOOOO much easier!!

If you're interested, I blogged our fun trial and errors with moving to a big bed:
http://lyneya.wordpress.com/2009/02/...ove-you-mommy/

[Aliyahsmommy]

Yes she usually naps 1 1/2 to 3 hours. Skipping the TV before bed is not really an option in our home as that is exactly what my husband needs to wind down before bed.

Originally Posted by mom2grrls

Along with an earlier bedtime, i'd skip the TV before bed. Does she normally nap?

[Aliyahsmommy]

I had thought of laying with her, and that is what we do in our bed before we put her into her bed. Problem is that she seems to want to play rather than settle most nights. I thought also of laying in her room, but she usually decides to stare at me rather than go to sleep. Almost like I am more of a distraction than anything else. The last couple of nights have gone much better with her sleeping in her bed, though she still has gone to bed late.

Tonight I plan on starting bedtime at 8:30 by reading a book in her room and then leaving and seeing how it goes. It worked today at nap-time with only about a minute of whining/crying.

Originally Posted by 3901sca

I had a whole lot fewer sleep issues with my DS (~30 months) once I quit trying to have him settle and fall asleep on his own. He was GREAT at it in the crib, never cried...just routine, kisses, lights out and he chatted to himself for a half hour and conked out. Once we were in a big boy bed, it got more complicated. As bedtime creeped towards 9:30 and behavior was suffering, I finally started doing some reading...and came to the decision that I didn't need to teach him to fall asleep on his own. I started laying down with him on his own bed until he fell asleep. It immediately bought us an extra hour of sleep. Recently, he's been asking to be alone for the last bit, though he sometimes still wants me with him until he falls asleep. So things have been gradually changing with his needs, but it's currently: routine, snuggle together on his bed or mine. If he settles and falls asleep, fine. If he wants to fall asleep by himself, that's fine. But I try to limit the back-and-forth. I'll respect the request, but not back and forth between beds, etc.

He's doing really well now! And if he finds he needs a little extra mama-time, he sweetly asks me "Mommy, do you want to come on the bed?" MUCH better!

So, read the book PP suggested. Be flexible, but also consider laying with your kiddo until they're asleep. Maybe that's what they need. I know it made our life SOOOOO much easier!!

If you're interested, I blogged our fun trial and errors with moving to a big bed:
http://lyneya.wordpress.com/2009/02/...ove-you-mommy/

[Aliyahsmommy]

Well this has worked two nights in a row We read a few books and then say goodnight. She fusses for about 10 seconds and then goes to sleep for the whole night. I hope this keeps up! Plus she has been getting enough sleep and has been in a good mood and had little to no tantrums for the last two days

Originally Posted by Aliyahsmommy

I had thought of laying with her, and that is what we do in our bed before we put her into her bed. Problem is that she seems to want to play rather than settle most nights. I thought also of laying in her room, but she usually decides to stare at me rather than go to sleep. Almost like I am more of a distraction than anything else. The last couple of nights have gone much better with her sleeping in her bed, though she still has gone to bed late.

Tonight I plan on starting bedtime at 8:30 by reading a book in her room and then leaving and seeing how it goes. It worked today at nap-time with only about a minute of whining/crying.

[mamadelbosque]

Around that age we were just starting to transition out of our bed and into the crib (and then shortly into a 'big boy bed'). We don't do TV before bed (thats more of a morning thing for us, generally), but instead read books. At some point over the last few months (DS' 27, nearly 28 months now), we started a routine of reading 3-5 books (depending on what time it is when we go upstairs and how long they are) of DS' choosing, followed by "I love you because your you", then "Guess how much I love you" and finally "Goodnight Moon". I really think its helped DS immensly, because he knows when its 'bedtime' and then when its really time to sleep by virtue of which book we're reading. And, DS no longer fights sleep... especially if he's had a good nap (from 2-4ish, usually). If not, he tends to be cranky and upset and just not a pleasant guy.

