or Connect
Mothering › Mothering Forums › Mom › Parenting › Toddler screaming for over an hour in a store
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Toddler screaming for over an hour in a store - Page 9

post #161 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrs joe bubby View Post
Well, not questioning the difference between an adult and a baby. What I was getting at is I DO have a disability that would be seriously affected by listening an hour of prolonged screaming in an enclosed place. I would not be able to complete my shopping that day and get food for my family. Just questioning why the adults with the screaming person have rights but according to some posters, I do not. That is very confusing to me.
that must be really difficult i can only speak for myself and i know this is probably going to sound selfish, though i don't mean to be this way, but if i am out somewhere and ds starts to melt down the possibility of someone being unable to deal with the noise he is making is totally not going to cross my mind. i have a screaming toddler in the grocery store and i need to get food.. there is no way in he!! i am going to prolong the outing by taking him outside unless it is absolutely necessary. it is hard enough for me to get us both out the door and to the store one time... it would be a week before we got to the store again. half the time when that happens i don't end up with half the stuff i need (and i do end up with a bunch of stuff i don't) b/c i am so distracted by him that i can't focus on what i am doing.

i am not sure how we are all supposed to take every possible situation into consideration when we are out in public. i guess i am of the opinion that when you are in a public place there are going to be things that are beyond your control. i don't know how we would accommodate everyone.. look at this thread... you have a disability that makes it impossible to tolerate constant loud noise, other people have children with special needs who are more prone to tantrums and meltdowns that would escalate if they were picked up or taken outside, i am a sahm with ADD and toddler who doesn't like to be confined to a cart.... how do all of us coexist if we all expect to have 'rights' that are at odds with each other?
post #162 of 186
i have realised something.

how much being a mother has changed me.

how it has really brought compassion into my life.

if this incident happened before i was a parent, i would probably be really judgemental.

but these days it brings up compassion. judgement does not even enter into my thoughts. even things that are hard for me to see - extremes.

i always see anyone as trying to do the best they can at that particular point.

plus having volunteered in organisations where i have seen parents with two three jobs adn still trying to take care of their children - i am so sad and MAD at the government for not supporting our parents so that they CAN be parents.

if i had been at that store (and i have been in similar situations) i would have held a 'support thought' in my heart for the whole family. for the child who was crying and for the parents who had to be there inspite of the crying. and if i passed those parents i would have given them my best 'i soooo understand what you are going thru' compassionate look. perhaps they had no food and chose this time when there were less people in the store to do the shopping.

btw it would never have entered my mind its late for a child. till 6 my dd never went to bed anytime before midnight.
post #163 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrs joe bubby View Post
Well, not questioning the difference between an adult and a baby. What I was getting at is I DO have a disability that would be seriously affected by listening an hour of prolonged screaming in an enclosed place. I would not be able to complete my shopping that day and get food for my family. Just questioning why the adults with the screaming person have rights but according to some posters, I do not. That is very confusing to me.
Then you do what you have to do and whats right for you. There have been times I haven't been able to finish shopping either, I've left carts in the store and left (and gone to another store). Not due to screaming but due to anxiety or overstimulating because its too busy. My needs do not trump the needs of others, therefor I remove myself from the situation if I can't handle whatever it is that is triggering me.
post #164 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1littlebit View Post
i am not sure how we are all supposed to take every possible situation into consideration when we are out in public. i guess i am of the opinion that when you are in a public place there are going to be things that are beyond your control. i don't know how we would accommodate everyone.. look at this thread... you have a disability that makes it impossible to tolerate constant loud noise, other people have children with special needs who are more prone to tantrums and meltdowns that would escalate if they were picked up or taken outside, i am a sahm with ADD and toddler who doesn't like to be confined to a cart.... how do all of us coexist if we all expect to have 'rights' that are at odds with each other?
I really liked this as it really echoes what I've been thinking lately about so many societal issues at large--sometimes you have conflicts in which one person's right to say something infringes upon someone else's right not to hear it, ya know? I don't have any answers to that other than at that point you sometimes have to just take care of your own business (whether that is having a less than ideal shopping trip or removing yourself from the situation) and just chalk it up to a bad day. I guess I just feel like if you have no idea why a child is crying and you can't think of anyway to help and the noise is really bothering you, well, all you can take care of in that situation is your end of the equation. I think it would be a better world if more often compassion would take precedence over rights.
post #165 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1littlebit View Post
i am not sure how we are all supposed to take every possible situation into consideration when we are out in public. i guess i am of the opinion that when you are in a public place there are going to be things that are beyond your control. i don't know how we would accommodate everyone.. look at this thread... you have a disability that makes it impossible to tolerate constant loud noise, other people have children with special needs who are more prone to tantrums and meltdowns that would escalate if they were picked up or taken outside, i am a sahm with ADD and toddler who doesn't like to be confined to a cart.... how do all of us coexist if we all expect to have 'rights' that are at odds with each other?
This is exactly it.

