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gifted forum - posts being moved

post #1 of 167
Thread Starter 
Like other posters in the gifted forum, I've noticed a dramatic change in the number and types of threads that are moved. I've noticed many threads that imo are very related to giftedness, yet they end up moved to another forum. If I post here, it's because I think the issue we're experiencing relates to my child's giftedness and I want the opinions of other parents with gifted children. For example, if I were to post about how to deal with the intensity of some higher-reading-level books for my kindergarten-age child, I would post here because I want to hear from other parents who have had very precocious readers. When a topic such as this gets moved to a more general forum, parents with readers of all levels chime in, and the responses of a parent with a 10 year old who read Harry Potter are not really relevant to concerns about a kindergarten-age child reading it.

Why has there been such a shift? Was it requested by people who use this forum? Am I the only one who is bothered by it and feel it makes the gifted forum less useful?
post #2 of 167
There are many aspects to this issue.

There is growing concern with the gifted forum.

It seems like there is an increasing desire of the forum participants to seperate themselves from the rest of the board. This is contrary to the guidelines the moderators have of moving threads that are off topic or fit within other forums.

We see a lot of comments that people in other forums "cannot" relate to their issues or that they would have worded things differently had they been aware their thread would have been in another forum.

People should not post differently to one forum than they would to another.

Questions about books belongs in that forum, if one desires opinions from parents of young readers then they should state they want opinions from younger readers. It doesn't really belong in the gifted forum.

There is a growing number of people who do have gifted children who do not post to the forum because of all the negativity towards what might be perceived as "normal."

A guideline was added to the forum in order to reduce the debate, but the intent of that was not to create a perception that the forum is "more safe" than the others. That was to reduce the number of people telling each other whether or not a child is gifted.
post #3 of 167
Thank you for the clarification. If none of the forums are "safe" I'll go back into lurker mode.
post #4 of 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by JollyGG View Post
Thank you for the clarification. If none of the forums are "safe" I'll go back into lurker mode.
What do you mean by "safe?"
post #5 of 167
Abimommy, I do see your point in re: to some threads turning into discussions about whether or not the kid is gifted, when the OP didn't even broach that question to begin with, however that shouldn't supercede.

And what is wrong with a gifted forum, or a DDC or any other forum, feeling like it's own small community within a larger community? That's how life is, isn't it? Instead we are being "forced" to become a part of the larger community because of the beliefs of mods or staff, but that is not going to work out very well. Most people just don't respond well to being put into neat little boxes, and most certainly not on already alternative (as I see it) MDC.

There are so many issues that are gifted but do not seem that way at first glance. For example, my middle child is extreme. He is intense and emotional and sensitive. He has a meltdown a day about one thing or another. From the outside, someone might think he just has behaviour problems and might "move him" to childhood years, but that's not the case. He is the way he is because of how his system and mind work, and yes, from being gifted (and asynchronous).
How would moving my thread about him (which is hypothetical) to childhood years benefit me or my son?
post #6 of 167
I think she means "safe" as in ok with you all and won't be messed with? Not to speak for her or anything...
post #7 of 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by abimommy View Post

There is a growing number of people who do have gifted children who do not post to the forum because of all the negativity towards what might be perceived as "normal."


Honestly, I don't even get why there is a "Gifted' forum. Any questions or concerns could just as easily be posted in another forum: Learning at Home or School, Toddlers or Childhood years, Parenting, Books and Media, etc.
post #8 of 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by abimommy View Post
There is a growing number of people who do have gifted children who do not post to the forum because of all the negativity towards what might be perceived as "normal".
Just to throw out my opinion....but I feel very uncomfortable posting in the gifted forum. Even though DD1 tested "advanced" in reasoning/processing/ problem solving when she was evaluated for speech therapy, I never felt like any of her likes/dislikes or behaviors needed to be questioned or addressed in the "gifted forum" because quite frankly she is just 3. It feels like a high school competition over there- and if a poster responds with something that is *gasp* a solution for a NORMAL problem.....the up-turned noses come out and it's like answers are not good enough because that would be something only a "normal intelligence" child would respond to.
Sure...there are behavior patterns that warrant more specific responses. But in the same respect - gifted children are not all one in the same. Why would only the gifted forum answers count?
post #9 of 167
Thread Starter 
But if our posts are moved from the gifted forum to another section of MDC, then it means that the OP has to wade through more posts from people who may not really understand the issue that drove her to post in the first place.

