pack status, alpha roles, dominance theory, etc

[greenmagick]

Ok, I know there are a bunch of articles out there talking about outdated thinking on all of the above. I am having a hard time finding the better ones. Does anyone have them handy that could post the links? I have been in an ongoing discussion with someone whos breeder has her roll her dog for all kinds of things (like not coming quick enough!). I am trying to explain to her that alpha rolls and status seeking etc are pretty much disproved, but I am not finding the info I need to back it up.

Thanks

[Sailor]

I don't know if this is what you're looking for, but there is a book by Suzanne Clothier - "When Bones Would Rain From the Sky". She gives lots of alternatives, and disputes many of the dominance theory techniques. She's a trainer and a breeder.

I'm surprised the breeder has her do alpha rolls for so many things. Even from a practical point of view, doesn't it get tiring to constantly roll one's dog for every "infraction"? Talk about a work out! Even with a small dog, the constant bending over is no fun.

I never understood the concept of alpha rolls. When my dog rolls over - it's because he wants a belly rub. Now. ASAP. My rolling him over just indicates that he'll be getting a belly rub, lol.

[greenmagick]

Originally Posted by Sailor

I don't know if this is what you're looking for, but there is a book by Suzanne Clothier - "When Bones Would Rain From the Sky". She gives lots of alternatives, and disputes many of the dominance theory techniques. She's a trainer and a breeder.

I'm surprised the breeder has her do alpha rolls for so many things. Even from a practical point of view, doesn't it get tiring to constantly roll one's dog for every "infraction"? Talk about a work out! Even with a small dog, the constant bending over is no fun.

I never understood the concept of alpha rolls. When my dog rolls over - it's because he wants a belly rub. Now. ASAP. My rolling him over just indicates that he'll be getting a belly rub, lol.

Yeah, I have that book and love it....it totally changed my view. I was just hoping for short snippets for easy reading to open dialogue

I guess I sholdnt say every infraction, but specifically not coming when called, not coming quick enough when called, jumping, and mouthing were mentioned. Whst worries me is a lot of other people have been really interested in this dogs "bootcamp" and I am sure people are going to try these methods on their own dogs.

[graceshappymum]

ARHHHHHHHGHHH! Save me from the alpha boot camp theory! If you want something short and sweet there is an online articel in the huffington post by a veterinarian and animal behaviourist (google dominace and dog training and it should come up), if not I can find the link and post it.

We have freinds who got a puppy while working through fertility issues, neither of them were dog people. They pick a mixed breed (Australian shepherd, Blue heeler, parsons russel) based on cuteness. BAD idea. Then whenshe started to behave like the breeds that she contained they went with a private trainer who suggested a dominace based approach. Long stiry short, lots of rolling her on her back, seemed to work for a while, then surprise, surprise, she started to get really mouthy and her "bad" behaviour returned. They are trying to rehome her at this point and have already had one couple return her. You are welcome to tell that story to your friend, but I think that the articel I suggested has some good opening points about dominace training increasing the chance of biting and aggression.