Just popping into say hi/vent a minor amount

[FatherTryingToHelp]

Hi, wanted to just post to say hello,

Things are mostly good right now, the meds/therapy all seems to be working quite well, my wife is, for the most part, feeling well. Unfortunately one of the meds is being slowly decreased, which means that we have these "moments", like last night, one of the meds was decreased, and so my wife didn't sleep, this causes a severe problem the next day, it spirals from "one nights bad sleep" into "never going to sleep again, never going to get better (etc etc)", not sure what else I can do, I keep telling her it's all right, and that she will get better and it was just one night (and somewhat expected due to the change in meds) but it never makes it any better, it never makes it seem alright, wish I knew what else to say, or what else I could do.

Anyway, another day or two and hopefully things will be back to normal, just wish it didn't have to be this way.

[mom0810]

Hi,

I'm sorry she had a hard night last night.

One of the things you can tell her, and she will learn this in therapy, is not to make blanket statements like that. "It's never going to get better" might be what she feels in the moment, but if she can take a step back and look at it rationally, she will know that is not true. It may be a very real feeling to her now, though, and all you can do is reassure her that you are on the right path, with meds and therapy, and you will get to a good place. It's normal and natural to have a setback with meds being reduced.

I'm just curious, which of her meds is being reduced, and why? It seems such a short time ago that she started. I know you are under Shoshanna's care, and of course I would do as she says. I just am curious for my own understanding, not anything to do with your wife.

I hope tonight is better. Perhaps she can take a nice bath before bed to relax. Maybe lay in bed and quietly read a book on her own while you have the baby in another room? That could help a lot. It WILL get better.

[FatherTryingToHelp]

Yeah, I wish taking a step back and seeing it rationally was as easy to do as it is to say.

Unfortunately, seeing things rationaliy is, hard right now.

The med being reduced is the seroquel, down to 25mg now, it has to be reduced because the reason for it is over, and she needs to get off it, it sucks, on Monday we had such a good day, she was so posative, things were looking up, sure she couldn't sleep till 11/11:30 most nights, but then she'd sleep till at least 7, if not 8 Ipre pregnancy my wife could quite happily sleep lots).

Since Monday, it's been a bumpy week, back to the normal "I'm never going to get better, I don't have PPD, I've got something else, which is why I'm never going to get better, etc etc"

The toddler (at 16 months, he really is that) isn't an issue at all, he's been sleeping at his Grandma's house for the past 4 weeks, honestly I hate it, but if it helps her get better, then we have to sacrifice in the short term to gain in the long term (I wish our house was bigger, but the problem is if he wakes up crying anywhere in our house, it's guaranteed to wake my wife up, and right now, she needs to get the solid sleep).

I'm still trying to stick it out, the nights of crying because she's worried she won't ever get better, the days of moping because she's obviously in her head and worrying about it, gah, why can't we just be back at monday *sigh*

The biggest thing right now seems to be the worry that she's going to regress, because for a while the Seroquel was working well and making her sleep quite well (although her recollection of it is more rosy than mine) but the sedative effects began to wear off, or the mania that it was working against started to pass and anxiety showed it's ugly head (or something in between, who knows) and she started not to sleep that well, so now is just constantly worried that despite being on totally different medication, that it's going to wear off, and she's going to regress and have to live sleeping 4 hours a night and never feeling tired.

For anyone who has ready this far, thanks for reading my rants, mumblings, mutterings, what have you, two questions.

1. Does anyone else never feel tired, I know my wife complains that since our son was about 2 months she just never feels tired (although she yawns at night, so I'm not sure how true that really is).

2. Does anyone else ever feel, I don't know, like body tremors, not outwardly visible, but my wife always describes them as tight feeling shakes, doesn't seem to have any particular cause and nothing in particular seems to quiet them, they just seem to come and go.

As always, I'm sure I'll be back with the latest update in my screwed up life.

[mom0810]

Is there any other med that is going in place of the Seroquel? I know that before, you had talked about meds that Shoshanna thought were right for your wife. Did that never happen?