For example, I recently wanted feedback about the later Harry Potter books and how other young readers have handled them. I don't care about how someone's third grader handled them; I wanted to know about kindergarten or first-grade age kids. It's a very different issue when your 4 or 5 or 6 year old can read middle-school or high-school level books, and I think it rightfully belongs on the gifted forum. I decided not to post on MDC because I figured it would get moved to Childhood Years or something, like another similar thread had just been moved.

There are many other issues that could easily somewhat fit in a different forum, but the child's giftedness is a key component of the issue at hand. I think it does a disservice to the posters to have their threads moved when giftedness is relevant to the question.

I also do not see the tendency that abimommy mentioned for posters within that forum to separate themselves out from the rest of the board. How has this happened? I see posts from Ruthla, Roar, and many others all over the MDC fora. Yes, there are probably a few posters who post primarily or exclusively in that forum, but that is also true of almost any forum within MDC. I know I've looked up other posts by some poster who I didn't recognize and found that I didn't recognize the name because almost all of her posts were within one particular forum or another. I would imagine that there are many of us here at MDC who have become active MDC members but who originally joined the community primarily because of one sub-forum.

It disturbs me that it sounds as if MDC is becoming less willing to host the gifted forum. I hope that is not what abimommy meant when she spoke of "growing concern with the gifted forum."
post #10 of 167
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeliphish View Post
Just to throw out my opinion....but I feel very uncomfortable posting in the gifted forum. Even though DD1 tested "advanced" in reasoning/processing/ problem solving when she was evaluated for speech therapy, I never felt like any of her likes/dislikes or behaviors needed to be questioned or addressed in the "gifted forum" because quite frankly she is just 3. It feels like a high school competition over there- and if a poster responds with something that is *gasp* a solution for a NORMAL problem.....the up-turned noses come out and it's like answers are not good enough because that would be something only a "normal intelligence" child would respond to.
Sure...there are behavior patterns that warrant more specific responses. But in the same respect - gifted children are not all one in the same. Why would only the gifted forum answers count?
I'm truly sorry if you feel uncomfortable posting in the gifted forum. However, there are some of us who do post there who sometimes choose to post there precisely because we feel uncomfortable bringing up one issue or another in a different MDC forum. For example, when my 22-month-old started reading phrases in books he'd never seen before, if I'd been an active MDC member at the time, I'd have posted in the gifted forum, not in toddlers, even though I would have been posting about a toddler. I would have chosen the gifted forum because my experiences at MDC, at other online boards, and in real-life would all have told me not to expect much understanding of the situation on the toddler forum.

Of course gifted children are not all one and the same. However, if a poster chooses to post in the gifted forum, perhaps it's because that is where there is likely to be the largest number of people who might understand the issue at hand.
post #11 of 167
With over 2000 posts, I have to say that sometimes I feel that i am still trying to find my place on MDC. It's certainly a richly varied board. There's nothing else like it out there. The interesting piece for me is that as my kids have gotten older and my parenting needs have changed, I've found myself moving to the forums that address my life circumstances. It's really nice to have that!

So it's gone with the gifted forum as well. Never did I think I would have questions related to gifted issues-the term rubs me the wrong way, frankly. But I have school aged kids, so I'm not trying to figure out if my newborn is gifted-I really have learned a lot, both from lurking, and the occ. post. There's a big crossover between gifted and special needs, whcih is fabulous-I don't find those resources in any other parenting format where natural family living is the priority.

I don't understand why, if MDC can host a waldorf education forum, where almost every post could be put elsewhere, frankly, and there is a very high degree of "insider only", the gifted forum would be considered such an issue?

Just my two pennies.
post #12 of 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by Panthira View Post
Abimommy, I do see your point in re: to some threads turning into discussions about whether or not the kid is gifted, when the OP didn't even broach that question to begin with, however that shouldn't supercede.
I was answering more in general because there has been quite a few questions about this topic.

Quote:

And what is wrong with a gifted forum, or a DDC or any other forum, feeling like it's own small community within a larger community? That's how life is, isn't it? Instead we are being "forced" to become a part of the larger community because of the beliefs of mods or staff, but that is not going to work out very well. Most people just don't respond well to being put into neat little boxes, and most certainly not on already alternative (as I see it) MDC.
Currently it is a matter of enforcing the policy that is already in place.

If there is a desire for policy change that will have to be something that we discuss but I don't anticipate a change at this time.

