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CDC wants US circ program - Page 2

post #21 of 112
This is nuts. Being European, the whole circ-pushing thing is just something I so do not understand. Living in America with a baby/child is in so many ways annoying: the pushing of circs for boys, the push for vaccinations and non-acceptance of having a choice there, the CIO crap, the tough love crap.... Whenever I tell my parents what's considered normal here they are mortified and say that's how they were brought up post world war II. It's like they are one generation behind here (sorry don't wanna be offensive, but I am truly shocked by many practices).
My parents were totally horrified when they heard about circ - it is just that uncommon!!!
The CDC is not my favorite organization exactly. I wonder how many lobby groups and coops are involved in this crap (sorry for the swearing, but it makes me angry!). So many undecided and not well-informed parents will circ their poor little boys.
post #22 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by nia82 View Post
This is nuts. Being European, the whole circ-pushing thing is just something I so do not understand. Living in America with a baby/child is in so many ways annoying: the pushing of circs for boys, the push for vaccinations and non-acceptance of having a choice there, the CIO crap, the tough love crap.... Whenever I tell my parents what's considered normal here they are mortified and say that's how they were brought up post world war II. It's like they are one generation behind here (sorry don't wanna be offensive, but I am truly shocked by many practices).
My parents were totally horrified when they heard about circ - it is just that uncommon!!!
And people wonder why the rest of the world hates Americans...

Quote:
The CDC is not my favorite organization exactly. I wonder how many lobby groups and coops are involved in this crap (sorry for the swearing, but it makes me angry!). So many undecided and not well-informed parents will circ their poor little boys.
The CDC is, IME, a lobby group.
There is emerging evidence to prove that they have worked together with greedy doctors and Big Pharma to push costly and unneccessary procedures (i.e. circ) on the (purposefully) uneducated people.
Ever wonder why products like Viagra, KY jelly and Enzyte are so virally popular in the US? It's obvious- doctors intentionally cause problems (via circ, in this case) that they (or others) can profit from treating later. It all operates on the same principle as the whole H1N1 mess (slightly OT, sorry if you want to ban me).
Also, there's the pressing issue of the leftover cut-off foreskins being sold to biotech companies who then extract fibroblast cells and market them in anti-aging cosmetics. Dr. Patricia Wexler openly admitted to using foreskin byproducts in her cosmetic line (which is unfortunately available at Bath & Body Works) on Oprah.
post #23 of 112
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nia82 View Post
This is nuts. Being European, the whole circ-pushing thing is just something I so do not understand. Living in America with a baby/child is in so many ways annoying: the pushing of circs for boys, the push for vaccinations and non-acceptance of having a choice there, the CIO crap, the tough love crap.... Whenever I tell my parents what's considered normal here they are mortified and say that's how they were brought up post world war II. It's like they are one generation behind here (sorry don't wanna be offensive, but I am truly shocked by many practices).
My parents were totally horrified when they heard about circ - it is just that uncommon!!!
The CDC is not my favorite organization exactly. I wonder how many lobby groups and coops are involved in this crap (sorry for the swearing, but it makes me angry!). So many undecided and not well-informed parents will circ their poor little boys.
That's interesting.
My grandmother (or Oma) grew up during WWII. She married a man in US air force, my grandpa (how was interestingly enough, born at home and intact), but a large portion of my extended family still live in Bavaria. They do not understand why this is such a big cause for me. They have a hard time even believing RIC is commonplace in the US it just seems crazy to them.
post #24 of 112
I didn't know at all that the CDC was pro circ. I thought there wasn't a medical organization in the world that endorsed RIC.
post #25 of 112
I can't even articulate how angry this all makes me. Thanks for all the links - I will come back and study them when I have a little more time.
post #26 of 112
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belle View Post
I didn't know at all that the CDC was pro circ. I thought there wasn't a medical organization in the world that endorsed RIC.
Due to the highly publicized circ/HIV studies in Africa and their proclaimed success, I guess the CDC is now seeing circ as a means to reduce HIV in the US.

I have my own questions about this,...

1. Wasnt it stated that circ would only work to reduce HIV in developing countries not industrialized? Why then are they pushing it here?
2. What currently is the highest HIV/AIDs demographic in the USA? Those studies claimed circ only protected against Female to Male penile/vaginal transmission and later showed no protection from male to female transmission.
3. Wasnt the CDC in the process of creating a statement on circ (following the lead of the AAP)? Why are they already discussing a pretty clear position at this conference?
post #27 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by ursaminor View Post
That's interesting.
My grandmother (or Oma) grew up during WWII. She married a man in US air force, my grandpa (how was interestingly enough, born at home and intact), but a large portion of my extended family still live in Bavaria. They do not understand why this is such a big cause for me. They have a hard time even believing RIC is commonplace in the US it just seems crazy to them.
I am commenting on the bolded portion. I've attended the Genital Integrity Awareness Week demonstration in Washington DC for the past several years. It is held at end of March/beginning of April to coincide with the anniversary of the federal female genital integrity law and the beginning of child abuse prevention week. It is also the start of the Cherry Blossom Festival, which brings many tourists to the city. Many of the foreigners who visit don't understand what we are there for. They think we are just pushing our right to free speech to outlandish topics just because we have the legal right to free speech in America. When you talk to them and get them to understand that this really happens in America, that well over 80% of babies born in the 7o's and 80's are circumcised and that it's now about 50/50, they are stunned. It really shatters their image of the USA as being progressive and intelligent. I've seen many a head shake on the shoulders of non US residents in utter disbelief that circumcision of newborn babies happens on a routine basis.
post #28 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by TCA2008 View Post
The CDC has been working hard to "remove financial barriers" to circumcision (in other words, get all Medicaid programs to pay), and has been working on their official guidelines and recommendations.