What your wife is feeling could be a result of the Seroquel leaving her system. It could also be anxiety and panic, which yes, is a symptom of PPD. I felt the same feelings. And yes, I had all kinds of trouble sleeping. I, too, felt like it would never change, and that this was just going to be "me" for life. It wasn't.

Going on Zoloft changed everything, and made it all so much better. I could see that life was/is joyful, there were/are things to look forward to, and be so happy about. And yes, I could finally sleep on zoloft. It took a little while, but I could.

The feelings she is having could also be from ramping up on a new med. Is she?

Have you talked to Shoshanna? You should maybe talk to her, apart from your wife.

I hear my little ones getting in to trouble, but I will write more later. Please know that you and your wife are not alone, so many of us and our husbands have been through this.

[mom0810]

Back, and after rereading your post, do you think that your wife could be bipolar? What has the assessment been like with Shoshanna? If she is changing meds, that manic feeling could be from that. When you withdraw from meds, one of the withdrawal symptoms is insomnia. Did anyone tell you that?

When I withdrew from zoloft, I stayed awake for 48 hours straight. That is a NORMAL withdrawal symptom, and it went away and then I was fine. So she could be experiencing all of this due to med withdrawal and/or ramping up on meds and it will all be fine once she normalizes again.

The biggest thing, like I said before, is to try and remain in the rational. I know of COURSE it's hard, but you and she both have to say, "okay, it's likely this is med. related, which will pass." This is going to get better once her body adjusts.

Can you call her therapist and talk about what is going on? That would be the first thing I would do. Call and make sure this could be related to the meds, and go from there. If not, then there should be some adjustment made. She should not be feeling bad. The meds are there to help. So is your therapist. I say "your" because the therapist is there for you just as much as for her.

I know you are feeling so desperate now, but it's due to lack of sleep for both of you, and you as a man must just want to do everything you can to "fix" this and there is really nothing you can do but just love and support her, which of course you are doing a great job! I know it must be so frustrating for you, though, and that is something I am sorry you are having to deal with now.

[mom0810]

Here's a short list of withdrawal symptoms from seroquel.

http://bipolar-disorder.emedtv.com/s...ithdrawal.html

You can find more extensive info by doing a search for seroquel withdrawal.

I hope this helps you a little bit more. I have been concerned for you and your wife and I hope you are both getting good help.

[FatherTryingToHelp]

Thanks for all the info,

I had her call the Doctor this morning to explain how she's now feeling (since going down on the Seroquel Monday) and see if they want to do anything else.

Currently she's not gone up on any other med to compensate for the Seroquel (I think that had already been done prior as she had gone up on the Gabapenten quite quickly). Always hard since the last two times she went down on Seroquel (from 100 to 75, and from 75 to 50) nothing seemed to happen, in fact, if anything, things seemed to get better, not worse (although I suppose both prior times the Gabapenten was increased).

As for Zoloft, well, that is what seemed to start the Mania first (not bipolar, the Seroquel was being used "off label" as I understand it). It's the whole problem of anxiety causing her to worry about not getting any sleep, which then causes her to not sleep (because she's worried about it) she is EXTREMELY resistant to take medication of any sort, which doesn't help (and makes me feel like screaming, she complains endlessly about not being able to sleep, but won't take Ambien which the doc perscribed to help her sleep, it's exceptionally frustrating).

I appeciate that as a male I'm supposed to want to "fix" it, but I try to go with just listening and telling her it'll get better, she doesn't believe me, frankly, I'm not sure I believe me anymore. I could write a whole load of other stuff, but I've written it over three times now, and each time sounds worse than the last, I'll leave it as, I'm getting to my wits end, I honestly don't know how much longer I can do this, and I've got no idea what I can do if I don't keep doing this.

With regard to Shoshanna, she (from what I understand) is in agreement with the treatment that is currently being applied (although I'm not sure she knows that Paxil got added to the mix a week or so ago).

[mom0810]

I'm so so sorry for what you are ALL going through.