Quote:
There are so many issues that are gifted but do not seem that way at first glance. For example, my middle child is extreme. He is intense and emotional and sensitive. He has a meltdown a day about one thing or another. From the outside, someone might think he just has behaviour problems and might "move him" to childhood years, but that's not the case. He is the way he is because of how his system and mind work, and yes, from being gifted (and asynchronous).
How would moving my thread about him (which is hypothetical) to childhood years benefit me or my son?
That would likely be moved to Gentle Discipline where there are people with extensive knowledge on normal childhood development and may have techniques that could assist you.

If you wanted input from those who post in the gifted forum and would like to direct them to your thread then you could post to the gifted forum in order to direct them to the thread in GD.
post #13 of 167
A precocious reader topic, such as a four year old wanting to read Coraline by Gaimen, does belong in the gifted forum. Also an 8 year old who's already reading adult level books belongs there too. I don't have any gifted children, but did teach gifted junior high math. There are specific issues with trying to keep activities emotional age appropriate that just don't apply to intellectually average children. The topic of test anxiety seems to be a clear Learning at School topic, but when the child is a self competitive perfectionist who 's doing work 4 years above grade level the solution is going to be different than one for a regular education child. Parents of gifted children need a safe place to vent or discuss the issues caused by their child's intellectual precocities.
post #14 of 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by Panthira View Post
I think she means "safe" as in ok with you all and won't be messed with? Not to speak for her or anything...
Ok with who?

Messed with how?
post #15 of 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drummer's Wife View Post


Honestly, I don't even get why there is a "Gifted' forum. Any questions or concerns could just as easily be posted in another forum: Learning at Home or School, Toddlers or Childhood years, Parenting, Books and Media, etc.
Should there be a special needs forum? Multiples forum? There are specific concerns in parenting gifted children (as there are special needs paretning, multiples, etc).

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeliphish View Post
Just to throw out my opinion....but I feel very uncomfortable posting in the gifted forum. Even though DD1 tested "advanced" in reasoning/processing/ problem solving when she was evaluated for speech therapy, I never felt like any of her likes/dislikes or behaviors needed to be questioned or addressed in the "gifted forum" because quite frankly she is just 3. It feels like a high school competition over there- and if a poster responds with something that is *gasp* a solution for a NORMAL problem.....the up-turned noses come out and it's like answers are not good enough because that would be something only a "normal intelligence" child would respond to.
Sure...there are behavior patterns that warrant more specific responses. But in the same respect - gifted children are not all one in the same. Why would only the gifted forum answers count?
I don't post on the special needs forum - even though my oldest has a diagnosis of dysgraphia and my middle has one of ADHD (both diagnosises I question - but that is another post). I do not post there because I do not feel domfortable there - but that certainly is my issue - and not a reflection of the forums.

I do not question the right for the special needs forum to exist - nor do I concern myself with whether the people have a tendancy to post there when it could be answerred elsewhere. Why should I? I would be concerned if I felt any forum were cliqueish or exclusive - but that has not been the case as far as I can see. MDC is usually quite welcoming across the board
post #16 of 167
kathymuggle, what you are saying make sense. In fact, the responses on this thread are rather enlightening.

I'm not even sure why I responded, since I have maybe posted in the gifted forum once or twice.

*I* think my children are advanced, and likely gifted in some areas. I guess I just don't 100% understand the problem with threads being moved, or posted in other forums in the first place. It *does* make it seem like other's opinions and suggestions aren't helpful, unless they can relate b/c they, too, have a gifted child. But maybe that's not the case.

I guess the difference between, say, special needs and gifted, is that there seems to be a clearer line. It's easier, in most cases, to determine that your child has a special need, whereas gifted-ness is a little more complex. I mean, people don't even agree with the validity of IQ tests, much less if reading at 4 is gifted or if it's reading at 18 months that is truly gifted.

Anyway, carry-on. I don't care if threads are moved, in any forum, and in any situation. 99% of the time, I hit new posts and weed through the stuff that doesn't interest or apply to me (ie single parenting) I DO feel out of place responding (and certainly starting a thread) in the gifted forum. Not quite sure how to put in words why that is, though. But it's true that it's MY problem, not anyone elses.
post #17 of 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by abimommy View Post



That would likely be moved to Gentle Discipline where there are people with extensive knowledge on normal childhood development and may have techniques that could assist you.

