6 yo homeschooler paino and perfection

[completebeginnings]

I have a 6 yo dd who after years of begging began to take piano lessons. She loves it. She is always excited to go to lessons and I rarely have the remind her to practice.
The problem is this:
She sits down to practice her pieces(usually 4 to 10 pieces a week) and the teacher asks that she play each of them 3 times every time she practices. DD starts out well then gets stressed and overwhelmed and will start to cry. She will sit for hours at the piano and cry and play. I tell her she can stop and take a brake, give her hugs, and have talked to her about waiting until she is older(which leads to hours of sobbing about how she loves it). It dosen't seem to help. She is such a perfectionist and so hard on herself. She will play a song and then just sit and cry for 10 min. then play it again. So an activity that should take 15 minutes takes over an hour.

I just feel so bad for her but she is adamant about not wanting to quit. She is such a good kid. We follow a pretty lax curriculum that is very child guided and I have never put a lot of pressure on her as far as academics is concerned. She is very self driven and reads at a 3rd grade level and does very well with everything else.

I just don't know how to help her..do I let her keep working through this or do I pull her and maybe start again later?

[skueppers]

I would talk to the teacher. Perhaps she could talk with your daughter about it, or provide different instructions that would work better for her.

[Lillian J]

Originally Posted by skueppers

I would talk to the teacher. Perhaps she could talk with your daughter about it, or provide different instructions that would work better for her.

And if it were me, I'd tell her not to assign so many pieces - it's clearly creating overwhelm, which is not what the teacher intended. And if she's even the least bit unconcerned, I'd get a new teacher right away. I actually had to read the part about the assignments twice to make sure I'd read it right - 4 to 10 pieces is an awful lot. - Lillian

[Laurel]

I totally agree, that is a huge number of pieces! When I taught piano, I assigned maybe 3-4 a week at the very most.

My son is a perfectionist too. I found that in teaching him piano and also in helping him with homework (he's currently in public school) that he would get extremely stressed if he made a mistake, and that could lead to a huge meltdown. The meltdown in turn would cause more mistakes and more frustration to the point where he couldn't even focus at all. I usually would sit with him while he practiced and offer positive encouragement.

I would keep working through it for now, because I think it could be a good opportunity to teach her how to relax and deal with pressure. I did eventually have my son stop piano, but that was because he came to a point where he just wasn't ready for the material. It doesn't sound like that is the case for your dd. You could help her learn some relaxation techniques to use during practice. Perhaps instead of playing the pieces all the way through, she could practice in small sections, that way there isn't the pressure of having to play the whole piece "perfect".

[Bird Girl]

I have a seven-year-old who has been taking Suzuki violin lessons for about 3.5 years, and I can assure you that what you are seeing can be very normal. Many children have an idea in their heads about what they wish to sound like, and without practice, they do not sound like that. The difference is overwhelmingly upsetting to them.

I would try sitting with your daughter at practice time, and if she begins to cry, give her a five minute time-out to collect herself. (I don't mean punish her, but ask her to step away from the piano until she's no longer crying.) Explain to her that practicing is a form of learning, and that she cannot learn when she's so overwhelmed that she is crying. You could also assure her that learning to play an instrument is a step-by-step process, and that the more she practices, the better she sounds. Reviewing older pieces, and focusing on how much better they sound is a big part of this.

Hang in there. It sounds like your daughter has a lot of drive and passion, and it can serve her very well.

[Lillian J]

I should add that my son started piano lessons a lot older than that, and he had maybe two or three ~very simple pieces~ to practice each week. Same with myself. There's no reason why a child her age should have so much to practice that she's not able to feel good about what she's playing and be able to play it well after a bit of practice. I wonder if the teacher is possibly getting overly zealous because of having such an enthusiastic student - but she (the teacher) really needs to be reigned in. Lillian

[umbrella]

I have a perfectionist, and it's really hard on her. Piano is also a source of stress for her at times, though this is an issue which has generally eased up some as she matures.

