Baby Brother's Naptime = Rejection for Older Brother-- Can you troubleshoot with me?

[HoneyTree]

I have a 3 yr. 9 mo. boy and a 7 mo. boy. The 7 mo. boy is highly distractable and needs real quiet to nurse down at nap time. The 3 year old needs me, period--as much as he can get. The problem is that when I lay down with the baby, the 3 year old becomes loud and active and nap time becomes impossible.

When we go for a "family quiet time" (his suggestion, and one I was very much looking forward to!), the 3 year old can lay down with us for about a minute, then (as one would expect), becomes fidgety and wants to talk, poke at the baby, jump on the bed, etc.

He's very articulate about his needs: "Mama, I just don't like you to leave me. I want to be in there with you."

I've tried a dozen ways to explain it and work with both our needs in very kind, concrete terms--the baby needs ten minutes to lay down quietly, then I can come out and play loudly with you for twenty minutes; as soon as he falls asleep, we can play with _______ (some favorite toy or game) together; I'll leave the door open and you can read books in the doorway until I come out, then we can play; etc. But he seems to be taking this as a rejection, and distraction and reasoning don't seem to touch it.

Some days I can avoid the problem all together because the baby falls asleep unexpectedly (in the car, on a walk, etc.), but this doesn't always work because when he's ready to go down, he gets really fussy and agitated. HE really needs the quiet down-time.

I guess I don't need to tell you that I'm home alone, so I'm looking for a one-person solution to meeting both their needs.

TIA for your help!

[oneluvmama]

(((hugs)))) mama!

I wish I had more then just a hug, but I really don't have any constructive advice because I am in the exact same boat with my girls.

I have resorted to turning on the tv lately and I am not happy with that solution. It only works occasionally anyway. I know a lot of mama's who read to the older while they nurse the younger down, but that doesn't work for me because dd2 will jump up and try to get involved in the reading. She can't tune dd1 out at all, so any interaction causes a complete naptime breakdown.

[Snuzzmom]

:

[kreyno4]

Sometimes it works for us to set the 3 yo up with books on CD and a snack--I feel better about the books on CD than about DVDs which are really the only other way my 3 year old will be quiet (and sometimes I do have to do DVDs, if it takes multiple attempts to get the baby down!).

Alternatively, special toy(s) that he only gets to play with when you are putting baby down.

Family quiet time only works for us if my 3 yo is also going to sleep (which she sometimes still does).

[hempmama]

I think I take issue with phrasing this as a need. He doesn't *need* to be with you actively engaged every second of every day. He *wants* to be engaged with you. And I wonder if he wants it all the time, or more when baby brother has a need? Does he ever play by himself? I am assuming he does, because I think most kids that age do, but maybe he doesn't.

IMO, this is the start of sibling rivalry, and it's healthy for him to see you will not sacrifice the baby's sleep to his (perfectly natural) desire to have all of mama, be number one, all the time. I think it's ok if he gets upset. I would validate his feelings, explain how the faster he helps you, by giving you quiet, the faster you will get to fun 3yo and mama time. And then go put the baby to sleep.

[Valval]

Maybe you can set up a special box with some sort of quiet activity that you change daily that he is only allowed to get out while you are getting the baby settled.
You could try a rotating stash of stickers, stamps, stencils, dot paints, clay, water colors, or whatever you know may float his boat. Make a semi big deal out of him being able to get his very special box out to see what surprise mommy put in for him while you get his brother to sleep so, as a pp put it, you can join him for his special Mama time.
It may buy you some time. If he decides he needs your help maybe you could suggest that you would like to be surprised by something he makes for you. Make a big deal about saving or taking a picture of whatever he creates by himself while Mama is not their standing by his side.

[LianneM]

My 2nd is the same way, needing quiet to take a nap. A small interruption and it's over, she's up, and we have to start all over. It's awful.

My 4.5 year old has a really hard time with it too. It works out best if I suggest something for him to do while I'm in with the baby, and also suggest something we'll do together AFTER she's asleep and he's waited for me. It doesn't always work, but it's the most successful strategy I have right now. I sometimes let him watch tv, but more often set him up with a computer game. I always tell him that I really appreciate his cooperation after he's waited and we do whatever I had mentioned earlier that he was looking forward to.

HTH a little. You're not alone!