Each side seems to be saying "well I can't because of this and you should because of this..." and no matter how much they say the other should be being non judgmental or open they themselves aren't. We're human is what it comes down to. But I think we all need to step back and take everyone here into consideration.
post #166 of 186
i am always surprised about what rights people think they should have... and what rights they think other people should not have. it really comes down to intolerance and entitlement. people in the US imparticular are very into their 'rights' and i think this is so dangerous.

take NIP.. most of us would agree that a mother has the right to NIP... but there are people who think it is their right to not see a woman NIP. not to different from this thread... does a crying child have a right to be in public or do people have the right to not listen to a crying child? do parents have the right to refuse vaccinations or do the parents of a vaccinated child have the right to not have unvaxed kids in daycare with their kids? IMO rights are restricted to your own actions... someone who doesn't like NIP has the right to avert their eyes or leave yk? of course not everything is that strait forward but it is a pattern i have noticed and find very disturbing
post #167 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1littlebit View Post
i am always surprised about what rights people think they should have... and what rights they think other people should not have. it really comes down to intolerance and entitlement. people in the US imparticular are very into their 'rights' and i think this is so dangerous.

take NIP.. most of us would agree that a mother has the right to NIP... but there are people who think it is their right to not see a woman NIP. not to different from this thread... does a crying child have a right to be in public or do people have the right to not listen to a crying child? do parents have the right to refuse vaccinations or do the parents of a vaccinated child have the right to not have unvaxed kids in daycare with their kids? IMO rights are restricted to your own actions... someone who doesn't like NIP has the right to avert their eyes or leave yk? of course not everything is that strait forward but it is a pattern i have noticed and find very disturbing
I agree.

We just get so absorbed in ourselves and in our own situations it becomes a battle rather than living life and allowing others to live theres. We really do feel like every little thing must be a fight to the finish. We must advocate for this and this and that at every waking moment. Whatever happened to just live and let live? We don't have to make a statement every single time. If you hear a child crying and supposedly being allowed to cry by his parents why is it so important something be said or done? Same goes for if it is your child doing the screaming and someone comes to you with a nasty look or word or two- why does anything need to be argued at that point? It is what it is. Who knows, maybe that person has had a horrible day in which their mother died and wanted to shop in peace. You really do never know. But we point the finger "well you shouldn't be doing this!" when in truth who are we really to say with issues like this? On all fronts- excepting our own- we have no idea. So why not just focus on our own?

I think NIP is a great example. It's like we can't even just sit and nurse our babies in public because we have one side insisting it be a form of activism every last time ("don't use a cover or your feeding into their over sexualization of breasts" "do it where people can see so they know it's normal" etc) and then those who don't want to see it at all and deem it inappropriate for all. Uh why can't it just be about nursing our kids? I am not interested in drawing battle lines when my kids are hungry in public or cranky or whatever else. I just am doing what I need to do. That's what it comes down to or at least should.