.
I don't see this happening in today's economy.
post #29 of 112
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by PuppyFluffer View Post
I am commenting on the bolded portion. I've attended the Genital Integrity Awareness Week demonstration in Washington DC for the past several years. It is held at end of March/beginning of April to coincide with the anniversary of the federal female genital integrity law and the beginning of child abuse prevention week. It is also the start of the Cherry Blossom Festival, which brings many tourists to the city. Many of the foreigners who visit don't understand what we are there for. They think we are just pushing our right to free speech to outlandish topics just because we have the legal right to free speech in America. When you talk to them and get them to understand that this really happens in America, that well over 80% of babies born in the 7o's and 80's are circumcised and that it's now about 50/50, they are stunned. It really shatters their image of the USA as being progressive and intelligent. I've seen many a head shake on the shoulders of non US residents in utter disbelief that circumcision of newborn babies happens on a routine basis.
Yeah totally know what you mean. I was at GIAW, in 2004 (if my memory serves me right), and one memorable conversation I had was with a South Korean man who was on a tour of DC. For all who dont know, South Korea adopted circumcision after US presence in their country and now nearly universally circ in early adolescence or adulthood. Anyway, the man spoke to me pretty candidly about how he really felt violated by the circumcision he endured in his early teen and that he would never want any future sons to go through that. It was just interesting talking with someone who expressed an intactivist view from a country with an even higher circ rate then our own.
I really hope to be able to get the GIAW next year.
post #30 of 112
I am attending the CDC HIV Prevention Conference. It began this evening. It seems plain to me that the CDC intends to recommend infants be circed to "prevent" HIV and other STDs. I will be asking hard questions. But I believe Dr. Kilmarx and others are very much in favor of circ. The NY Times just came out with an article on the conference. It indicates the AAP will find the benefits outweigh the risks. This is what Edgar Schoen has been pushing for. It is very important that everyone sign the Intact America CDC petition and it is very important that everyone write the AAP expressing dismay if ethics should be ignored and MGM should be essentially endorsed.
post #31 of 112
I feel sick in the pit of my stomach reading your update Dave! I've signed and will write letters....
post #32 of 112
post #33 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by PuppyFluffer View Post
I feel sick in the pit of my stomach reading your update Dave! I've signed and will write letters....
I signed too, but my gut tells me it's not gonna work... :

I'm so glad I decided to leave the USA when I graduate from college. I will NEVER give birth to or raise children in a country where MGM is required by law.
post #34 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quirky View Post

That makes me very very angry.
post #35 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quirky View Post
Wow, I just posted that link to my FB wall with this caption:

"Condoms and safe sex practices, not routine infant circumcision, prevent the transmission of HIV. Babies are not having sex. To give the impression that being circumcised somehow gives extra protection against HIV is counterproductive and dangerous.

Signed,

Dr. Obvious"
post #36 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quirky View Post
God. :

To say this is disheartening would be too little. The lobbyists and policymakers in our country's health agencies make me sick.

The article itself was actual a little even-handed. Intact America's POV wasn't dismissed as "radical" for once.
post #37 of 112
We need medical organizations from intact countries to stand up to this "research." So far, the only org that's been consistent has been the medical organization from Tasmania. But where's Britain? France? Spain? Italy? Brazil? Mexico? Japan? China??? Anybody?
post #38 of 112
It's late at night; so, I will try to make this post short, lol. The news so far is not the best, but it's not bad either. The gist of this, to put into perspective, is nothing new. The basic message of the CDC/AAP seems to be that the benefits MAY outweigh the risk. All of us who have been following the HIV/circ. connection closely have known all along that something like this may come out from the CDC/AAP. What's interesting and very encouraging, however, is that the ethical considerations and problems with the medical science are given weight in this article, which I think is really important. In other words, the message of Intact America and its sister organizations is getting out. Furthermore, I see that people seem to be turning away from circumcision, at least that's the mood on the internet, which I think is great. To me it's clear that there are people out there who want federal money to back their research and programs, even if that research is highly questionable. The CDC, AAP, AMA, you name it, are political organizations, and their decisions have as much to do with politics and economics as they do with health care. I think we should examine such news within the greater health debate context that is happening right now. With an ailing economy and growing debt, it's clear that this nation needs to cut unnecessary spending and restructure current programs if we are serious about true health care reform. Obviously, doing away with cosmetic surgeries is a great start.
post #39 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by Papai View Post
We need medical organizations from intact countries to stand up to this "research." So far, the only org that's been consistent has been the medical organization from Tasmania. But where's Britain? France? Spain? Italy? Brazil? Mexico? Japan? China??? Anybody?
That would be nice. Please help us.

My (momentarily paranoid nature) insecurities tell me that the countries who value the intact male are using this opportunity to sneer with great joy at the fact (thought) that we're being attacked. Knives are meeting the American newborn genitals. Violence at its very best.
post #40 of 112
Deleted post b/c just realized someone already posted the link to the NY Times article.
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