Newbie - Where To Start???

[SandyMom]

Hi All,
I am new to all this - but strongly suspect food allergies in my 8 yr old dd.
Her ped is clueless about this stuff and I'm on my own trying to figure things out.
Dd has low thyroid function (ped doesn't think it's low - but I kniw it is by her lab tests, symptoms, family history) and she has strange bouts of nausea and vomiting in the morning sometimes. No fever, pain, infection, or anything. She eats the same as the rest of us. She also clears her throat constantly - it's not a tick - she has mucus in there - but no runny nose. I suspect that the draining mucus may be what makes her vomit . Some ppl have suggested reflux, dairy, and wheat allergies? Low stomach acid?
I am looking for a place to start...

If she has food intolerances what is the best way to test for these? As I said, her ped just shakes his head at me when I bring up allergies - so if I try to find another practitioner that our insurance will cover (Group Health) what am I looking for? An ND? Or allergist?
Is there a way I can tell on my own if she's allergic to certain foods?
I'm searching around this forum and reading up but would greatly appreciate any input to get me started down the right path here.
TIA!
Sandy

[tanyalynn]

How's your health? (I'm assuming biological daughter, let me know if I'm wrong there). Your health history, ups, down, what you tend to see a doctor for or treat on your own? I used to be hypothyroid.

You can tell on your own if you eliminate the problematic foods and symptoms get better. It gets trickier if there are lots of foods, and at age 8, you'd need to get your daughter's buy-in to do an elimination diet--either start by cutting out the top allergens (gluten, dairy, soy, maybe corn which is challenging), maybe eggs, after that guess and check to see what's problematic. Or (a lot harder with an older child, I think) cut the diet WAY back to include only a handful of foods, and then start re-introducing foods. That's a lot of work and I'd think would be hard for a kid.

I've never done testing, but our list of problematic foods is fairly short.

Ack, need to run, others will have good ideas. WuWei has a nice getting started page, and you could/should read over whoMe's page here, detoxification is actually very related to food intolerances....
http://www.detoxpuzzle.com/methyl.php

[mamafish9]

My first thing would be to test stomach acid by doing the beet test - if she eats just beets, does she have pink pee after? That generally indicates low stomach acid (although no pink pee doesn't necessarily mean you pass!).

We have found that addressing stuff early in the digestive process (kefir, fermented foods to increase stomach acid, and digestive enzymes) have really made a difference for things like sniffly nose and several of DS' food intolerances (in this case, if he digests the foods properly, he's not intolerant). And I hope that better digestion and improved nutrient absorption will really help with healing his gut and resolving his remaining food intolerances over time.

[riomidwife]

I'd start by slowly eliminating the most common allergens. You can do testing, but it often is inconclusive, whereas eliminating and trialing foods gives you tangible results. If she has
"true" IgE allergies those will show more readily in testing. You can search the forum for "testing" "tests" "IgG" etc. and you'll pull up a lot of informative threads that way. It can be so daunting at first, but bravo to you for following your mama instincts! Most everyone here can tell you how unhelpful conventional western care providers can be with all this. A good starter book to check out is Is This Your Child, the food one as I think there are two.

[SandyMom]

Thank you SO MUCH for the thoughtful replies. I really appreciate it.
I will look for that book, riomidwife.

mamafish9, and TanyaLopez,
We have a loooong history of thyroid disorders in our family both Grave's and Hashimoto's. I have Hashi's and last year had a massive adrenal crisis and have been on bio-identical cortisol replacement since. I cannot tolerate any thyroid hormone w/o going hyper, but have gotten hypo symptoms under control for the most part by fixing low iron, b12 and vit D.

I had to pitch a fit to get ped to test dd' s thyroid - here are her labs:
TSH = 3.41 (.3 - 5.5)
T4 = 1.18 (.9 - 1.8)
T3 total = 227 (70 - 170)

He refused to do anti's b/c he insists her labs are fine.
She is 8 yrs old and weighs 100 lbs.
She also has gray hairs! Not a lot - but enough that the hairdresser noticed.

I tried some hcl b/c I suspected low stomach acid in myself - I can take 3 capsules w/o feeling any heat at all. I haven't tried taking more yet.

I guess we should try an elimination diet - but the trick is there doesn't seem to be any instant symptoms from the foods we eat - kwim? It's not like we eat gluten or dairy and get stomach aches or rashes right away - it's more like it could be causing chronic things like mucus which eventually leads to nausea...

I guess we just have to give it a try and watch for overall improvements in health?

Thank you again for the input - I appreciate it so much.
Sandy

ETA:
Dd also gets hives on her upper thighs occasionally - does this mean high histamine levels? If so, what does that tell me?
She had an innocent heart murmur that was not detectable anymore at her last visit to md - I'm wondering if magnesium supps helped w/ that or if she just outgrew it?
I'm still trying to puzzle all this out!!!