If you wanted input from those who post in the gifted forum and would like to direct them to your thread then you could post to the gifted forum in order to direct them to the thread in GD.
Whatever forum you would choose, the fact is YOU would choose where to move the thread. The fact my child is acting out is because of how he works, and that might not be addressed appropriately, in terms of how a gifted child might act. I alread KNOW how to GD and don't need to discuss that issue, so why would it be moved there? The issue is how to stimulate him without overstimulating or saying the wrong thing to set him off, and that is a gifted issue in his case.

(ETA: This is only an example, and I haven't posted about this issue. Yet.)

And you are saying for every one post, I must post 2 posts in order to reach the audience I *choose* to reach?
post #18 of 167
People should not post differently to one forum than they would to another.

Questions about books belongs in that forum, if one desires opinions from parents of young readers then they should state they want opinions from younger readers. It doesn't really belong in the gifted forum.



I am very, very concerned about this.
From some of the response I'm reading, I'm concerned that there is a lack of understand of what giftedness entails. Giftedness is not about just about being smart.
The Columbus group definition is particularly telling.

Giftedness is asynchronous development in which advanced cognitive abilities and heightened intensity combine to create inner experiences and awareness that are qualitatively different from the norm. This asynchrony increases with higher intellectual capacity. The uniqueness of the gifted renders them particularly vulnerable and requires modifications in parenting, teaching and counseling in order for them to develop optimally. (The Columbus Group, 1991).




People shouldn't post differently from one forum to another? I honestly do not understand. If I wasn't going to post differently, than why is there even a gifted forum? I'm not even sure I understand what should be posted in a gifted forum then. A question on a book, is a very classic item a gifted parent would want input from other gifted parents on, and is a question I've seen on any gifted forum I have ever read.

As the definition states above gifted are particularly vulnerable.
If I have a 5 year old who is reading at a 4th grade level, and need to find an age appropriate book for that child, that isn't going to emotionally affect them, then a community of gifted parents that have BTDT with their children are the best people to answer that question, because they have dealt with that issue before. I have posted these sorts of questions on other generic forums before, and the response I have gotten have never been sufficient as to what I would get from those that have dealt with this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by abimommy View Post

There are so many issues that are gifted but do not seem that way at first glance. For example, my middle child is extreme. He is intense and emotional and sensitive. He has a meltdown a day about one thing or another. From the outside, someone might think he just has behaviour problems and might "move him" to childhood years, but that's not the case. He is the way he is because of how his system and mind work, and yes, from being gifted (and asynchronous).How would moving my thread about him (which is hypothetical) to childhood years benefit me or my son?


That would likely be moved to Gentle Discipline where there are people with extensive knowledge on normal childhood development and may have techniques that could assist you.

If you wanted input from those who post in the gifted forum and would like to direct them to your thread then you could post to the gifted forum in order to direct them to the thread in GD.

Understand I'm not being 'elitist', I'm not criticizing, I'm just trying to help folks understand here.
The above I find beyond concerning.

The above is absolutely about being gifted, and being gifted is NOT normal childhood development. That is what folks are saying here.
GIfted is special needs.
I have a child that is 6 and almost 7 that will melt down screaming, hitting, enraged, slamming doors.
This is all about the special needs of gifted.
This happens to her because

a) Overexcitabilites. These are far more prone in the gifted population compared to the norm. The book Living with INtensties talks greatly about Dabrowski's Overexcitabilities and the gifted. It has to do with a gifted child is often 'more'. They are 'more' intellectual, they are 'more' imaginational, they are 'more' emotinoally intense. In fact a very good article on gifted is one called Intensitive, which combines the word intensive with sensitive and talks about these within the gifted child.

b) Reactive hypoglycemia. This is something that happens with intense gifted kids. Why? Because these kids will deplete their sugar stores far more rapidly than the norm. Even if a child does not have reactive hypoglycemia, the reality is many gifted kids have so much mental processing going on that they deplete those stores quickly.

So, my daughter has a meltdown. The Gentle Discipline board can't help me with the issue, because that is not what the issue is related to. This IS a gifted issue. The issue is related to the OE's of a gifted child, and because my child on a normal day of processing goes through her sugar stores faster than the norm because of the amount of processing happening in the gifted brain, and during a growth spurt it goes through it that much more.

Information that I've gotten from parents on gifted board is what has helped me with it. Talking with parents in my daughter's gifted class, the one's that have kids hitting all five of those OE's strongly, understand EXACTLY what I'm going through, and the tips of how to deal with these strong OE's, and meltdowns. This is not knowledge as part of 'normal childhood development', but information I've only, ONLY learned and discovered through books specific to gifted, and gifted boards.