I think it sounds like she is being resistant to the meds, for sure, and that is not going to help anyone. The thing is, if she would take the Ambien and get a good night's sleep, she would see things in a whole new light, which I am sure you know already.

I'm sorry. I really think the going down in Seroquel is what is causing this. But I am only speaking from my own experience. I only get the bad insomnia when I have totally gone off zoloft, not while I am titrating down, so it still could be that even though she hasn't had that experience in the past.

Keep talking to the doctors and letting them know this isn't working. And, if she is talking about suicide, or IF you think she could be thinking it, going to the ER and having her admitted while they sort out her meds could be an option.

[FatherTryingToHelp]

Still hanging in there, still bumpy.

No longer taking the Paxil, since it seemed to be driving her back to Mania, not sure about anything else anymore, some days are good (friday seemed okay) some days are really bad (today for example) some days are inbetween (yesterday) still trying to reduce the seroquil, not sure how much luck we're having, while getting down to 50mg seemed relatively easy, lowering beyond that is proving hard. In theory she's down to 25, although with an option to take half a pill more (so about 37), once again saying goodbye to me today because she feels different and doesn't think she'll get through this, and I, I just don't know what to say anymore.

Trying to keep us both somewhat "busy and occupied" during the day, having the 16 month old toddling around helps with that but... gah, I hate it. The insomnia isn't so much "can't sleep" it's more (nowadays) of a never feeling tired, never feeling like sleeping, and never feeling refreshed when she wakes, no idea if that's normal, or totally abnormal. Almost went to the ER today, wife was talking about how she feels totally disconnected (although, as with everything else, it comes, and goes) and feels she could hurt herself, or our son, or me, it sounds like "by accident" but part of it also seems to be a "feeling so disconnected that the care isn't there".

I sometimes wonder if a mental hospital might not be the right place, at least there someone could watch my wife 24/7 and see what she's really like, I feel she does a good job still of "putting on a brave face" sometimes when talking to Dr Bennett, or when seeing her doc, and while she doesn't mean to, she doesn't tell them the entire truth, or facts, or whatever you want to call it.

Anyway, just dropping in again, someday I hope to be posting "she's better, we are free of this horrific illness, free to help educate others on it, free to do everything we can to make sure others don't needlessly suffer" but for today, it's just a continuation of the mess.

[mom0810]

First off, I am really really sorry that this is happening.

Second, I think that you are right and that she may need to be admitted so that someone can really observe her 24/7.

Are you aware that if someone actually IS bipolar that ssri's, like Paxil, will make them more manic? I really am wondering based on some of your posts, since two different ssri's have made her more manic, if bipolar is more of what is going on here and that was somehow triggered by having the baby? Could that be possible?

I think that maybe YOU need to call Shoshanna or forward her some of your posts from here and have her get some insight in to what is actually happening. SHe is there to help both of you. My therapist has an understanding that, should my husband or my mom notice anything about me that seems I am going "downhill" again, that they have to call her themselves. Because for the very reason you said, if I am feeling good during my session but then go home and fall apart, there is no way my therapist is going to know about it.

If the Seroquel was helping, that seems like a red flag to me. Like maybe her condition is more serious than PPD and more involved as far as meds and therapy have to go.

Please keep coming for support. All of us here remember you and want to know how you are doing.

[FatherTryingToHelp]

I have considered it, but am not sure, I guess I sort of discounted Bipolar simply because the doc had said it wasn't that, was just that SSRI's seem to cause mania in the better half.

Anyway, she's calling the "stand-in" doc today (regular doc is on vacation) which actually may help since the substitute is someone that my wife wanted to see in the first place, just that they weren't taking new patients at the time. Second opinion and all that, I may try to get in contact with Shoshanna if it doesn't calm down in the next week or so, always difficult around the time when meds are being changed, and that's where we are at present.

It also SEEMS to be PPD based on what Shoshanna sees, knows, she seems to know before my wife tells her all the things she might have done, and how it comes and goes (I gather that's something that really only happens with PPD).