[tanyalynn]

I'm not sure what hives look like, could it be keratosis pilaris? It's a bumpy skin thing, it often shows up either on upper thighs or upper arms. whoMe's site mentions kp, and we've had several long threads here about it.

I was about to write that I thought there were some benign heart murmurs that just went away in childhood, but then I realized that that pedi visit was for my daughter (back when she was an infant, doc even said it was likely transient and benign), and she has a very high magnesium need. She still (age 5yo) has trouble falling asleep without supplemental mag each night, needs much more than my son. So I won't share an anecdote about a benign heart murmur going away on its own, now I'm left wondering if it was mag related too. I figured out the mag when she was a toddler and was the energizer bunny each night, but exhausted. My heart used to have an irregular beat--sometimes it would skip, sometimes I'd get 2 beats close together, and that's gone, except once recently it recurred and I interpreted that as a need for more magnesium, and then it was gone the next day. I think it was a long-term magnesium issue for me.

With delayed stuff like that, I'd probably cut gluten and dairy, and not add in soy (maybe cut it too) and see what happens over the course of the next month or so. I cut it for the whole family cause I felt horrible and I'm ruthless like that but it's been good for all of us. And I'd try to do things supportive of good digestion--we like homemade kimchee, other folks like kefir, you could do both.

I've seen grey hair linked to low zinc (zinc is one of the key minerals for thyroid function) and to adrenal fatigue. I _think_ my zinc is getting better, but my grey is still getting worse, or at least not better, so for myself I'm voting adrenal issues now. We'll see in a year whether it's better.

As for the family history--do you know why Hashi's and Graves run in your family? I've got a lot of hypo (some diagnosed, some not) in my family and my mom has Graves. That type of thing could be more common in families with celiac, have you ever looked into that? Anything in your family history that make you think celiac could be involved? My family's answer for why we have thyroid and adrenal problems (and enviro allergies and anxiety and depression) is that we have detoxification problems. We don't detoxify the mercury from our amalgam fillings well. Mercury messes with a few minerals in specific ways to basically starve our thyroids of the nutrients they need to function. I'm not saying everyone who's hypo or hyper has mercury issues, but most people with mercury issues have thyroid problems.

Not sure where your antibody levels are, have you seen the study that used supplemental selenium to reduce antibodies? 200mcg per day, it seems pretty normal in the alternative health world.

You could do a saliva test from Canary Club (to jump back up to earlier--whoops, need to run again!) to look at adrenal levels, do you have a doc who's helpful with that for you? Different from the non-helpful doc your daughter has? You could also use a hair test from Doctor's Data, it can show early signs of adrenal stress as well as thyroid (though like you said, the labwork shows that).

[SandyMom]

Tanyalopez,
Thanks so much for the generous reply.

I don't think dd gets keratosis pilaris. I'm pretty certain it's hives. It responds quickly to the hyland's hives formula also.

I was about to write that I thought there were some benign heart murmurs that just went away in childhood, but then I realized that that pedi visit was for my daughter (back when she was an infant, doc even said it was likely transient and benign), and she has a very high magnesium need. She still (age 5yo) has trouble falling asleep without supplemental mag each night, needs much more than my son. So I won't share an anecdote about a benign heart murmur going away on its own, now I'm left wondering if it was mag related too. I figured out the mag when she was a toddler and was the energizer bunny each night, but exhausted. My heart used to have an irregular beat--sometimes it would skip, sometimes I'd get 2 beats close together, and that's gone, except once recently it recurred and I interpreted that as a need for more magnesium, and then it was gone the next day. I think it was a long-term magnesium issue for me.

Yeah, I strongly suspect that the mag has helped her. She never had any symptoms from the murmur, still I'm glad it's gone. Magnesium has been such a wonderful supplement for myself and both my dd's. I'm so glad I figured that out on my own b/c md just looks at me w/ glazed over eyes when I ask him about it. I'm glad you found it helpful for your dd as well.

With delayed stuff like that, I'd probably cut gluten and dairy, and not add in soy (maybe cut it too) and see what happens over the course of the next month or so. I cut it for the whole family cause I felt horrible and I'm ruthless like that but it's been good for all of us. And I'd try to do things supportive of good digestion--we like homemade kimchee, other folks like kefir, you could do both.

Sounds good - and challenging!!!! Dd's favorite lunch is quesadillas! But I put some books on hold at the library and as you, we will do it as a family. I'm not going to be very popular around here for the next month or so!!!

So, would you agree that dd's thyroid labs indicate low thyroid? MD still insists I'm delusional.