[RollerCoasterMama]

Originally Posted by Aliyahsmommy

Well this has worked two nights in a row We read a few books and then say goodnight. She fusses for about 10 seconds and then goes to sleep for the whole night. I hope this keeps up! Plus she has been getting enough sleep and has been in a good mood and had little to no tantrums for the last two days

That's awesome! Isn't it amazing what an extra hour of sleep will do?!?!? I got my cheerful little guy back once we were able to bump bedtime up an hour! There are still relapses, but they're the exception instead of the rule.

I'm so glad you're working out a routine!!

[MamaBug]

I am so glad I found this thread! My dd is 27 months and sleeps with me. We have had getting to bed issues for a little while now and I am about to lose my mind! I am going to take the routine suggestion to heart! I have 2 sons that are 11 and 9 and when they were little they also slept with us, however we didn't have a TV in the room, so we laid with them and they usually fell asleep within minutes....now with a TV in the room dd will cry to watch it.....I think it's time to get it out of the room, read her favorite books and lights out...mommy could use more sleep too! Thanks for this!

[elisheva]

Originally Posted by Aliyahsmommy

Yes she usually naps 1 1/2 to 3 hours. Skipping the TV before bed is not really an option in our home as that is exactly what my husband needs to wind down before bed.

I hear what you are saying, but could it be that your dd just finds it too stimulating to be in an environment with a TV on? My ds1 needs darkness and quiet to really let go and give in to sleep. Is your DH winding down worth the battles you are fighting day after day? Can he wait until she is asleep (maybe look at a magazine or whatever) before turning on the TV?

[sunshadow]

Originally Posted by Aliyahsmommy

Yes she usually naps 1 1/2 to 3 hours. Skipping the TV before bed is not really an option in our home as that is exactly what my husband needs to wind down before bed.

Put her to bed and then turn on the tv? Have him watch in a room while you go and read to her? Is she watching shows your husband watches? I would recommend the book "Into the mind of Babes"

[Aliyahsmommy]

*Update*

I can honestly say problem solved. Aliyah now knows that when we say lets go read your books, that it means it is bedtime. Occasionally she will cry/tantrum on the way to her room, but it only takes a minute in her bed before she is calm and excited to read her books. She gets to choose if mommy reads or daddy reads and I know she enjoys having that choice. We generally tend to read the same two books every night so she knows what to expect. She will say "dragon book" and then after we read that she will say "tiger book." We then kiss her and say goodnight and do not hear another peep out of her. It seems that the 5 minutes of reading is enough time for her to calm down and be ready for sleep. We have still been able to do our TV time/cuddle time and use the reading to calm her down before bed She has stopped throwing tantrums during the day for the most part as she is getting enough sleep and that seems to be her main trigger!

Thanks for all the replies!

[MamaBug]

Glad to hear you worked it out!

[Deer Hunter]

I have noticed that with one of my friend's children--I watch her sometimes--it helps for her to do an activity that is very stimulating and causes her to be active. It is when she sits around watching TV or stays in the house that she is very tough to get to bed at night, since she still has all that unused energy bottled up.

Since you are five months pregnant, it would be hard for you to participate probably, so she could have toys that encourage her to be active, such as a sit and spin. You could also have her chase a ball. You could sit on the couch, throw the ball around, and ask her to run it back to you. Could you have her outdoors in a child's swimming pool? Being in the pool always wears out a child. Also, how about a swingset? Is there a theme park nearby that she could go to? There are things for tots to do there. If so, get a season pass and take her there to get worn out so the last thing she will even WANT to do is fight at bedtime. I'm just trying to suggest anything you can do that will not put too much of a strain on you, so things will work out well for all of you.

The best solution for all children is to wear them out, so when bedtime comes around, they are good and tired. This is what my mom did with us as well. She'd take us swimming during the day, have us play outdoors for long intervals, and go on outings. Whatever she could do to make us good and tired, she did. There was not a whole lot of sitting around for us because she wanted no trouble at bedtime. I hope that these suggestions help. Try them and see. Happy sleeping.