When you need to go shopping just do your shopping. There are going to be inconvenience and people acting like jerks. Such is life. But you know their rights are no different than your own and yours just aren't as important as theirs.
post #168 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1littlebit View Post
i am always surprised about what rights people think they should have... and what rights they think other people should not have. it really comes down to intolerance and entitlement. people in the US, in particular, are very into their 'rights' and i think this is so dangerous.
:

I have been saying the same thing, particularly about 'USA-ans', for a very long time. Intolerance and a sense of entitlement are big problems in this 'me-first' country.
post #169 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by ~Purity♥Lake~ View Post
:

I have been saying the same thing, particularly about 'USA-ans', for a very long time. Intolerance and a sense of entitlement are big problems in this 'me-first' country.
You really rocked the nutshelling here!

Needless to say I agree.
post #170 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magella View Post
I don't think I'm entitled to shop anywhere without hearing children cry. All sorts of things happen when I'm shopping that bother me. I've found myself quite disturbed by adults who are unaccompanied by kids. The fact is, they all have as much right to be there as I do. It's a grocery store. It's loud. All sorts of people are there. Things happen. I'm not entitled to a peacefully zen shopping environment every time.

I don't enjoy hearing kids cry, who does? I'd be willing to bet the people most disturbed by it were those parents.

Reading this has made me so sad.
I agree. To heck with anyone else. I am confident in how I parent, and if anyone wants to judge me, let 'em.

Quote:
Originally Posted by purplemoon View Post
Word.

Adults bother me more mostly. The cellphone screaming (talking) constantly so I can't hear myself think, the cart bumper, the person who should have bathed, whatever. Shopping was and has never been my spa day.

And the clarification by the OP is probably that these people were jerks, but from so many posts and so much misery from moms about leaving the house, I think we all have learned a bit more compassion in general.

That's a good thing.
I agree.

Quote:
Originally Posted by magstphil View Post
The judgment on this thread. :

These thread always make me laugh. You got a poster venting about whatever not necessarily saying the parents are evil or horrible or need to be shot but being judgmental, yes. We're human, it's what we do. But then you get the real judgment- "how dare you judge! Why I think I am going to sit here and judge you harshly for judging." and that is different how?.... And it often gets blown out of proportion as if this mom said in her OP these people should have their child ripped away from them.




We can't just leave it at "I disagree. This could be a different way to look at it _____"? Why the personal comments about the posters who are suspicious/annoyed by the behavior in the OP? We can't just give the benefit of the doubt in both cases and look on both sides?

I dunno I just think maybe we should all take a step back and really think about the people involved on all sides.
Yep.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rainyday View Post
Who said anything about taking her to a corner? I said take her outside. And I still stand by it. If I saw you and your partner wandering the store for at least an hour while your child screamed hysterically, and you both seemed like normal, functioning adults holding a conversation (like the OP heard), then, yep, I'd judge. And I rarely judge people with screaming kids in stores. I only get judgemental when I see someone being incredibly inconsiderate of either their child or every single other person in that store in really rare circumstances like the OP's. Parent by herself with screaming kid? Nope, I don't judge that (unless I see parent mocking the child or something similar). Parent who seems zoned out pushing screaming child through store without interacting with it? I don't judge that. But with two adults who are functional enough to walk and talk normally, I can't imagine the scenario where they both must be in that store together with the screaming child for an hour. For 20 minutes? Sure, I can come up with scenarios for that one - but an entire hour doesn't say to me that the parents were rushing to get some essentials or even rushing to get the week's groceries.
Really???? What if the parents had no car? What if it were raining? Or snowing? Would you banish a child to inclement weather for your own comfort? And how do you know anything about the functioning ability of the adults? All you can see is a superficial assessment from a grocery shopping perspective, and that's hardly enough to make any kind of diagnosis.
post #171 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by magstphil View Post
I agree.