I do think you should work with the teacher to reduce her load, or perhaps even enroll her in a group class, so she can have the perspective of what's normal.

[tankgirl73]

Wow, I am a professional piano teacher, and the only time I can think of assigning that many pieces is when a more advanced student is coming close to an exam or a festival... Usually, 2-4 would be the average, MAYBE 5 in certain situations (depending on the pieces, the week, the kid, etc).

Has the teacher given her clear instructions as to how to practice? More detailed than just "3 times through". How to deal with problems. Games to make it fun. How to find errors and fix them. How to keep going when it's hard. Basic plan of attack (plow through the whole thing to practice reading? Break it into small pieces to work on fluency and details? Work away from the piano first? Tap the rhythm separately? Say note names while playing? Trace the shape of the melody with a coloured pencil?) or just "play the piece"?

So many teachers really don't give a second thought to how to practice when that really should be the #1 thing we teach. They just say 'okay, here's your pieces, now go home and learn them' and the kid is left to figure out how.

Some kids naturally do figure it out, other kids need their hand held step by step through a practice session. There are many ways to go about this... But first we'd need to know precisely what the teacher has told her to do. Also, which method books is she using? And how long has she been taking these lessons?

(And I'm tempted to also ask what the teacher's credentials are... since so many "piano teachers" are really not qualified, but out of potential professional courtesy I shall refrain *coff* *ahem*)

[AAK]

Just wanted to chime in also to say that 4-10 pieces is way too much!

Our piano teacher convinced me to start with group lessons and then move on to private. I can't say how wonderful the advise was! My dd had group lessons for 3 years--the teacher was very good at "grouping" the kids so that it was a fun environment. She used high end digital pianos with head sets so that they weren't just waiting in line to play the piano. Now, dd has just started her 4th year and is going private, but I think that would have been too stressful in the beginning.

Also, sometimes the teachers don't realize they have a perfectionist on hand. Telling a child specifically to practice 3 times for each piece doesn't sound like a bad thing, but for my dd it was. I spoke with the piano teacher about it and she reworded. Sometimes the piece was too difficult to start off playing straight through for my dd, so we would do one line at a time until it sounded right (or one page, or one part, depending on what made sense with the piece). Mostly though, practice wasn't ordered for my perfectionist. She didn't want to look bad at class and was self motivated. She also got to feel victorious when she conquered a big or difficult piece.

When everything comes easy to a child, coming across challenges can be a blessing. They learn to deal with them while they have the support of a parent at home.

Amy

[moominmamma]

If they're little primer-book pieces, some of which are not new that week, a half dozen doesn't seem like too many pieces for a keen student. Maybe my kids are weird but that's about what they had on their plates as beginning piano students.

You need a totally different way of practicing, though. Strategies from your teacher, creative games, small steps and so on. Some piano-specific things that are helpful:

Play 'ghost piano' with the lid closed. Don't open the lid and play the notes until 'ghosting' is easy.

Start with the last bar, not the first. When she can do that easily, do the last two bars. Etc.

Play hands separately, two to four bars at a time. Don't move beyond that until it's easy.

Divide the piece into six sections and roll a die to choose which section to play. This makes the "small steps" work more enjoyable.

Roll dice to choose how many times to play a section. Same idea as above. And there's the dice to blame if she rolls a 12.

Get her to teach you how to play the piece or section.

Get her to sing each hand ... using "la", or solfege, or note-names, or finger-numbers, or beat counts, or all of these.

Encourage your dd to "throw mistakes away." Cut up a bunch of white and black scraps of paper and lay them on the piano in a heap. Play a section. If it has a mistake, get her to take a black square and crumple it up and throw it in a wastepaper basket. Ooh, that feels better! Then try again. More mistakes? More paper-crumpling. Throw 'em away and move on to the next try. If she gets a correct try, start a pile of white papers. This also sends the message that there are numerous mistakes that are a normal and inevitable part of learning. They're there on the piano as black papers. You've just got to work through them. Eventually you have mostly white papers left -- the passage played the correct way. That's learning -- working through the mistakes.