As for the family history--do you know why Hashi's and Graves run in your family? I've got a lot of hypo (some diagnosed, some not) in my family and my mom has Graves. That type of thing could be more common in families with celiac, have you ever looked into that?

Not yet, but I will now - thank you!

My family's answer for why we have thyroid and adrenal problems (and enviro allergies and anxiety and depression) is that we have detoxification problems. We don't detoxify the mercury from our amalgam fillings well. Mercury messes with a few minerals in specific ways to basically starve our thyroids of the nutrients they need to function. I'm not saying everyone who's hypo or hyper has mercury issues, but most people with mercury issues have thyroid problems.

So children can have thyroid problems from mercury even if they don't have any mercury fillings?

Not sure where your antibody levels are, have you seen the study that used supplemental selenium to reduce antibodies?

My anitbody labs:

TPO = 518 H IU/ml (0-43)
Antithyroglobulin Ab = 44 H IU/ml (0 - 40)

I take selenium daily now along w/ iodine. I can't tolerate thyroid hormone without going hyper - md had me on synthroid originally which I believe is what finally tanked my adrenals. I did do the canary club adrenal panel on my own which is how I figured out I needed cortisol. It has been like night and day for me. (Md wouldn't acknowledge the results of my tests - said they were just some mumbo jumbo off the internet so I saved up $300 and took results to a holistic md who wrote me a script on the spot when he saw the labs. My insurance won't cover him unfortunately.

I do have mercury fillings - and I wouldn't be surprised if my thyroid trouble - and my family's - stems from that. It's just so daunting to think of removing them all - not to mention the $$$ - which we don't have.
Did you remove all of yours?

I know some ppl who have chelated w/o removing them, but have read that that could be very dangerous.

With regard to my dd's symptoms of mucus leading to occasional nausea/vomiting, does that sound more like a food allergy than mercury?
Thank you again very much for your input.

Sandy

[kjbrown92]

The mucous leading to nausea sounds like post nasal drip to me, which would correspond with either environmental or food allergies. Has she been tested for environmental or food allergies? I would get that ruled out first. Why would the doctor discount allergies if she's constantly clearing her throat? Can you get another doctor? This one doesn't sound like a keeper to me! Especially if your DD has had hives too....

If it's food, dairy and gluten sound like the most likely culprits, with the throat clearing, IF it's a mucous thing. IF it's more like a reflux thing, then it could be any food at all. Just my view. But I'd still rule out the IgE allergies first.

[SandyMom]

If it's food, dairy and gluten sound like the most likely culprits, with the throat clearing, IF it's a mucous thing. IF it's more like a reflux thing, then it could be any food at all. Just my view. But I'd still rule out the IgE allergies first.

Thanks very much for the input - much appreciated.
I have a hunch it is mucus b/c often when she has vomited there is mucus in it.
And wouldn't hives seem to fit with that more so than reflux?
I got a big stack of allergy books at the library today.

I am going to push for testing - but it's like moving mountains with the hcp we currently have. Plus I get so much flak at every visit about not vaxing. It's exhausting.

Thanks again.
Sandy

[tanyalynn]

Originally Posted by SandyMom

Sounds good - and challenging!!!! Dd's favorite lunch is quesadillas! But I put some books on hold at the library and as you, we will do it as a family. I'm not going to be very popular around here for the next month or so!!!

So, would you agree that dd's thyroid labs indicate low thyroid? MD still insists I'm delusional.

If you see symptoms with those numbers, yes! That TSH really looks too high, and the free's are off as well. If someone had no symptoms, I wouldn't necessarily push it, though I may wonder if a problem was building, but with symptoms, yeah.


So children can have thyroid problems from mercury even if they don't have any mercury fillings?

The short version (eta: apparently I am unable to do "short" ) of what's going on with us, so you know where I'm coming from: I'm here on this board, because my health problems are related to my kids' health problems, and both are related to my amalgam fillings and even my mom's amalgams. My kids are 3 and 5. I have classic mercury health issues, started with enviro allergies soon after my amalgams were put in in my early teens, then anxiety, a few years later depression (intermittent), my adrenals were wearing down this whole time, and then I became abruptly hypothyroid and generally miserable.

My kids both got enough mercury (and assorted other toxins, because it's a cascade of poor detoxification, where one pathway is overwhelmed and other pathways get overburdened, and things snowball) from me to have health issues. My daughter's are very non-traditional, just irritability/tantrums/stuff like that, plus it probably contributed to her gluten intolerance (though DH doesn't do gluten well either). She's prone to digestive issues, but not as bad as many on the board. Kimchee is wonderful for us. My son has more stereotypical issues (he takes after me, DD takes after DH), some spinning, head-banging, coordination issues, he gets sick a whole lot, stuff like that.