We just get so absorbed in ourselves and in our own situations it becomes a battle rather than living life and allowing others to live theres. We really do feel like every little thing must be a fight to the finish. We must advocate for this and this and that at every waking moment. Whatever happened to just live and let live? We don't have to make a statement every single time. If you hear a child crying and supposedly being allowed to cry by his parents why is it so important something be said or done? Same goes for if it is your child doing the screaming and someone comes to you with a nasty look or word or two- why does anything need to be argued at that point? It is what it is. Who knows, maybe that person has had a horrible day in which their mother died and wanted to shop in peace. You really do never know. But we point the finger "well you shouldn't be doing this!" when in truth who are we really to say with issues like this? On all fronts- excepting our own- we have no idea. So why not just focus on our own?

I think NIP is a great example. It's like we can't even just sit and nurse our babies in public because we have one side insisting it be a form of activism every last time ("don't use a cover or your feeding into their over sexualization of breasts" "do it where people can see so they know it's normal" etc) and then those who don't want to see it at all and deem it inappropriate for all. Uh why can't it just be about nursing our kids? I am not interested in drawing battle lines when my kids are hungry in public or cranky or whatever else. I just am doing what I need to do. That's what it comes down to or at least should.

When you need to go shopping just do your shopping. There are going to be inconvenience and people acting like jerks. Such is life. But you know their rights are no different than your own and yours just aren't as important as theirs.
I've never seen anyone say you MUST refuse to cover up, every time you nurse it needs to be a form of activism, etc. I've seen people say they do not want to cover up nor be told to do so by others, but I've never seen what you are describing.

And I think the difference btw NIP and this situation is that people perceive the child as suffering. I mean, I don't agree with the OP's interventions, but I also don't go along with the 'no judgment ever' when it gets into territory in which infants or children are being treated poorly, and we are supposed to ignore it or be judgmental. Kwim?
post #172 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by thismama View Post
but I also don't go along with the 'no judgment ever' when it gets into territory in which infants or children are being treated poorly, and we are supposed to ignore it or be judgmental. Kwim?
i have always wondered about this. i don't really get the whole no judgement thing.. mostly b/c i think everyone judges... i don't know how you wouldn't .. i mean every post in this thread that disagrees with the OP is just telling her to reach a different conclusion when she judges.. not to not judge at all.

but i have noticed that there is a tendency towards minding your own business, not judging, and assuming the best. if i could think of a thread title i would start one but i would love to know if everyone thinks you should always assume the best and or what. i kind of want to know how people just don't judge.. that doesn't really make sense to me.
post #173 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1littlebit View Post
i have always wondered about this. i don't really get the whole no judgement thing.. mostly b/c i think everyone judges... i don't know how you wouldn't .. i mean every post in this thread that disagrees with the OP is just telling her to reach a different conclusion when she judges.. not to not judge at all.

but i have noticed that there is a tendency towards minding your own business, not judging, and assuming the best. if i could think of a thread title i would start one but i would love to know if everyone thinks you should always assume the best and or what. i kind of want to know how people just don't judge.. that doesn't really make sense to me.

Yeah, we all make judgments, all the time and there is nothing wrong with it.
It is natural and healthy and in many cases keep us and others safe from harm.
I don't know when having good judgment became a bad thing.

I don't think the 'bad' comes from making a sensible judgment.
I think the 'bad' thing would be how you choose to use the information.

We all make judgments and we should be.
I'd be afraid when we all stop thinking for ourselves, instead blindly following the crowd with our brainwashed responses.
post #174 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by thismama View Post
I've never seen anyone say you MUST refuse to cover up, every time you nurse it needs to be a form of activism, etc. I've seen people say they do not want to cover up nor be told to do so by others, but I've never seen what you are describing.
There have been threads here on MDC saying this very thing. Try Lactivism though they may be locked and gone as they got heated. Though you can ask some of the conservative Christian mamas as they were there defending covering.