[Limabean1975]

This same problem is fast approaching for us. DD is getting more sensitive (she's 12 weeks old. In her first 10 weeks she'd sleep through anything).
Related to that, we have the issue of her not sleeping well when out & about, and him needing lots of out & about time to sleep later.

[Dandelionkid]

Originally Posted by Valval

Maybe you can set up a special box with some sort of quiet activity that you change daily that he is only allowed to get out while you are getting the baby settled.
You could try a rotating stash of stickers, stamps, stencils, dot paints, clay, water colors, or whatever you know may float his boat. Make a semi big deal out of him being able to get his very special box out to see what surprise mommy put in for him while you get his brother to sleep so, as a pp put it, you can join him for his special Mama time.
It may buy you some time. If he decides he needs your help maybe you could suggest that you would like to be surprised by something he makes for you. Make a big deal about saving or taking a picture of whatever he creates by himself while Mama is not their standing by his side.

I like the special toy idea. My dd is older (5) but we let her play computer games only during her brothers nap time. She loves it. If it was a REALLY cool new toy my ds(3) might be persuaded to stay out of the room. Or how about a cartoon every quiet time (and maybe ONLY at quiet time?)

[denimtiger]

I agree with the ideas about a special activity that is reserved only for baby brother's naptime, even if it is a DVD or a computer game.

I also agree with hempmama that being engaged with you every second of every day is not a need. Baby brother, however, needs the down time and the nap. It's probably hard adjusting to having two, for both you and ds1. But it is reality now, and you're not doing any of you any favors if ds1 doesn't learn that it's an expectation that, on occasion, baby brother gets his needs met, period. I'm not saying I'd be ungentle about it, but you can convey that during this time ds1 is fully expected to be out of the room and having fun by himself until baby brother falls asleep.

All of the negotiating and trying to come up with a solution together with a resistant three year old is just conveying the message to ds1 that there is some option here where he can get what he wants. Since all he really wants is your full and undivided attention, and you can't give that to him, IMO it's deceptive to convey that option to him.

If you want to problem-solve with him, I would suggest framing the conversation more in terms of, "which one of these fun activities would you like to do by yourself at baby brother's naptime today?"

It IS a rejection of what he wants. It just IS, but part of being human is to learn how to deal with a rejection of what we want sometimes. However, you sound like an extremely caring attached mama, and he's not going to take it as a rejection of himSELF if you kindly and firmly ensure that his baby brother's needs are met. More likely, he'll see your gentle affirmativeness (subconsciously) as confirmation that you can be strong enough to set boundaries with both boys so that everyone's NEEDS are met.

And, of course, do reward him with special one-on-one time when he has abided by the boundaries you have set, and help him understand that because he let you put baby to sleep in peace, you now have the time and energy for it.

[newbymom05]

Wow, really good advice! Here's what works w/ my 4 y/o and 15 mo old. We moved a twin mattress on the floor by my king. If big bro doesn't want to watch tv or play or get on the computer, he brings a book and lies next to us. I have a fan for white noise and that helps. DS on the bed w/ us just never worked no matter how quiet he was. With him next to us (and lower), not such a problem. If you don't have a mattress, maybe a special comfy area?

We would be tv free if it weren't for naps. It's def the hardest part of our day. I agree with what the last poster wrote, but for me, 3-4 was a very clingy stage with a lot of new fears (being alone being one of them), and having a new baby didn't help. While I agree that sibs need to learn to respect other's needs as part of being a family, for me it's easier to let him stay in the room with us as long as he can respect our need for quiet.

[HoneyTree]

Mamas, thank you, thank you, thank you, for the perspectives and the practical solution. I know meeting everyone's needs exactly as they expect isn't possible, but these ideas really helped me to feel more secure in my place as the negotiator/boundary reinforcer/caregiver-to-both roles.

The fan for white noise = genius. We do this EVERY time the baby sleeps now.

The mattress on the floor is going well, too.

We have used PBS cartoons, and honestly, the whole TV thing is not nearly as bad as I thought. It is REALLY working out for us, especially after the baby falls asleep and then big bro gets to fill me in on SuperWhy or Word World or whatever for our together time. Inevitably the TV goes off and he wants to act out the shows. So win-win.

I am at the library ATM, so am going to check out the books on tape section. That has the additional bonus of being a new thing for us. And I'm actively compiling forgotten toys to be put in the "naptime box."

Thanks again for your great suggestions!!