Lots of kids on ASD discussion boards have adrenal and thyroid problems, as do almost all of the adults in chelation groups. Frequent dose chelation is an adult chelation yahoo group, getting thyroid and adrenal support onboard before getting amalgams out and chelating is standard, else you'll hit a hard wall and be non-functional. My kids got my mineral deficiencies, so it's not a stretch to think that they could've been headed for thyroid problems themselves. Now I supplement a ton of nutrients.

So that's my perspective, the type of reading I've been doing for a couple years now. I got my amalgams replaced with composite, it was about $200 per tooth, and sometimes insurance will cover it, but sometimes not. I am chelating with alpha lipoic acid now, used DMSA (long acronym, always forget what it stands for) for the first 6-8 months afterward. I am much improved--not all the way, my adrenals are still worn down, but I'm clearly on the road to recovery. Nice feeling. Most folks have digestive weirdness, that is also almost universal, for some reason my gut hasn't been as messed up as most, though it is now getting out of balance with the chelating.

Originally Posted by SandyMom

My anitbody labs:

TPO = 518 H IU/ml (0-43)
Antithyroglobulin Ab = 44 H IU/ml (0 - 40)

I take selenium daily now along w/ iodine. I can't tolerate thyroid hormone without going hyper - md had me on synthroid originally which I believe is what finally tanked my adrenals. I did do the canary club adrenal panel on my own which is how I figured out I needed cortisol. It has been like night and day for me. (Md wouldn't acknowledge the results of my tests - said they were just some mumbo jumbo off the internet so I saved up $300 and took results to a holistic md who wrote me a script on the spot when he saw the labs. My insurance won't cover him unfortunately.

I do have mercury fillings - and I wouldn't be surprised if my thyroid trouble - and my family's - stems from that. It's just so daunting to think of removing them all - not to mention the $$$ - which we don't have.
Did you remove all of yours?

I know some ppl who have chelated w/o removing them, but have read that that could be very dangerous.

With regard to my dd's symptoms of mucus leading to occasional nausea/vomiting, does that sound more like a food allergy than mercury?
Thank you again very much for your input.

Sandy

As for food allergies vs mercury, the second leads to the first. One of the nutrients people with mercury issues are low in is zinc, and that's key for proper digestion. Not that everyone with food allergies (IgE or IgG) has mercury issues, but thyroid problems along with the other stuff I've mentioned always makes me want to mention it so that the possibility is considered.

For the immediate problem, the root cause doesn't matter, because removing problematic foods and increasing the amount of nutrient-dense foods, and easily-digestible foods, is good for everyone with allergies and digestion problems. We do homemade stock, very easy to digest, soothing on the digestive tract, and homemade kimchee. Combined with removing problematic foods, or at least some of the most-likelies, you should see some changes. The next step would be figuring out why the food allergies came about. And you may want to poke around on the detoxpuzzle website, some of the health issues mentioned there may help put pieces of your family health history into place.

Did I mention zinc is also key for thyroid function? In addition to digestion?

[mamafish9]

Originally Posted by SandyMom

I tried some hcl b/c I suspected low stomach acid in myself - I can take 3 capsules w/o feeling any heat at all. I haven't tried taking more yet.

I guess we should try an elimination diet - but the trick is there doesn't seem to be any instant symptoms from the foods we eat - kwim? It's not like we eat gluten or dairy and get stomach aches or rashes right away - it's more like it could be causing chronic things like mucus which eventually leads to nausea...

If you think low stomach acid might be a problem, a couple of things you might try before starting an elimination diet... (not saying that won't be necessary and helpful, but in hindsight, I wish I'd tried these first to see what difference they made):

1) something fermented with every meal - we've been doing raw goat's milk kefir, and I like Bubbie's pickles. Those help boost stomach acid production. DS fails the beet test, but passes if he has kefir too.

2) digestive enzymes. We're just starting these, but we are getting back quite a few of our "fail" foods on the elimination diet. Which tells me that he wasn't really intolerant of that food, but rather intolerant of that food in poorly digested form.

Especially with an older child that might not be thrilled with lots of diet changes, it might be worth trying some digestive help for a week or two and see if it helps with any of her symptoms? Then you can start eliminating common allergens if you still have issues at that point. Anyhow, just my "if I were doing it all over again what might I try" two cents!

[SandyMom]

Thanks so much for the fantastic responses!
I am learning so much...

I'm going to keep studying up on all of this and add in some fermented foods and enzymes.

I am so grateful to have this space to ask and learn - and for all of you who share your experiences.
Thank you!
Sandy

[WuWei]

Welcome! Where to start? Help 101


Pat

[SandyMom]

Thank You!!!!
xoxoxoxxo