Sad

[Leta]

I had a heart to heart with DSS yesterday. He just turned 11, and is heading to middle school next month.

He goes to the best schools in the county. His elementary was in our state's top ten. When he started school, he could barely read, was shaky on his alphabet, and couldn't write at all. This year, upon graduating elementary, he got a Presidential Academic Merit award- which basically means that the kid has gotten straight A's his entire school career and has aced his state exams every time. He loves to learn, is a voracious reader (which the school deserves a lot of credit for, or so I always thought), and is incredibly sweet and even tempered. I've never seen him pick on anyone, and he rarely badmouths anybody. He is, per all his report cards, a "joy to have in class".

So this is a pretty best-case-scenario situation in a lot of ways.

But yesterday, he was in tears telling me about how he doesn't like getting yelled at, how unfair it is that he routinely gets punished for what others in his class or "group" do (or in the case of homework, don't do), how he hates hearing his classmates swear all the time, not to mention the boy in his class who he described as "pervert" who "makes him sick".

I am heartbroken. I am in a very poor position to do anything about any of this stuff. DSS and I both talked about this with DH, and I am planning on calling DSS's mom as soon as I get an opportunity- she's visiting her
dad right now, so it'll be a week or so.

Why, in the best of situations, is it still like this?

I'm just venting, I guess. Thanks for reading.

[lauren]

It sounds like it might be wise to schedule some time with the guidance counselor. 11 is a tough age and middle school is tougher. With more support you might be able to get to the point where you feel like the school is addressing these issues.

Human behavior, I guess, is why this is an issue in the good schools as well as the less well funded. Unfortunately more funding doesn't always = better behavior.

[Linda on the move]

Originally Posted by Leta

IHe goes to the best schools in the county. His elementary was in our state's top ten. ... Why, in the best of situations, is it still like this?

I think the whole 'best' thing is dodgy. What you are describing isn't the case in our little local school. (I have an 11 and a 12 year old).

But yesterday, he was in tears telling me about how he doesn't like getting yelled at, how unfair it is that he routinely gets punished for what others in his class or "group" do (or in the case of homework, don't do),

how common is this? Did he have a teacher with poor class management skills last year? He'll have a new teacher this year, so staying positive might help.

how he hates hearing his classmates swear all the time,

*all* the time? At this perfect school? He is exaggerating. Swearing is a huge no-no at my kids' school. The school bus is a different issue. But the fact that some 11 year olds say naughty words when adults aren't around is something he needs to learn to cope with. I'm sure there are some other very nice kids too -- learning to focus in being friends with the kids he likes and letting go of the fact that some people act in ways he doesn't like is a life skill.

not to mention the boy in his class who he described as "pervert" who "makes him sick".

this one I would want a lot more detail on. This is could the real problem, not the recess got taken away one day because other kids were talking. It could also explain the being freaked out about swearing.

For most 11 years, hearing other kids swear isn't news worthy. However, if this other child has been molested and is talking about icky things about sex, that is a whole nother thing.

I am in a very poor position to do anything about any of this stuff.

you already did the best thing possible. You were a safe person he could talk to who really listened, took him seriously, and felt what he was feeling.

Often, there isn't a way to fix things. Just like with a baby sometimes they best we can do is hold them while they cry, sometimes the best we can do with an adolescent is to really listen.

And you have his parents involved, listening, concerned.

[MattBronsil]

Remember to always ask the questions:

--How do you think this can be solved?

--How can I help you do something that you can't? (i.e. schedule a meeting with the parents, etc.)


I'm sure you've done that already. Just saying it's an important thing to do here. This is his set of problems that are just going to keep getting worse in most schools as time goes on. A lot of them are natural society things we'll have to face, either here at school or once out of school. Our best tools are not to remove ourselves from the situation, but to help show the child how to handle certain steps and monitor the situation.

For example, the 2nd question of "How can I help you do something that you can't?" (though you might want to phrase it better...too tired to think of wording) might prove that certain things he does want from you are things he can do himself. If he wants you to talk to the teacher, that's fine, but be sure he talks to the teacher first because this is something he CAN do. Did he tell the person cussing that he doesn't really like that language?

I'm not placing any judgment on what he has done or hasn't done. I'm just saying we should make sure to encourage kids to start working through their own problems and be sure to build up their skills in that regard and support them along the way.

[Leta]

Thanks for all these responses. I try hard to be a good listener for DSS, because DH, while he tries hard, isn't the best. His response, when something upsets DSS, is to get upset, too, which then brings out the Papa Bear in him and then he gets mad. I know he's acting out of love, but it's confusing for DSS- he thinks he's causing problems so he just doesn't talk. He's a little people pleaser that way. However, things went quite well yesterday- DH maintained, and we talked it later, when we were alone, and we're on the same page in that we are troubled by this.

The thing is, it really is a very decent school- like Lauren said, this is a human behavior issue. The school can't control Dane's peer group. I mean, they can try, but it sure didn't work when I was in school.