This isn't about creating an inclusive board, but having a board with a knowledge base of gifted children.
Giftedness is NOT just about that IQ factor.


Please, please explain what is 'acceptable' then to discuss?

I can't ask about input for unschooling a gifted child. If I can't ask for that, it seems I can't ask for input about schooling my gifted child since that is another board.
Does that mean that a parent with a special needs child that is autistic has to go to the school board to ask about schooling their special needs child, and then link back to the special needs board?


I go to the special needs board and one of the first topics that comes up is
"Any suggestions to calm down high energy 3 yr old? "
and another...
"Anxiety & negative behaviour with other kids (very long)"

Why is that acceptable on a special needs board, but an analogous thread about asking about dealing with meltdowns in a gifted child isnt' acceptable on a gifted board??

In my personal view BOTH are fine, because BOTH are dealing with special needs that the parents of a special needs child, whether gifted or autistic is in the best position to answer. It doesn't mean others might not have input, but just as a parent of an autistic child would want input from parents of autistic children when dealing with meltdowns, anxiety, negative behavior, so would a parent of a gifted child.

I do not understand the double standard in regards to these sorts of items aren't acceptable for a gifted board, but are acceptable for a special needs board, when the reality this is all part and parcel to what giftedness is. To me all I can conclude is that there is a lack of understanding that giftedness also entails far more than just a raw IQ number.

Tammy
post #19 of 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by abimommy View Post
What do you mean by "safe?"
Safe as in:

When I talk about my self taught early reader I'm not looking for people to tell me that I'm pushing too hard or that reading early is harmful and should be discouraged or that I only think he's reading but he must not be since he's only 3

When I talk about my sons schooling it is impossible to do without considering that he's in a full time gifted program and has skipped a grade. I'm not looking for people who have never looked at the studies about grade skipping telling me what a disservice I'm doing to my son, I'm not looking for people to tell me that I'm not concerned about his social and emotional growth, I don't choose to defend myself from people who think I'm pushing him academically due to my own ego.

I don't want to post about something my child has done and have the post treated as some sort of competition among parents. I don't engage in "baby races" and have found that talking about things my children do that is outside of the norm often invokes a good bit of competition and defensiveness in parents whose children aren't doing the same thing. It's not deliberate but it happens. We all worry about our children and our parenting skills. When a child the same age as ours does something ours doesn't we start to worry that they are behind even when we know it's not true. It's an emotional response not an intellectual response. But it's one that I don't always choose to deal with.

It took me a long time to feel comfortable posting among people who's children are profoundly or highly gifted when I wasn't even sure at first my child was gifted. But given some lurking time I realized that no one was going to judge or deem my child not "gifted enough" to be part of the board and I have found this board to be a huge help in some recent decisions I have made concerning my child's education. If there is a feeling out there that peoples opinions are being dismissed or that the "parenting the gifted child" board is to cliquish maybe we can talk about what is making that feeling and how to fix it. But moving posts doesn't seem to be the answer to me.

Honestly, alot of people come to gifted children boards because they feel like no one else understands. They post there because it feels like a safe place where they will be given the benefit of the doubt that they are truly following their child needs the best that they can and there are other people who understand. They have often gotten the above comments and worse in real life and on other boards. When posts get moved it feels like there is now just one more person who doesn't get it and doesn't understand and makes the whole place fell less "safe"
post #20 of 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by Panthira View Post
Whatever forum you would choose, the fact is YOU would choose where to move the thread. The fact my child is acting out is because of how he works, and that might not be addressed appropriately, in terms of how a gifted child might act. I alread KNOW how to GD and don't need to discuss that issue, so why would it be moved there? The issue is how to stimulate him without overstimulating or saying the wrong thing to set him off, and that is a gifted issue in his case.

(ETA: This is only an example, and I haven't posted about this issue. Yet.)

And you are saying for every one post, I must post 2 posts in order to reach the audience I *choose* to reach?
Every child is different, though. What I know is that when I was parenting a high needs toddler who was later proven to be intensely gifted, the best parenting advice came from all over. From parents with autistic kids. From parents with children younger than mine, or with different temperaments. Sometimes, you don't actually need to walk a mile in someone else's shoes to help, you just need to have a big heart and a bit of empathy.
Also, by posting only in PTGC, you miss out on the experience of people like me- and I bet I'm not the only parent of a gifted child on MDC who doesn't bother with that forum. It just has nothing to offer me at this time in my life.
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