Ask before she starts -- how many mistakes is she willing to accept before getting upset? She should play the piece or the passage a maximum of that many times. Use counters to track the mistakes -- put four game pieces out if she's said she'll let herself make four mistakes before getting upset. Stop her after she's tallied three of the counters. "Enough for today!"

And above all -- talk to the teacher. The most important thing music students learn during the first year or two is not how to play but how to practice. The principle of repetition is a good one, but it sounds like your teacher is not giving your dd guidance in how to break problems down and work through mistakes.

Miranda

[justthinkn]

Originally Posted by moominmamma

If they're little primer-book pieces, some of which are not new that week, a half dozen doesn't seem like too many pieces for a keen student. Maybe my kids are weird but that's about what they had on their plates as beginning piano students.

You need a totally different way of practicing, though. Strategies from your teacher, creative games, small steps and so on. Some piano-specific things that are helpful:

Play 'ghost piano' with the lid closed. Don't open the lid and play the notes until 'ghosting' is easy.

Start with the last bar, not the first. When she can do that easily, do the last two bars. Etc.

Play hands separately, two to four bars at a time. Don't move beyond that until it's easy.

Divide the piece into six sections and roll a die to choose which section to play. This makes the "small steps" work more enjoyable.

Roll dice to choose how many times to play a section. Same idea as above. And there's the dice to blame if she rolls a 12.

Get her to teach you how to play the piece or section.

Get her to sing each hand ... using "la", or solfege, or note-names, or finger-numbers, or beat counts, or all of these.

Encourage your dd to "throw mistakes away." Cut up a bunch of white and black scraps of paper and lay them on the piano in a heap. Play a section. If it has a mistake, get her to take a black square and crumple it up and throw it in a wastepaper basket. Ooh, that feels better! Then try again. More mistakes? More paper-crumpling. Throw 'em away and move on to the next try. If she gets a correct try, start a pile of white papers. This also sends the message that there are numerous mistakes that are a normal and inevitable part of learning. They're there on the piano as black papers. You've just got to work through them. Eventually you have mostly white papers left -- the passage played the correct way. That's learning -- working through the mistakes.

Ask before she starts -- how many mistakes is she willing to accept before getting upset? She should play the piece or the passage a maximum of that many times. Use counters to track the mistakes -- put four game pieces out if she's said she'll let herself make four mistakes before getting upset. Stop her after she's tallied three of the counters. "Enough for today!"

And above all -- talk to the teacher. The most important thing music students learn during the first year or two is not how to play but how to practice. The principle of repetition is a good one, but it sounds like your teacher is not giving your dd guidance in how to break problems down and work through mistakes.

Miranda

Wow!

[completebeginnings]

Thanks for all the good ideas. I will definitely implement some of the practicing ideas. I think she is getting a few too many pieces as well. Her teacher is actually really good. BA in music and has been teaching for about 15 years. I need to meet with her one on one. A different teacher would also mean a 30 min. drive each direction. I also like her since she homeschooled her kids.

thanks again for all the ideas. I will let you know how this week goes.

[Laurel]

Originally Posted by moominmamma

If they're little primer-book pieces, some of which are not new that week, a half dozen doesn't seem like too many pieces for a keen student.

As a teacher, I wouldn't have had time to listen to that many pieces, even at primer level. Especially if a piece needed extra help or we we wanted to do something creative with it. I would still need time to introduce new concepts and new pieces, throw in some theory and other skills, etc. I definitely would not have had time in the 30 minute lessons I taught, and it would have been pushing it even in a 45 minute lesson.

I love your practice ideas, though! I may need to use some of them when I start teaching my ds again!