About the swearing- DSS has ALWAYS hated swearing, the entire time I've known him (since he was 4). We are a foulmouthed family. My FIL, who DSS lived with at least part time until he was 5, is the single most profane person I've ever met. I get after DH because he cusses a blue streak- and I'm far from perfect myself on this account. DSS says his stepdad (who is a good guy who is great to DSS- they are close and I know DSS loves and respects him) "says the F-word every time he exhales". So it's not like DSS has virgin ears by any means. But he's just sensitive to it. He, himself, NEVER swears, he says he doesn't want to. He calls Hellboy "H-boy". Bad language just really bothers him, I'm not sure why. And, I've noticed, the younger the person cussing is, the more it bothers DSS. We all have our pet issues, and this is his.

And while I don't have a video camera following DSS around, I can say that when I was in 5th grade, everyone cussed constantly on the playground, on the bus, at lunch, in notes, etc. To the extent that a lot of kids even slipped up in class. And it wasn't a big deal. The cusser got detention and a note home- so they were punished, but it didn't do much. It's certainly not like the school started a "war on swear words" or anything.

Yes, I think he did have a teacher with poor classroom management skills. He had the same teacher in 2nd and 5th grades, a guy. This is the only male teacher DSS has ever had. Male elementary school teachers are pretty rare, at least in my state, and IDK if that's WHY, but this guy seems to be a lot more highly thought of than he deserves, IMO. He's not very creative, he gets flustered easily, his class, to me, has always seemed poorly organized, etc. But we are always getting newletters and things extolling this teacher's virtues. *shrugs*

This, however, is minor compared to the group work issues. They work in groups all.the.time. Literally every subject, every day, is done in groups. Most assignments, even homework, have a group component.

(The big exception to this is freereading, and that still causes DSS stress, because his mom and I both just fill out the sheets, and he's afraid that he's cheating because he didn't set a timer or watch the clock. But he reads all the time! I have to chase him outside. This summer, so far, he's read a foot tall stack of fantasy novels, the entire Annotated New Yorker Compendium, the unabridged original War of the Worlds, and a set of science encyclopedias intended for high school kids. But I digress.)

DSS hates group work because he gets to either be the taskmaster or do it all himself. Things were exactly the same for me, I hated group work from K until my senior year in college. College was better, I'll admit, but it still involved lots of phone calls back and forth, and DSS is having to do this already. This one bothers DH and I the most, because it seems like there isn't a thing that we can do about it- it's not like the school is going to change their curriculum for one kid who's already successful. I know that group work has just been the hotness in educational circles for 30 years, but I think it's terrible. It puts gifted kids in a position of quasi-authority over their peers, which makes things even tougher for them socially, and allows kids who need extra help to skate longer without remidiation. This is the line item complaint of DSS's that makes me think the hardest, and compells me the most to discuss educational alternatives with the rest of his parents.

The kid that DSS called a pervert- that sent up huge red flags for me. I asked if he was perverted about boys or girls or just in general, and DSS said he was perverted in general, but especially about a girl he liked. I asked how, and DSS said he didn't want to repeat the things the kid had said, because just thinking about them made him sick. I backed off, but discussed it with DH (alone), and will bring it up with DSS's mom. I told DSS later that if he is uncomfortable because of someone saying perverted stuff, that's sexual harrassment and it's illegal, and that the school is obligated to stop it. I also said that it's something his parents could take care of, that he wouldn't have to do anything but tell us the kid's name and give us a slightly more specific rundown of what had been going on. DSS seemed receptive. I'm not letting this go, I'm just trying to play my hand so as not to freak DSS out any worse.

Again, thanks for reading and responding. I know this stuff is all normal... but sometimes parenting is hard! *whiiine*

[Linda on the move]

Originally Posted by Leta

DSS hates group work because he gets to either be the taskmaster or do it all himself.

my sister taught school for many years and said that the norm on group projects is to assign one smart kid and one struggling kid to each group, and then fill in the group with the kids in the middle. All the kids know who is the smart one and the struggling one, so the smart kid ends up running the group, the struggling kid keeps their mouth shut, and all the projects turn out looking about the same level.

She started experimenting by mixing it up -- putting all the smart kids together and watch them try to actually work together when they were all used to being the task master. Put all the struggling kids together and watch them sit around for a while not doing anything, until it hit them that they HAD to do something, anything really, because it was just them.

Anyway, at least your DSS will have a new teacher this year and hopefully things will be better.

The kid that DSS called a pervert- that sent up huge red flags for me. I asked if he was perverted about boys or girls or just in general, and DSS said he was perverted in general, but especially about a girl he liked.

tell him to avoid him. The kid sounds VERY icky. I'm not into the whole "be friends with everyone" thing. There are some kids who send up red flags for our kids. I think that telling them it's OK to pay attention to the little voice inside them that tells them that another person isn't a safe *even when it is another child* can help protect them.

I really like the book "Sara, Book 1: The Foreverness of Friends of a Feather" by Esther and Jerry Hicks. It's a mind-body-spirit book about how we can create more happines and appreciation in our lives and it's written for kids. You might want to read it first and make sure that it goes along with your families values (it's new age), but I think it is a super book and I read it out loud to my kids. Its an easy chapter book, most likely a little below his reading level, but with content that might be helpful for him.