Pretty much just : to the two above posts.
post #175 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by thismama View Post
830 pm means nothing. I was out shopping with my own kids until that time last night. Mine go to bed at 10. There is no magic *ding ding ding* that makes kids exhausted by 8pm.
agreed. the time of day wouldn't faze me. kids have different bedtimes.

the fact that the kid had 2 parents present does suggest one of them could've taken him out. then again, maybe they had been dealing with a screaming kid all day (teething/sick/who knows), and neither one of them could be left alone with him anymore because they were both about to snap...kind of like how when DD is screaming her head off in the bathtub, sometimes i have to have DH with me (or vice versa)--just for moral support.

sure, it isn't ideal to let him scream like that, but without more background info we can't say for sure it wasn't the best option they had.
post #176 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by pinksprklybarefoot View Post
I try not to judge other parents too harshly - I just don't have enough information. Who knows what is going on in their lives that necessitates a large grocery shop at 8:30 PM? Heck, who knows if they were even both parents of the child? It could have been the child's mom and her brother (who is not good with kids), and he is taking her grocery shopping because she doesn't have a car. And maybe she doesn't have a car because her husband was just killed in a car accident and their car was totaled. In that case, maybe they thought it would be better to just power through the shopping, kid screaming or not, because the uncle isn't willing to take the child outside, but also doesn't know what groceries to buy. And if things are this bad, your screaming child is just one more thing on top of a big pile of crap that has just happened.
i think you should write tv shows --this is really elaborate and interesting. point well taken!
post #177 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magella View Post
Not all kids have different cries, though. One of mine had the same cry for everything, and it was the "someone is ripping my arms off" kind of cry.
yes, yes, yes! mine cries like that! i've always felt deficient as a mother that i can't discern her cries, but it's always HORRIBLE, like she's being tortured, no matter what it's about! this made me laugh so hard i almost peed my pants, btw
post #178 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jennifer Z View Post
Your "right" to shop in quiet does not outweigh the actual, true rights of people who are disabled (and their caregivers) to participate in life and shop without being criticized, degraded and hassled. For those of you who would actually have the audacity to complain to the store and "take your business elsewhere", you are acting like the people who refused to eat someplace because they "allowed" a black person to eat there. It is truly disgusting.
this is a really interesting perspective. thank you for sharing it, and i agree with you.
post #179 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeguard View Post
Can't say I'm sympathetic. With two sets of hands someone could have taken that poor child out of the store (regardless of the reason for the tears) to at the very least show some respect for everyone else in the store. Unacceptable in my books.

I agree
post #180 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1littlebit View Post
that must be really difficult i can only speak for myself and i know this is probably going to sound selfish, though i don't mean to be this way, but if i am out somewhere and ds starts to melt down the possibility of someone being unable to deal with the noise he is making is totally not going to cross my mind. i have a screaming toddler in the grocery store and i need to get food.. there is no way in he!! i am going to prolong the outing by taking him outside unless it is absolutely necessary. it is hard enough for me to get us both out the door and to the store one time... it would be a week before we got to the store again. half the time when that happens i don't end up with half the stuff i need (and i do end up with a bunch of stuff i don't) b/c i am so distracted by him that i can't focus on what i am doing.

i am not sure how we are all supposed to take every possible situation into consideration when we are out in public. i guess i am of the opinion that when you are in a public place there are going to be things that are beyond your control. i don't know how we would accommodate everyone.. look at this thread... you have a disability that makes it impossible to tolerate constant loud noise, other people have children with special needs who are more prone to tantrums and meltdowns that would escalate if they were picked up or taken outside, i am a sahm with ADD and toddler who doesn't like to be confined to a cart.... how do all of us coexist if we all expect to have 'rights' that are at odds with each other?

I don't have an answer to your questions... but thanks for your kind reply and enlightening answer.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Parenting
Mothering › Mothering Forums › Mom › Parenting › Toddler screaming for over an hour in a store